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Old September 24, 2011, 12:17 PM   #1
jenboy
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relatively new to reloading, need help with 22-250

Hello all,
I'm relatively new to reloading and as such only have 2 manuals. Anyway, I want to work up a couple loads for my 22-250. I have one load ready to go using varget and 55gr v-max but wanted to try 55 gr Nosler balistic tip boat tails using h 380. Unfortunely my manuals do not give any data for that combo. I'm using cci large rifle primers. As I'm new I always start at the minimum and work up in .5 increments. As I get close to max I cut that to .2 increments. I also load to the manuals specified OAL as I'm not comfortable experimenting with getting closer to the lands yet. I was hoping somebody could give me the data for the min and max powder charge. Any help and or suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Thank you.
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Old September 24, 2011, 01:11 PM   #2
A_Gamehog
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Welcome to the forum,

Nosler book #6

H380- 35.5 min 39.5*max 3736 fps 98% filling

* denotes the most accurate load was 39.5 work up to it.

The 55 V-max has the flat base and it's what I use. Varget or IMR 4064 are better and cleaner burning. One thing is your twist rate, that dictates the bullets you can accurately use. The longer V-Max may not shoot in a 1-14 twist. I would say try it anyway. The new Hornady 53 V-max has a .290 BC it also needs a 1-12 twist to shoot. Don't go on weight, go on length. The 50 grain Barnes Varmint Grenade won't shoot in a 1-14 either. It's too long. It's as long as a 69 Sierra Matchking.

Use your manuals to improve your loading technique. E.G. a sticky bolt lift indicates excessive pressure, as does a cratered or flat primer. Seat your loads to the book COL. Then experiment with seating depth to get your most accurate load.
To work up "the load" I use the OCW method by Dan Newberry. Never fails.

http://practicalrifler.6.forumer.com/index.php

http://www.nosler.com/Reloading-Data...55-Grains.aspx
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Last edited by A_Gamehog; September 24, 2011 at 01:26 PM.
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Old September 24, 2011, 01:28 PM   #3
mrawesome22
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data.hodgdon.com Lots of loads there.

I would also suggest Imr4064. Try it with some 50 grain pills for chrono nirvana

I have found H380 to be dirty and sub par when it comes to velocity in the Varminter. Much better options out there. Imr4007ssc would be another I would recommend. Great accuracy with great velocity and good case fill which I am a big supporter of. Takes powder position out of the equation.
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Old September 24, 2011, 01:33 PM   #4
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And I have to disagree with gamehog. In my testing, all flat primers prove is that you have excessive headspace. If you measure and set up your dies to just push the shoulder back 3 thousands or so, flat primers become s thing of the past. Hard bolt lift will show up, but the primers will look fine.
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Old September 24, 2011, 04:35 PM   #5
Kevin Rohrer
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36gr of IMR4064 w/ the 55gr V-max is near maximum and *very* accurate.
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Old September 24, 2011, 06:55 PM   #6
wncchester
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" 55 gr Nosler balistic tip boat tails using h 380. Unfortunely my manuals do not give any data for that combo."

Actually, I suspect they do. Loading data is generic by powder type and bullet weight, any info for a 55 gr. bullet and H-380 is all you need. Fact is, we don't need loading data for specific bullets, if that were true there are a LOT of bullets we couldn't load! There is no simple component change we can make to any book data that comes close to equaling the effect of our rifle being different from the book maker's.

Ball powders like H-380 can shoot as well as any but tubulars do tend to be a little easier to find a good load with. "Pet loads" for anything are a forelorn hope. I would give you my best loads but if you used them you would only be loading for my rifle and that wouldn't do you any good. If you want to know what works best in YOUR rifle you will just have to experiment like the rest of us do.

Flat primers are a laughably poor indicator of excess pressure. "Flat primers" had meaning when reloading was young because primers in those days had concave/rounded tops and it took a lot of pressure to flatten 'em. But the cap design changed to pre-flatted tops in the late 60s and primers have had flat tops ever since. As mentioned above, truly flattened primers - square shouldered - are most commonly from excess "case headspace", usually from overly enthusastic FL sizing, rather than anything wrong with the rifle or load.

Last edited by wncchester; September 24, 2011 at 07:07 PM.
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Old September 25, 2011, 12:51 PM   #7
jenboy
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Thank you all for your imput. I know I'll have to experiment like everyone but I did not know you could exchange bullets in the data. (given same weight etc.). As I mentioned I'm pretty new to this and want to be as safe as possible with limited experience. FYI, I shot yesterday with varget behind 55gr vmax. I went from the minimum load up to 35.5gr (about half way to max which is 37) and did not have very good results. I've now loaded 36, 36.5,36.8 and 37gr to see if things improve with this paticular combo. As I've read on here and many other places it seems most 22-250's shoot better at the upper end of the powder charge. Hope that holds true with my rifle. Given your suggestions I'll try varget and the nosler bullets next as I already have the powder, then try some of the powders you all listed above. I'll go to the H380 last in an effort to shoot better/cleaner powders. Once again, thank you guys for your help. Anymore suggestions on identifying excess pressure or anything else a "newby" should be aware of would be greatly appriciated!

Last edited by jenboy; September 25, 2011 at 12:58 PM.
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Old September 25, 2011, 02:13 PM   #8
rrp
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22-250 load with h-380

Both my Rem and Savage 22-250's shot very well with 55gr ballistic tip, using 38gr of h-380. Your rifle may be different, so it is best to work up a couple of your own test rounds. Good luck.
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Old September 25, 2011, 03:07 PM   #9
wncchester
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"Anymore suggestions on identifying excess pressure or anything else a "newby" should be aware of would be greatly appriciated!"

First, I'm sure you don't mean you change your OAL in half inch increments but I don't know what you do mean. IF you find the actual max OAL length your rifle will feed and accept you may safely start load development 20 thou (more or less, it's not critical) off the lands. AFTER you do charge tests to find what your rig prefers you can seat deeper in maybe 5 thou steps to find the best OAL. Most factory rifles seem to shoot best in the range of maybe 25 to 60 thou off the lands, sometimes as much as 3 times that. (Don't sweat the often heard warnings about seating deeper making pressures rise, that's true in some handgun cartridges but the reverse is true in rifles, letting a bullet get a running start before hitting the rifling actually decrease the pressure of a given charge, that's why it's best to start testing seated long.)

Understand that NO manual can tell you the max charge for YOUR rifle, they can only tell you the max charge for their rifle! It's up to each of us to determine if book max charges are safe for us to use. They USUALLY are but we had best not bet on it without starting low and slowly working up while constantly watching for excess pressure signs.

Now, what are the pressure signs to look for? These:
1. Carefully lift the bolt handle after each shot, checking to see if there is any unsual effort needed to open the action.
2. Withdraw each case slowly, checking to see if there is any unusual 'drag' to pulling the case out for the first tenth of an inch.
3. LOOK at the extracted cases, especially the heads. Check to see if the bolt face or ejector cut is smearing the head at all.
4. Look at the full circle of the primer, checking for a smoky ring suggesting the primer pocket has leaked.
5. IF you have access to a chronograph, check the speed of each test shot as you work up. When you reach the normal velocity for that bullet weight AND powder type you can be sure your pressure is at least close to what it should be so STOP! (IF your speeds keep climbing as the charge increases but then stays the same or even drops with increased charges you may well be in pressure trouble no matter what other signs you don't have.)

All of these indicate pressures WAY passed safe limits, back off a good bit and start over! There are other things that can warn us but it's hard for any noob to deal with them so stick to the clearly observable signs and you should be quite safe.

Cratered primers MAY indicate excess pressure but that can also simply indicate your firing pin diameter may be a bit small OR the pin spring may be a bit weak. Blanked primers (pin indention totally gone) MAY indicate excess pressure but it can also be due to a pin that's a little too long OR too 'sharp'.) And primer cups that are flat as a pancake, right to the edges, are far more likely to be from setting the case shoulders back too far than from excess pressure unless accompanied with other indicators.

IMHO.

Last edited by wncchester; September 25, 2011 at 03:27 PM.
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Old September 25, 2011, 03:49 PM   #10
mrawesome22
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A chronograph is your best bet to know when you are getting excessive pressure. Once your velocities start coming close to what the book has published, youll know youre in the ballpark.

And if you dont own one, I would suggest making it priority number on getting one. I consider it absolutely critical to knowing what your loads are doing.
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Old September 25, 2011, 08:27 PM   #11
A_Gamehog
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Quote:
One thing is your twist rate, that dictates the bullets you can accurately use.
Some of these people missed that part of the equation. What is the twist of your rifle? Without your twist rate everything else is a guess.

Gift for you

36 Grains of Varget
Win LRP
Rem brass
55 V-Max
COL is determined by your gun only....
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Old September 25, 2011, 08:43 PM   #12
jenboy
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Thanks everybody! My rifle is a Savage with a twist rate of 1 in 12. I'm sorry I meant to include that in my last post. I really appreciate you all taking the time to help a beginner! Just so you know I'm not completely on my own as I have a friend who's been reloading for 35+ years but I think the more people I can ask the better. Plus, I don't want him to grow tired of my constant questions. LOL Thanks again.
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