Weatherby Mark V

ligonierbill · July 2, 2021, 06:13 AM

How good is it? Compared to, say, Weatherby's well respected Vanguard. I have not fired either. A wise man once told me that you don't always get what you pay for, but you rarely get what you don't.

stagpanther · July 2, 2021, 06:43 AM

Depends who you ask. I've shot a fair amount of Mark 5's and own a vanguard in 300 wby. You're not going to see a Weatherby show up at a match most likely--but their motto pretty much sums it up--"nothing shoots faster, flatter and hits harder" (or something close to that). Great appeal for hunters which has always been their primary market.

The vanguards are basically Howa 1500's with conventional 2 lug bolts, moving up to non-magnum Mark 5's you get Weatherby's famous radial in-line 6 lug bolt--and the 300 on up magnums get the massive radial in-line 9 lug bolt--a marvel of firearms engineering IMO.

Weatherby's "thing" is pushing bullets as hard as they reasonably can, and that comes at a price. In the bigger magnums they are going to let you know with respectable recoil. My personal opinion is that they easily wander off into over-bore territory in some of the magnums and you have to be aware that you can burn a barrel out very quickly if you're not careful. Other than that, I love them.

Weatherby guarantees their rifles to shoot 3 shots MOA or less at 100 yds and I've always found their rifles to easily meet that, even at longer ranges. They are generally not going to be bench rest shoot sub .5 all day and night long rifles (though I did once shoot a .2 group with a 270 wby mag at near 200 yds), never were intended to be. But for hunting, hard to think of better choices than a Weatherby IMO.

Hawg · July 2, 2021, 09:13 AM

A vanguard is a plain old rifle dressed up like a Weatherby.

MarkCO · July 2, 2021, 09:17 AM

I don't think I would bother to buy a Vanguard, but Mark Vs, yes. I have one in .338-06 and it is easily my favorite Elk rifle.

stagpanther · July 2, 2021, 10:27 AM

Quote:

I don't think I would bother to buy a Vanguard, but Mark Vs, yes. I have one in .338-06 and it is easily my favorite Elk rifle.

Why is that? Howa 1500's are excellent rifles in their own right, though I would agree that in the more powerful Weatherby magnums the Mark 5's are a better choice overall.

stagpanther · July 2, 2021, 10:31 AM

Quote:

A vanguard is a plain old rifle dressed up like a Weatherby.

I would agree that a vanguard is a plain old Howa 1500 dressed up--but that is hardly an inferior grade rifle.

MarkCO · July 2, 2021, 10:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stagpanther

Why is that? Howa 1500's are excellent rifles in their own right, though I would agree that in the more powerful Weatherby magnums the Mark 5's are a better choice overall.

Big fan of Bergara, so I'd opt for one of those over a Vanguard/Howa.

stagpanther · July 2, 2021, 11:37 AM

Understood. I tend to only shoot Weatherby cartridges in Weatherby rifles, so my perspective is colored by that.

mikejonestkd · July 2, 2021, 12:11 PM

I have a MKV SVM in 223 with the 6 lug bolt, its an excellent rifle.
I also have a vanguard S2 sporter in 243. Its also an excellent rifle.

The howa 1500/ Vanguard is a well made rifle in its price point, but it is not in the same class as the MKV action weatherbys

MarkCO · July 2, 2021, 12:18 PM

I really like Weatherby's new line of shotguns. Basically an M2 clone with good fit and finish for half the $ of a Benelli. I picked up one in 20g and one of the kids on my Trap team is taking it to Nationals. He shoots it really well. That is only to say, if it has a Weatherby name on it, it is pretty good, so not knocking the Vanguards at all.

jmr40 · July 2, 2021, 01:59 PM

The Vanguard is a good rifle. I've had several as well as a couple of similar Howa rifles, all functioned correctly and were adequately accurate. But I just don't care for them.

The MKV is a better quality rifle, but I have no interest in any of the Weatherby magnum cartridges.

All of the Weatherby rifles are bigger, bulkier and heavier than I want in a rifle. But if that is what you want you could do a lot worse.

ligonierbill · July 2, 2021, 02:04 PM

OK, I'm convinced. The Vanguard is a good rifle, but I have a bunch of good rifles. I don't have a Weatherby. I started this thinking I would finish my collection of quarter bores with Roy's reported favorite, also his first, right? Now I'm not so sure. I like heavy hitters, too. Reading up for Africa - I'm taking my good 'ole Savage 338 Win Mag - many experienced people think the really big Weatherby rounds are just too fast. If your 416 bullet is breaking 2,400, you're good (assuming you shoot well). My PH loves the Win Mag for plains game, and tells me 200 m is the range to plan on. So, if it turns out to be 400, I'm still not undergunned. So, new question. Which one of the Weatherby rounds is really the greatest thing since sliced bread? Still the 257?

MarkCO · July 2, 2021, 02:18 PM

I sold my .340 Weatherby and .257 Weatherby. I just felt they were much more than was necessary for anything I was going to do with them. I do want another Weatherby at some point and I will likely try to find a Mark V in a .30-06 based caliber, shoot it out and slap the spare .338-06 Weatherby barrel on it that I bought at an auction for $90, factory new.

If I wanted a Weatherby Caliber in a Mark V, I'd probably get the .240 Weatherby.

stagpanther · July 2, 2021, 02:53 PM

Quote:

OK, I'm convinced. The Vanguard is a good rifle, but I have a bunch of good rifles. I don't have a Weatherby. I started this thinking I would finish my collection of quarter bores with Roy's reported favorite, also his first, right? Now I'm not so sure. I like heavy hitters, too. Reading up for Africa - I'm taking my good 'ole Savage 338 Win Mag - many experienced people think the really big Weatherby rounds are just too fast. If your 416 bullet is breaking 2,400, you're good (assuming you shoot well). My PH loves the Win Mag for plains game, and tells me 200 m is the range to plan on. So, if it turns out to be 400, I'm still not undergunned. So, new question. Which one of the Weatherby rounds is really the greatest thing since sliced bread? Still the 257?

The 300 Weatherby would be a great long range plains game cartridge, you'll have a huge point blank range (no fussing with turrets) and it will deliver a wallop when it gets there. It does hit hard so if you don't like recoil get one with an Accubrake.

std7mag · July 2, 2021, 08:10 PM

To me, comparing the Vangard to the Mark V is akin to comparing a Malibu to a Masserati...
Not in the same league.
Make no mistake, the Weatherby cartridges are fast, and get the job done.
But if your looking for top velocities, they typically sit around #4.
Lazzeroni, Dakota, and RUM being faster.
But at the cost of more powder burnt, and shorter barrel life.
Speed costs money. How fast do you want to go?

As for rifles, the Mark V and Vangard are worlds apart.

**44 AMP** · July 2, 2021, 10:58 PM

When the Vanguard came out it was Weatherby's "bargain" rifle. It had some of the Weatherby style but not the Mk V action and was in standard calibers.

They are good rifles but they are not Weatherby Mk Vs, nor were they ever meant to be.

stagpanther · July 3, 2021, 03:19 AM

Quote:

To me, comparing the Vangard to the Mark V is akin to comparing a Malibu to a Masserati...

I had one in high school and heck ya, I'd take a Malibu.

std7mag · July 3, 2021, 05:27 AM

I just knew i should have said Chevette....

ligonierbill · July 3, 2021, 11:48 AM

OK, nobody doesn't like Mark V Weatherby's. But except for Stagpanther, I see a distinct lack of affection for Roy's rounds. My target will be a Mark V in 257 Weatherby. It will have to wait, though, until I can sort out my 250-3000 and work up loads for my new powder acquisitions. The 300 Weatherby is reported to be the most popular, but my 8mm Rem Mag runs close, and I'm a sucker for the oddball. So, the 257 "Roy" it is.

stagpanther · July 3, 2021, 12:44 PM

Quote:

OK, nobody doesn't like Mark V Weatherby's. But except for Stagpanther, I see a distinct lack of affection for Roy's rounds. My target will be a Mark V in 257 Weatherby. It will have to wait, though, until I can sort out my 250-3000 and work up loads for my new powder acquisitions. The 300 Weatherby is reported to be the most popular, but my 8mm Rem Mag runs close, and I'm a sucker for the oddball. So, the 257 "Roy" it is.

You mentioned needing a secondary to your 338 for reaching out long on African plains non-dangerous game and the 300 wby mag excels in that role.

MarkCO · July 3, 2021, 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ligonierbill

OK, nobody doesn't like Mark V Weatherby's. But except for Stagpanther, I see a distinct lack of affection for Roy's rounds. My target will be a Mark V in 257 Weatherby. It will have to wait, though, until I can sort out my 250-3000 and work up loads for my new powder acquisitions. The 300 Weatherby is reported to be the most popular, but my 8mm Rem Mag runs close, and I'm a sucker for the oddball. So, the 257 "Roy" it is.

The .257W will fit the bill nicely.

I think Roy was ahead of his time. Frankly, the non-belted magnum class cartridges coming out now have a leg up on his designs. No belts and sharper angles at the should add to case life and reloading consistency...which for most of us is a goal. Americans also seem to suffer from magnumitis along with the accompaniments of flinch, barrel wear and cost, that honestly VERY few are capable enough riflemen to be able to "need" that extra few hundred feet of velocity. If he was to "start" today, I have no doubt that his cartridge family would not look anything like what they are.

stagpanther · July 3, 2021, 01:36 PM

Quote:

If he was to "start" today, I have no doubt that his cartridge family would not look anything like what they are.

Heretic!

handlerer2 · July 3, 2021, 03:37 PM

I own two Weatherby rifles, A late60's era MKV, 340WBY, and a Vanguard, 300WBY.
The Vanguard has an interesting story, which is available on Weatherby Nation's history section.

The first edition of the Vanguards were the Sako L60, I think. When it came time to renew the contract, Weatherby and Howa put their heads together and changed the design enough to avoid copy write infringement. There was considerable litigation, but Weatherby and Howa prevailed. The changes really only amounted to removal of the third rear locking lug.

The Howa/Vanguard is made the old way. It isn't drilled bar stock, the receiver is machined from a solid forged billet, with an integral machined recoil lug. The bolt is also machined from a solid forged billet, handle and all.

IMO, the Vanguard is much more solid than any other rifle in its price category. It is a pound or more heavy than the other rifles in its price category.

When chambered in Weatherby 300, 6.5/6300 the extra weight is an aid in trying to get accuracy from rifles in this power category. The recoil of the Vanguard is, IMO, in 300WBY is as punishing as the MKV in 340WBY.

The Vanguard may be an economy rifle, but it is far from cheap. If you can accommodate the recoil, they are very accurate, in my experience. My next rifle, as soon as I can swing it, will be a wood stocked Vanguard in 240WBY.

stagpanther · July 3, 2021, 05:04 PM

Quote:

The Howa/Vanguard is made the old way. It isn't drilled bar stock, the receiver is machined from a solid forged billet, with an integral machined recoil lug. The bolt is also machined from a solid forged billet, handle and all.

And flat bottomed action...

Quote:

The recoil of the Vanguard is, IMO, in 300WBY is as punishing as the MKV in 340WBY.

I have one and frequently shoot the Mark 5 300 w/o a brake as well--that one IS quite punishing, a hard, fast kicker but one of the reasons the kick is so hard IMO is that the muzzle lift is quite pronounced without something to keep it down. I talked to the folks at Weatherby a couple of days ago concerning a replacement for a burnt-out 300 barrel--I don't think they even make the older sporter style barrels for the 300 anymore.

Quote:

The Vanguard may be an economy rifle, but it is far from cheap. If you can accommodate the recoil, they are very accurate, in my experience. My next rifle, as soon as I can swing it, will be a wood stocked Vanguard in 240WBY.

Have you tried the 270 wby mag? One of the best (and first) of the Weatherby clan IMO.

**44 AMP** · July 4, 2021, 12:53 PM

Quote:

OK, nobody doesn't like Mark V Weatherby's. But except for Stagpanther, ...

and me...sort of.

I love the Weatherby Mk V action from a design standpoint, and I do like the look of the guns styling, but the classic Weatherby stock design just sucks for handling heavy recoil.

Bear in mind this was in the days before muzzle brakes became common. With a good brake, tis a different animal.

Quote:

If he was to "start" today, I have no doubt that his cartridge family would not look anything like what they are.

Well, duh!

Today there are different powders, and today there is well over half a century of design and field experience that didn't exist when Roy was creating his rounds. Or his rifle...so of course things would be quite different if he were to start today.

July 2, 2021, 06:13 AM	#1
ligonierbill Senior Member Join Date: May 20, 2007 Posts: 2,456	Weatherby Mark V How good is it? Compared to, say, Weatherby's well respected Vanguard. I have not fired either. A wise man once told me that you don't always get what you pay for, but you rarely get what you don't.

July 2, 2021, 06:43 AM	#2
stagpanther Senior Member Join Date: March 2, 2014 Posts: 11,789	Depends who you ask. I've shot a fair amount of Mark 5's and own a vanguard in 300 wby. You're not going to see a Weatherby show up at a match most likely--but their motto pretty much sums it up--"nothing shoots faster, flatter and hits harder" (or something close to that). Great appeal for hunters which has always been their primary market. The vanguards are basically Howa 1500's with conventional 2 lug bolts, moving up to non-magnum Mark 5's you get Weatherby's famous radial in-line 6 lug bolt--and the 300 on up magnums get the massive radial in-line 9 lug bolt--a marvel of firearms engineering IMO. Weatherby's "thing" is pushing bullets as hard as they reasonably can, and that comes at a price. In the bigger magnums they are going to let you know with respectable recoil. My personal opinion is that they easily wander off into over-bore territory in some of the magnums and you have to be aware that you can burn a barrel out very quickly if you're not careful. Other than that, I love them. Weatherby guarantees their rifles to shoot 3 shots MOA or less at 100 yds and I've always found their rifles to easily meet that, even at longer ranges. They are generally not going to be bench rest shoot sub .5 all day and night long rifles (though I did once shoot a .2 group with a 270 wby mag at near 200 yds), never were intended to be. But for hunting, hard to think of better choices than a Weatherby IMO. __________________ "Everyone speaks gun."--Robert O'Neill *I am NOT an expert--I do not have any formal experience or certification in firearms use or testing; use any information I post at your own risk!* Last edited by stagpanther; July 2, 2021 at 07:00 AM.

July 2, 2021, 11:37 AM	#8
stagpanther Senior Member Join Date: March 2, 2014 Posts: 11,789	Understood. I tend to only shoot Weatherby cartridges in Weatherby rifles, so my perspective is colored by that. __________________ "Everyone speaks gun."--Robert O'Neill *I am NOT an expert--I do not have any formal experience or certification in firearms use or testing; use any information I post at your own risk!*

July 2, 2021, 12:11 PM	#9
mikejonestkd Senior Member Join Date: January 3, 2006 Location: Brockport, NY Posts: 3,717	I have a MKV SVM in 223 with the 6 lug bolt, its an excellent rifle. I also have a vanguard S2 sporter in 243. Its also an excellent rifle. The howa 1500/ Vanguard is a well made rifle in its price point, but it is not in the same class as the MKV action weatherbys __________________ You are the bows from which your children as living arrows are sent forth.

July 2, 2021, 12:18 PM	#10
MarkCO Senior Member Join Date: October 21, 1998 Location: Colorado, USA Posts: 4,308	I really like Weatherby's new line of shotguns. Basically an M2 clone with good fit and finish for half the $ of a Benelli. I picked up one in 20g and one of the kids on my Trap team is taking it to Nationals. He shoots it really well. That is only to say, if it has a Weatherby name on it, it is pretty good, so not knocking the Vanguards at all. __________________ Good Shooting, MarkCO www.CarbonArms.us

July 2, 2021, 09:13 AM	#3
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 16,189	A vanguard is a plain old rifle dressed up like a Weatherby.

July 2, 2021, 09:17 AM	#4
MarkCO Senior Member Join Date: October 21, 1998 Location: Colorado, USA Posts: 4,308	I don't think I would bother to buy a Vanguard, but Mark Vs, yes. I have one in .338-06 and it is easily my favorite Elk rifle. __________________ Good Shooting, MarkCO www.CarbonArms.us

July 2, 2021, 01:59 PM	#11
jmr40 Senior Member Join Date: June 15, 2008 Location: Georgia Posts: 10,809	The Vanguard is a good rifle. I've had several as well as a couple of similar Howa rifles, all functioned correctly and were adequately accurate. But I just don't care for them. The MKV is a better quality rifle, but I have no interest in any of the Weatherby magnum cartridges. All of the Weatherby rifles are bigger, bulkier and heavier than I want in a rifle. But if that is what you want you could do a lot worse. __________________ "If you're still doing things the same way you were doing them 10 years ago, you're doing it wrong" Winston Churchill

July 2, 2021, 02:04 PM	#12
ligonierbill Senior Member Join Date: May 20, 2007 Posts: 2,456	OK, I'm convinced. The Vanguard is a good rifle, but I have a bunch of good rifles. I don't have a Weatherby. I started this thinking I would finish my collection of quarter bores with Roy's reported favorite, also his first, right? Now I'm not so sure. I like heavy hitters, too. Reading up for Africa - I'm taking my good 'ole Savage 338 Win Mag - many experienced people think the really big Weatherby rounds are just too fast. If your 416 bullet is breaking 2,400, you're good (assuming you shoot well). My PH loves the Win Mag for plains game, and tells me 200 m is the range to plan on. So, if it turns out to be 400, I'm still not undergunned. So, new question. Which one of the Weatherby rounds is really the greatest thing since sliced bread? Still the 257?

July 2, 2021, 02:18 PM	#13
MarkCO Senior Member Join Date: October 21, 1998 Location: Colorado, USA Posts: 4,308	I sold my .340 Weatherby and .257 Weatherby. I just felt they were much more than was necessary for anything I was going to do with them. I do want another Weatherby at some point and I will likely try to find a Mark V in a .30-06 based caliber, shoot it out and slap the spare .338-06 Weatherby barrel on it that I bought at an auction for $90, factory new. If I wanted a Weatherby Caliber in a Mark V, I'd probably get the .240 Weatherby. __________________ Good Shooting, MarkCO www.CarbonArms.us

July 2, 2021, 08:10 PM	#15
std7mag Senior Member Join Date: June 23, 2013 Location: Central Taxylvania.. Posts: 3,609	To me, comparing the Vangard to the Mark V is akin to comparing a Malibu to a Masserati... Not in the same league. Make no mistake, the Weatherby cartridges are fast, and get the job done. But if your looking for top velocities, they typically sit around #4. Lazzeroni, Dakota, and RUM being faster. But at the cost of more powder burnt, and shorter barrel life. Speed costs money. How fast do you want to go? As for rifles, the Mark V and Vangard are worlds apart. __________________ When our own government declares itself as "tyrannical", where does that leave us??!! "Januarary 6th insurrection". Funny, I didn't see a single piece of rope...

July 2, 2021, 10:58 PM	#16
44 AMP Staff Join Date: March 11, 2006 Location: Upper US Posts: 28,839	When the Vanguard came out it was Weatherby's "bargain" rifle. It had some of the Weatherby style but not the Mk V action and was in standard calibers. They are good rifles but they are not Weatherby Mk Vs, nor were they ever meant to be. __________________ All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better.

July 3, 2021, 05:27 AM	#18
std7mag Senior Member Join Date: June 23, 2013 Location: Central Taxylvania.. Posts: 3,609	I just knew i should have said Chevette.... __________________ When our own government declares itself as "tyrannical", where does that leave us??!! "Januarary 6th insurrection". Funny, I didn't see a single piece of rope...

July 3, 2021, 11:48 AM	#19
ligonierbill Senior Member Join Date: May 20, 2007 Posts: 2,456	OK, nobody doesn't like Mark V Weatherby's. But except for Stagpanther, I see a distinct lack of affection for Roy's rounds. My target will be a Mark V in 257 Weatherby. It will have to wait, though, until I can sort out my 250-3000 and work up loads for my new powder acquisitions. The 300 Weatherby is reported to be the most popular, but my 8mm Rem Mag runs close, and I'm a sucker for the oddball. So, the 257 "Roy" it is.

July 3, 2021, 03:37 PM	#23
handlerer2 Senior Member Join Date: April 26, 2010 Location: Yellowstone Co, MT Posts: 489	I own two Weatherby rifles, A late60's era MKV, 340WBY, and a Vanguard, 300WBY. The Vanguard has an interesting story, which is available on Weatherby Nation's history section. The first edition of the Vanguards were the Sako L60, I think. When it came time to renew the contract, Weatherby and Howa put their heads together and changed the design enough to avoid copy write infringement. There was considerable litigation, but Weatherby and Howa prevailed. The changes really only amounted to removal of the third rear locking lug. The Howa/Vanguard is made the old way. It isn't drilled bar stock, the receiver is machined from a solid forged billet, with an integral machined recoil lug. The bolt is also machined from a solid forged billet, handle and all. IMO, the Vanguard is much more solid than any other rifle in its price category. It is a pound or more heavy than the other rifles in its price category. When chambered in Weatherby 300, 6.5/6300 the extra weight is an aid in trying to get accuracy from rifles in this power category. The recoil of the Vanguard is, IMO, in 300WBY is as punishing as the MKV in 340WBY. The Vanguard may be an economy rifle, but it is far from cheap. If you can accommodate the recoil, they are very accurate, in my experience. My next rifle, as soon as I can swing it, will be a wood stocked Vanguard in 240WBY.