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June 13, 2013, 03:36 PM | #26 |
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There are really no safe towns. People live their whole lives in big cities and never have problems and people get murdered in small towns where people leave their doors unlocked (see Kraigwy's post)
The wolf can show up anytime - a movie theater a hiking trail, Home Depot - so I prefer to be able to bite back. That's just me. |
June 13, 2013, 05:15 PM | #27 |
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"There are no safe towns" is a true statement. There are relatively safe towns. There are not absolutely safe towns.
The town I live in is about as safe as it gets. Our crime index is 67.7, which is incredibly low. In 2011, we had 0 murders. Unfortunately, 3 people were raped, 4 were robbed, 3 were assaulted violently, and there were 17 burglaries. Roughly 18,000 people were unharmed in this town. Others were not so lucky. Here are some easy things to do: 1. be mindful of your surroundings 2. carry everywhere, all of the time, unless you are legally forbidden 3. make choices that minimize risk, without sacrificing quality of life
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June 14, 2013, 01:09 PM | #28 |
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I carry alot but not always. There are those who are on a mission to carry but I don't see my life that way. I will carry as it fits into what I am wearing or where I am going. I don't wake up and plan my day around carrying a firearm. I would say that I only carry a firearm about 80% of the time. I don't loose any sleep over it.
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June 14, 2013, 01:37 PM | #29 |
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Each and every one of us must decide for ourselves when and where we'll carry. Like many, I carry everywhere I am legally permitted. My job, unfortunately, places some restrictions on that. (As a lawyer, I spend a lot of time in City Hall, courthouses, etc.) With that said, I would advise that you (OP) learn your state laws, and learn them well. They'll tell you when & where you can carry, as well as the contours of self-defense law in your state.
Cordially, Spats
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June 14, 2013, 01:52 PM | #30 |
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It would be up to you decide when you feel the need to carry a firearm. I would say the chances of needing to use one is very small but possible.
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June 14, 2013, 04:37 PM | #31 | |
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Quote:
Idaho is full of poverty and meth. If you are going to Pocatello I would pack a gun as much as possible, Pocatello just has a lot of poverty and meth. I had a meth head attack me for no reason 3 blocks from the college campus there. I guess he thought I was a meth monster or what ever else was in his deranged head. |
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June 15, 2013, 06:52 AM | #32 |
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OP, looks like you're getting a bunch of advice, and hopefully have added that knowledge to your bag of tricks. Here's a few more pieces:
It is perfectly legal to travel by airplane in the US with your firearms. All airlines follow pretty much the same formula. You need to arrive at the airport with your gun(s) unloaded and in hard-side containers. Your ammo needs to be in original packaging or otherwise securely contained (reload boxes). When you get to check-in (cannot check curbside), simply tell the person behind the counter, with a smile, "I need a declaration form for a firearm"... and they will hand you a card that you fill out and place in the container with your gun, or inside your luggage if your hardside gun case is inside another piece of regular luggage. You will lock you gun-case with a NON-TSA lock, and it will go in the belly of the plane with all the other baggage. Some counter people want to actually see that the gun is unloaded and secured. Some don't care. Some simlpy direct you over to the TSA line. 99% of the time, it's a no-brainer done deal. The only problems I've ever heard anybody have are because the counter-person doesn't know what to do, and simply wants to say "NO" to everything... and those problems are always solved by asking to speak to a manager. Again, it's a no-brainer. Check out this website, and watch the video linked at the top of the page: http://deviating.net/firearms/packing/ Next, you need to understand that all your licensing revolves around the state you are a resident of... ie, where your drivers license is from and where you are registered to vote. You will be able to apply for a "resident permit" from that state, and for a "non-resident" permit from any other state that issues them. I take it that you're a resident of Utah is an ideal "shall issue" state, and ID/NC/GA all have formal reciprocity with Utah: http://publicsafety.utah.gov/bci/FAQother.html Be sure to also check about carrying at school, or buildings owned by the school but not actually at the school, or any kind of thing/event/place that has anything to do with a school. People have mixed results the first few times they carry. Some people say "no big deal", while others feel as if everybody that walks past them somehow knows they're carrying. Running into a police officer makes them feel nervous. Some guys go out of their way to wear extra clothing when they go out to make sure nothing shows... etc... You'll find that these concerns go away rather quickly when you discover that nobody knows you're carrying, and nobody really cares. Concealed is concealed after all. "Printing" is overrated IMHO...not that you want to wear spandex when trying to conceal, but the thought that a person is going to see the outline of your gun through your clothes and then "report you" is something that I've never heard of actually happening. It's discussed a lot on the various forums I read, but I've never actually heard of a story. Others may have an example, but unless you want to strap on a Rossi Ranch Hand, it's a non-issue. Accidental exposure is another thing altogether, and you should take steps to avoid it. Although the actual facts of this event will probably never truly be known, you need to read the story of Erik Scott, who was shot by Las Vegas police outside a Costco over a accidental exposure issue... a good lesson for us all, not only about how we maintain our concealment, but about how we conduct ourselves during an incident, and especially how we conduct ourselves when carrying and approached by police: http://www.bing.com/search?q=erik+sc...c=IE-SearchBox Bottom line, proper clothing for the type of carry will eliminate both printing and exposure. Good luck with your choices. |
June 17, 2013, 11:19 AM | #33 |
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So much great information and advice! I've definitely learned a lot and I feel a lot more comfortable with CC hearing your experiences. I still think it'll take getting used to and I'm sure I'll start forming more of my own opinions after I get licensed and start carrying my gun around
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June 18, 2013, 02:49 AM | #34 |
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Ryan - it is good that a young man like yourself is thinking, before acting. You need to assess what threats you may face. BTW with a Utah permit you can carry in Idahoho, NC, and GA and (I think) everywhere in between.
First of all, nobody says you have to carry a gun every second. Each person has different threats, needs and reasons. Maybe all you need is the knowledge that if the SHTF you have a couple of guns to keep the zombies at bay, just in case. Unless you work in some kind of high risk field or own a convenience store in the ghetto the likelihood is you will probably need a gun to shoot a grizzly bear on your back porch long before you will need one to repel home invaders. In other words, like... never. Are you going to need a gun in church in Utah? I doubt it, and if you are a Mormon it's against the law to carry into an LDS church anyway. Is an outlaw biker gang going to take over your town raping and pillaging, probably not. Is a crazy person likely to shoot up the theater, mall, school, post office, or work place where you happen to be at the moment - maybe. Your .357 is an OK gun for home defense, hiking, or for a car gun. It is versatile, though if it is full size not really concealable. Your Mosin and shotgun are a solid foundation. As you grow and refine your interests I'm sure you will add to your collection. With the three guns you now have, you have tools for hunting and basic self defense. If you feel the need to carry a concealed weapon I recommend buying a "carry" gun like a Ruger LC9, SR9C or Springfield XDS, XDM, SW M&P, or any of the other fine defensive pistols, even (god save me)... a Glock. Please budget the money for it. Whatever you do - don't ever look at or pick up a 1911 - it is like taking crack on meth - once you touch one you will need 10! Your kids will go barefoot in the winter, but your 1911's will all get custom grips. Trust me on this. Regarding your comments about causing an issue with friends by carrying. I agree. Unless your job entails some great threat SOME people are going to think you are whacked if you carry a gun all the time. But if we knew "when" we were going to need a gun, none of us would carry until 5 minutes before the event. My advice is: 1) Unless you are hiking or rounding up cattle, don't carry a gun you can't conceal completely among friends and family. 2) Don't discuss your gun with anyone beside your spouse or someone at the range or gun store. If someone sees it or finds out you carry, acknowledge that yes you carry and then change the subject. Finally, being a smart young guy who seems to be investigating this very well I would suggest along with your guns, that you get some formal training. While a week long course at Gunsite may be out of your budget, most areas offer NRA safety and self defense courses for around $100 each. Many community colleges have police or security courses that are available to the public at reasonable cost. Each class will teach you something. I try to take at least a one day class of some sort every year and I shoot at least once a month. In time you will find what works for you. |
June 18, 2013, 07:58 AM | #35 | |
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Quote:
Sgt Lumpy |
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June 18, 2013, 09:57 AM | #36 | |||
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Quote:
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Crime doesn't make an appointment or give you a friendly notice when it chooses to rob, rape, and kill. Crime always has the drop on us. It looks for us. Why wouldn't you want to always be as well prepared as you possibly can? If you'd like to know a little more about what I do exactly, you can just ask. I think what I wrote and others wrote on this thread should be enough to sway you to carry 24/7. |
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June 18, 2013, 11:01 AM | #37 | |
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June 18, 2013, 11:11 AM | #38 |
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While it is true that very few people have used their firearms to shoot other humans, there are also some very good reasons for not going into details over the internet. I also strongly suspect that once someone posts that they did in fact shoot someone, those reading the posts are certainly going to inquire for more details.
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June 18, 2013, 11:28 AM | #39 | ||
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Quote:
Example. Quote:
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June 18, 2013, 11:30 AM | #40 |
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Re: Self Defense/concealed carry
To clarify: The law in Utah prohibits all church/place of worship carry. It is not LDS specific. I cannot however speak to specific LDS policy.
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June 18, 2013, 12:18 PM | #41 | ||
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Self Defense/concealed carry
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One "use" is you felt/feel good to have it at the time you thought you might need it, or grabbing onto or drawing deterred the situation. To actually "USE" it, meaning...you shot someone after you pulled. No. Most won't say and no it's not a cop out. And Spats McGee is right. There will be people flocking to know details. And a lot of things could still be pending and unclear. So why go over it over the Internet. It's not to coolest thing in the world to talk about. It can be traumatic to think of deeply. |
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June 18, 2013, 01:12 PM | #42 |
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Yes, when I read "use a firearm," I jumped straight to "shot someone." I didn't consider the option of simply displaying a firearm.
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June 18, 2013, 02:54 PM | #43 | |
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I would not recommend that anyone ever discuss in a public forum an incident involving a death resulting from the use of force. I would suggest that any discussion of a less serious incident, including drawing a gun, not occur until after the expiration of any applicable statutes of limitations. I recommend carrying whenever it is permissible to do so. I do make one exception: when the sidewalks and lots are covered with ice, I do not carry. I consider the risk of exposure to attack lower, and at the same time, I choose to mitigate the risk of injury that might be caused by falling on a concealed weapon. |
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June 18, 2013, 04:16 PM | #44 | |
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Quote:
Sgt Lumpy |
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June 18, 2013, 07:16 PM | #45 | |
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Self Defense/concealed carry
Quote:
Protecting yourself and your family is a personal responsibility and each of us has to weigh the risks in our individual situations and plan accordingly. But it's always best to be prepared. Keep your head on a swivel and maintain situational awareness. |
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June 21, 2013, 10:38 AM | #46 |
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Just to clarify: I didn't expect anyone to discuss times when they actually shot another human being. I'm sure there are times when this is necessary and happens but I guess in my mind I picture that most of the time the possession and display of a handgun would be enough to deter MOST threats(obviously not if the potential threat also has a gun himself/herself).
A bit of an oversight on my part O.o. |
June 21, 2013, 11:22 AM | #47 | |
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But unless the display of the weapon was lawfully justified, the actor could get into a lot of trouble. Hence the advice to not discuss it in a public forum, or with anyone else, for that matter. Last edited by OldMarksman; June 21, 2013 at 11:49 AM. |
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June 23, 2013, 03:18 PM | #48 |
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So what happens when you display your gun and some punk (while dancing about in his meth haze) says, "Go ahead and shoot me." Now what do you do?
Something else to think about. I acutally had this happen in a Key West boatyard when some whacked out guy tried to board my boat. I racked the shotgun but he wouldn't leave though he didn't board. He kept standing on the dock trying to incite me. I told him to please just climb aboard but he wasn't that stupid. Fortunately the PD showed up and arrested him for tresspassing and drug possession. Last edited by Frank Ettin; June 23, 2013 at 03:38 PM. Reason: delete vulgarity |
June 23, 2013, 03:38 PM | #49 | |
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June 23, 2013, 05:19 PM | #50 | |
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Quote:
Sgt Lumpy |
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