Good Decapping Die for 223

Northof50 · January 6, 2018, 10:53 AM

Hello all:

New to the forum, but more than 30 years experience reloading pistol, rifle and wildcat. Recently purchased my first AR, but am have a damn difficult time depriming cases.

Picked up spent brass from the range, cleaned them, lubed them and proceeded to but the first pin on a military case. OK lesson learned - INSPECT ALL CASES.

But, proceeded to bust 2 more pins on standard cases [WW & R-P]. The dies are an older [1970's] Lymann.

I've used, both, my RockChucker single stage and Pro2000 progressive.

Just wondering if there is an additional step for 223 of which I am unaware, or a stronger pin? I've have Hornady and RCBS dies without issue.

Thanks for any help.

Rick

StripesDude · January 6, 2018, 11:16 AM

I use regular old Lee dies and have no issues. My first thought was you got some berdan primed cases (if there is such a thing for 223) but if you ran a WW case then that’s not it.

There are no extra steps for 223 vs other rifle cases. Maybe your case is going into the die crooked?

Northof50 · January 6, 2018, 11:23 AM

Thanks. I didn't think there was a different step, but really am at a loss. I thought, perhaps, it was the Lymann products. As written, I had the same experience on both a progressive and single stage presses.

I do notice some traditional primers are crimped in. Maybe the crimped primers eventually cause stress? But, the pins broke [literally] within minutes of receiving them from Midway.

StripesDude · January 6, 2018, 11:30 AM

The crimps aren’t strong enough to bend a pin with the amount of force you’re exerting. Most of my cases are range pickups and are crimped primers, and I’ve not had this issue.

I’d pick up a new die - something is likely wrong with the die.

condor bravo · January 6, 2018, 11:44 AM

Have you checked to see that the decapping stem is properly centered so that the pin will enter the flash hole? If not centered, the pin could be way off to one side and attempting to punch through solid brass, causing the breaks.

Nathan · January 6, 2018, 11:48 AM

I have had 2 similar issues...

1) berdan primed cases will destroy your pin before you can stop pulling, IME....good to inspect head stamps first!

2) some crimped primers are strong enough to bend or damage the pin somehow, IME......flash holes might be off center also...

So, I use the Lee decapping die before cleaning....the reason for the Lee is that after the first pin breaks, you can buy replacement pins by the 3 pack on eBay! Something about that die though, I'm still on the first pin!

burrhead · January 6, 2018, 11:59 AM

I'm believe friends don't let friends buy Lee but their decapping die is the exception. They're cheap and work well but you should still have some spare pins on hand; they're not indestructible.

ammo.crafter · January 6, 2018, 12:13 PM

How far down is your decapping pin set?

It should be set so that it sticks out as little as possible but still function reliably.

disseminator · January 6, 2018, 01:18 PM

I only have one resizing die for 223/556 so that is all I can speak on but my small base 5.56 dies set from RCBS has resizied many thousands of millitary cases and I have yet to break a single pin. (now that I say that....)

I have a small base set for 300 blackout that has also processed thousands of mil spec primers without issue.

might be worth trying a new die...

Nathan · January 6, 2018, 01:22 PM

Quote:

I believe friends don't let friends buy Lee but their decapping die is the exception.

We agree on that fully! Their non-FC taper crimp dies work well after you replace the nut too. Hornady nut, of course!

ed308 · January 6, 2018, 01:26 PM

Not a fan of the Lee decap die. I've broken too many pins. The best I found is Dillon's Universal decap die. I tend to break less pins for whatever reason.

I do like Lee's FC Die and use it on most of my AR reloads.

Nathan · January 6, 2018, 01:57 PM

Improved pin for LEE

**Unclenick** · January 6, 2018, 02:16 PM

Northof50,

Welcome to the forum.

The small decapping pins always have the potential for the chuck to come loose and let the tip wiggle around and miss the flash hole and snap. I've tightened them with pliers and taken other steps like using green (removable) Loctite on them to stop that, and these things help.

The second issue is having the right shell holder. The different makers use different dimensions, as you can tell from this table in which the same holder used for two different cases by one maker sometimes don't match what another maker uses. You want a shell holder that's not too tight to let an off-center flash hole move over into better alignment with the pin, but not so loose that you constantly miss the flash hole. If the Lyman isn't giving you the right amount of slop, try a Lee.

These days, for all my rifle cases I use a Lee decapper that is left permanently on a small Lee press. I want to decap them before I clean them to get the crud out of the primer pockets, and I want them clean before I resize them to keep grit from scratching up the die. If you don't have an extra press, though, you might like the Lee hand decapping system and a small hammer and a work surface. The principle advantage it has over a press and die is you find the flash hole with the pin before tapping it out with the hammer, so you never have a pin alignment problem except with the most extreme off-center cases where the hole is at the edge of the pocket. In that case, you'll notice the problem before you tap.

Dufus · January 6, 2018, 02:33 PM

I have the Lee decapper system and I have the Frankford Arsenal decapper.

The Frankford system has a cup to catch all the primer crap, but you need to check it every now and then to make sure it is still seated or it will fall off.

Amazon has the best price I have found on it.

https://www.amazon.com/Frankford-Ars...senal+deprimer

rottdogsparky · January 6, 2018, 03:29 PM

I broke my first Lee decapping pin the other day on some military brass and after purchasing the pin found a recommendation for the place below and their stuff is exceptional been running that and have not had a problem. LIFETIME WARRANTY

https://mightyarmory.com

This Die is outstanding on all presses including 1050 Automated Drive Systems

Precision CNC Machined, Extremely Tight Thread Tolerances, Perfect vertical alignment. Only the best materials available have been selected to manufacture this Die. Including Aero Space Anodizing.

Heat Treated 2,Part Rifle Barrel Steel Punch shaft and rolled forged threaded Pin.

Lifetime Warrantied. (see warranty)

Standard .070 Pin or (see products list Lapua .055 Pin available)

MPN # 20105

This is the finest Decapping Die ever made. A precision tool for all reloading presses. “Our # 1 Selling Die” will last a you a lifetime of trouble free use.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

ms6852 · January 6, 2018, 04:13 PM

I second Dufus recommendation. The Branford arsenal tool is great. if not I would use a lee universal decapping die. If the pin breaks it is easy and inexpensive to replace .

m&p45acp10+1 · January 6, 2018, 07:58 PM

I keep an old speaker magnet tied to a length of rope. I pull it through my range pick up brass. This helps to get the steel case berdan primed stuff out.

Though I have also had some pins broken by badly off center flash holes. I have a Hornady sizing die. With about 10 spare decapping pins. Otherwise I used the Lee collet die to deprime a large amount that were going to be wet tumbled. It worked. I just went to the Hornady as it was simple, and easy to replace the pins, and I picked up 10 extras in a trade.

Northof50 · January 6, 2018, 08:09 PM

I appreciate all the replies and will look into the Lee decapper. As written, I've been doing this for 30 years and have never had the issue. After my first [original] pin broke, I ordered a replacement from Midway. Literally, within the first 25 rounds the pin broke. I then ordered the complete Lymann die with carbide expander pin AND switched to my single stage RockChucker. The pin lasted about the same time. 3 pins - 2 loaders - 2 shell plates. The 2 purchased pins from Miday have been sent back to them. The shell plate for the RCBS system is a #10 for the 223 case. Have it for the single and progressive.

I will also check the alignment of the pin to the die, as well as the overall pin length that protrudes from the bottom. I have noticed, that regardless of the reloading system, the priming/depriming is achilleas of every system. In reloading mass is your friend. When dealing with a 3 grain component, issue abound.

My pin may have been too far out. I find if not out far enough, the primers don't exit the case, or go down the exit tube - indicating there must be some flex in to the pin, as it certainly looks like it is out far enough to clear the case and shell plate.

Again, thanks.

Rick

Northof50 · January 6, 2018, 08:13 PM

That looks awesome! Definitely going to give that die a try. Much thanks.

Rick

jhansman · January 8, 2018, 05:26 PM

FWIW, I've processed thousands of military .223 cases with my Lee dies, and have never broken a pin. Must be in the technique...

hdwhit · January 8, 2018, 05:52 PM

I use predominately RCBS dies, but for decapping, I use a Lee Universal Decapping die. Thicker shaft on the decapper retained by a collet that will let the shaft move if you his an obstruction. It is simply the best approach to the problem that I have seen.

**44 AMP** · January 9, 2018, 11:39 PM

While I realize that everybody wants to make as much ammo as fast as they can, so they don't "waste" their time, I've got time to waste, and I do it really "old school", and have for over 30 years.

I don't decap GI brass in my press with a die (the first time). I've broken several pins over the years (both RCBS and Lyman), while the pins are dirt cheap its a pain.

So, what I do is, do it in a separate step. I'm not a fan of LEE products, except for one, the manual punch and base decapper. The one where you use a hammer. Its not fast but it is 100% positive. You feel the pin in the flashhole, so off center holes are not a problem (though I do recommend segregating those cases) Berdan cases aren't a problem, because you can't get the pin in the flashhole, so that tells you to LOOK and see what's going on.

Also, the sturdy punch shaft works to round out any bent case mouths.

Have NEVER broken one of their pins, even though my oldest .30 punch has the head mushroomed out a bit from being beaten on for decades. There is a size for .30 and one for .22. Its slow, its a little dirty, and labor intensive, BUT like reaming/swaging the primer pockets, you only need do it once.

I consider it a part of prepping GI brass, PRIOR to sizing.

Plus, getting to wack something from time to time is a bit therapeutic!

Northof50 · January 9, 2018, 11:52 PM

Cool idea 44AMP. Midway is sending me my replacement die. Until then, the idea of a punch is a good one. Thanks

cw308 · January 10, 2018, 09:31 AM

I use a universal decapping die , first step on the RockChucker . Then wet tumble an size . What quantity are you loading at a time. I'm not reloading alot at a time , when removing primers there have been times I could feel the pin stop but never bent or broke a pin . My have to slow down your reloading . Easy for me to say , I'm not loading quality.

629StealthHunter · January 17, 2018, 07:45 PM

I have had very good luck with the inexpensive Lee Reloader Press and Lee Universal Decapping Die. This was the first press and die that I purchased about 18-19 years ago. I stocked up on once fired brass and decapped lots of brass especially 223 with crimped primer pockets. I then ordered a rock chucker for my sizing/seating etc. The sole purpose of my Lee press is decapping before a good brass cleaning. I have seen a lot of reloaders use the Lee Reloader press for all steps of reloading with good results. I have broken very few decapping pins. I will say this, do not force or rush decapping this way. Sometimes you have to wiggle or align the case for things to line up.

January 6, 2018, 11:23 AM	#3
Northof50 Junior member Join Date: January 5, 2018 Location: Northeast USA Posts: 232	2 different presses Thanks. I didn't think there was a different step, but really am at a loss. I thought, perhaps, it was the Lymann products. As written, I had the same experience on both a progressive and single stage presses. I do notice some traditional primers are crimped in. Maybe the crimped primers eventually cause stress? But, the pins broke [literally] within minutes of receiving them from Midway.

January 6, 2018, 11:44 AM	#5
condor bravo Senior Member Join Date: August 23, 2014 Location: Nevada/Ariz/CA Posts: 1,753	Have you checked to see that the decapping stem is properly centered so that the pin will enter the flash hole? If not centered, the pin could be way off to one side and attempting to punch through solid brass, causing the breaks. __________________ Ouch, the dreaded "M-1 thumb", you just know it will happen eventually, so why not do it now and get it over with??

January 6, 2018, 11:59 AM	#7
burrhead Senior Member Join Date: July 6, 1999 Location: Chihuahuan desert, Texas Posts: 1,148	I'm believe friends don't let friends buy Lee but their decapping die is the exception. They're cheap and work well but you should still have some spare pins on hand; they're not indestructible. __________________ Join the GOA, SAF and the TSRA I'm offended by people that are easily offended.

January 6, 2018, 12:13 PM	#8
ammo.crafter Senior Member Join Date: June 25, 2006 Location: The Keystone State Posts: 1,970	pin How far down is your decapping pin set? It should be set so that it sticks out as little as possible but still function reliably. __________________ "Peace is that brief glorious moment in history when everybody stands around reloading". --Thomas Jefferson

January 6, 2018, 02:16 PM	#13
Unclenick Staff Join Date: March 4, 2005 Location: Ohio Posts: 21,063	Northof50, Welcome to the forum. The small decapping pins always have the potential for the chuck to come loose and let the tip wiggle around and miss the flash hole and snap. I've tightened them with pliers and taken other steps like using green (removable) Loctite on them to stop that, and these things help. The second issue is having the right shell holder. The different makers use different dimensions, as you can tell from this table in which the same holder used for two different cases by one maker sometimes don't match what another maker uses. You want a shell holder that's not too tight to let an off-center flash hole move over into better alignment with the pin, but not so loose that you constantly miss the flash hole. If the Lyman isn't giving you the right amount of slop, try a Lee. These days, for all my rifle cases I use a Lee decapper that is left permanently on a small Lee press. I want to decap them before I clean them to get the crud out of the primer pockets, and I want them clean before I resize them to keep grit from scratching up the die. If you don't have an extra press, though, you might like the Lee hand decapping system and a small hammer and a work surface. The principle advantage it has over a press and die is you find the flash hole with the pin before tapping it out with the hammer, so you never have a pin alignment problem except with the most extreme off-center cases where the hole is at the edge of the pocket. In that case, you'll notice the problem before you tap. __________________ Gunsite Orange Hat Family Member CMP Certified GSM Master Instructor NRA Certified Rifle Instructor NRA Benefactor Member and Golden Eagle

January 6, 2018, 10:53 AM	#1
Northof50 Junior member Join Date: January 5, 2018 Location: Northeast USA Posts: 232	Good Decapping Die for 223 Hello all: New to the forum, but more than 30 years experience reloading pistol, rifle and wildcat. Recently purchased my first AR, but am have a damn difficult time depriming cases. Picked up spent brass from the range, cleaned them, lubed them and proceeded to but the first pin on a military case. OK lesson learned - INSPECT ALL CASES. But, proceeded to bust 2 more pins on standard cases [WW & R-P]. The dies are an older [1970's] Lymann. I've used, both, my RockChucker single stage and Pro2000 progressive. Just wondering if there is an additional step for 223 of which I am unaware, or a stronger pin? I've have Hornady and RCBS dies without issue. Thanks for any help. Rick

January 6, 2018, 11:16 AM	#2
StripesDude Member Join Date: June 29, 2014 Posts: 88	I use regular old Lee dies and have no issues. My first thought was you got some berdan primed cases (if there is such a thing for 223) but if you ran a WW case then that’s not it. There are no extra steps for 223 vs other rifle cases. Maybe your case is going into the die crooked?

January 6, 2018, 11:30 AM	#4
StripesDude Member Join Date: June 29, 2014 Posts: 88	The crimps aren’t strong enough to bend a pin with the amount of force you’re exerting. Most of my cases are range pickups and are crimped primers, and I’ve not had this issue. I’d pick up a new die - something is likely wrong with the die.

January 6, 2018, 11:48 AM	#6
Nathan Senior Member Join Date: July 1, 2001 Posts: 6,331	I have had 2 similar issues... 1) berdan primed cases will destroy your pin before you can stop pulling, IME....good to inspect head stamps first! 2) some crimped primers are strong enough to bend or damage the pin somehow, IME......flash holes might be off center also... So, I use the Lee decapping die before cleaning....the reason for the Lee is that after the first pin breaks, you can buy replacement pins by the 3 pack on eBay! Something about that die though, I'm still on the first pin!

January 6, 2018, 01:18 PM	#9
disseminator Senior Member Join Date: November 26, 2016 Location: Minnesota Posts: 960	I only have one resizing die for 223/556 so that is all I can speak on but my small base 5.56 dies set from RCBS has resizied many thousands of millitary cases and I have yet to break a single pin. (now that I say that....) I have a small base set for 300 blackout that has also processed thousands of mil spec primers without issue. might be worth trying a new die...

January 6, 2018, 01:26 PM	#11
ed308 Senior Member Join Date: November 5, 2016 Location: DFW, TX Posts: 1,147	Not a fan of the Lee decap die. I've broken too many pins. The best I found is Dillon's Universal decap die. I tend to break less pins for whatever reason. I do like Lee's FC Die and use it on most of my AR reloads.

January 6, 2018, 01:57 PM	#12
Nathan Senior Member Join Date: July 1, 2001 Posts: 6,331	Improved pin for LEE

January 6, 2018, 02:33 PM	#14
Dufus Senior Member Join Date: December 10, 2014 Posts: 1,965	I have the Lee decapper system and I have the Frankford Arsenal decapper. The Frankford system has a cup to catch all the primer crap, but you need to check it every now and then to make sure it is still seated or it will fall off. Amazon has the best price I have found on it. https://www.amazon.com/Frankford-Ars...senal+deprimer

January 6, 2018, 03:29 PM	#15
rottdogsparky Junior Member Join Date: December 13, 2017 Posts: 10	I broke my first Lee decapping pin the other day on some military brass and after purchasing the pin found a recommendation for the place below and their stuff is exceptional been running that and have not had a problem. LIFETIME WARRANTY https://mightyarmory.com This Die is outstanding on all presses including 1050 Automated Drive Systems Precision CNC Machined, Extremely Tight Thread Tolerances, Perfect vertical alignment. Only the best materials available have been selected to manufacture this Die. Including Aero Space Anodizing. Heat Treated 2,Part Rifle Barrel Steel Punch shaft and rolled forged threaded Pin. Lifetime Warrantied. (see warranty) Standard .070 Pin or (see products list Lapua .055 Pin available) MPN # 20105 This is the finest Decapping Die ever made. A precision tool for all reloading presses. “Our # 1 Selling Die” will last a you a lifetime of trouble free use. Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk Last edited by rottdogsparky; January 7, 2018 at 07:26 AM.

January 6, 2018, 04:13 PM	#16
ms6852 Senior Member Join Date: April 3, 2010 Location: Texas Posts: 1,394	I second Dufus recommendation. The Branford arsenal tool is great. if not I would use a lee universal decapping die. If the pin breaks it is easy and inexpensive to replace . __________________ ONLY TWO DEFINING FORCES HAVE GIVEN UP THEIR LIVES FOR YOU. ONE IS JESUS CHRIST FOR YOUR SOUL AND THE OTHER IS THE AMERICAN SOLDIER FOR YOUR FREEDOM.

January 6, 2018, 07:58 PM	#17
m&p45acp10+1 Senior Member Join Date: May 3, 2009 Location: Central Texas Posts: 3,930	I keep an old speaker magnet tied to a length of rope. I pull it through my range pick up brass. This helps to get the steel case berdan primed stuff out. Though I have also had some pins broken by badly off center flash holes. I have a Hornady sizing die. With about 10 spare decapping pins. Otherwise I used the Lee collet die to deprime a large amount that were going to be wet tumbled. It worked. I just went to the Hornady as it was simple, and easy to replace the pins, and I picked up 10 extras in a trade. __________________ No matter how many times you do it and nothing happens it only takes something going wrong one time to kill you.

January 6, 2018, 08:09 PM	#18
Northof50 Junior member Join Date: January 5, 2018 Location: Northeast USA Posts: 232	Thank You All I appreciate all the replies and will look into the Lee decapper. As written, I've been doing this for 30 years and have never had the issue. After my first [original] pin broke, I ordered a replacement from Midway. Literally, within the first 25 rounds the pin broke. I then ordered the complete Lymann die with carbide expander pin AND switched to my single stage RockChucker. The pin lasted about the same time. 3 pins - 2 loaders - 2 shell plates. The 2 purchased pins from Miday have been sent back to them. The shell plate for the RCBS system is a #10 for the 223 case. Have it for the single and progressive. I will also check the alignment of the pin to the die, as well as the overall pin length that protrudes from the bottom. I have noticed, that regardless of the reloading system, the priming/depriming is achilleas of every system. In reloading mass is your friend. When dealing with a 3 grain component, issue abound. My pin may have been too far out. I find if not out far enough, the primers don't exit the case, or go down the exit tube - indicating there must be some flex in to the pin, as it certainly looks like it is out far enough to clear the case and shell plate. Again, thanks. Rick

January 6, 2018, 08:13 PM	#19
Northof50 Junior member Join Date: January 5, 2018 Location: Northeast USA Posts: 232	RotDog That looks awesome! Definitely going to give that die a try. Much thanks. Rick

January 8, 2018, 05:26 PM	#20
jhansman Senior Member Join Date: June 17, 2007 Posts: 680	FWIW, I've processed thousands of military .223 cases with my Lee dies, and have never broken a pin. Must be in the technique... __________________ Blessed is the man who has nothing to say, and cannot be compelled to say it.

January 8, 2018, 05:52 PM	#21
hdwhit Senior Member Join Date: June 22, 2017 Posts: 1,011	I use predominately RCBS dies, but for decapping, I use a Lee Universal Decapping die. Thicker shaft on the decapper retained by a collet that will let the shaft move if you his an obstruction. It is simply the best approach to the problem that I have seen.

January 9, 2018, 11:39 PM	#22
44 AMP Staff Join Date: March 11, 2006 Location: Upper US Posts: 28,833	While I realize that everybody wants to make as much ammo as fast as they can, so they don't "waste" their time, I've got time to waste, and I do it really "old school", and have for over 30 years. I don't decap GI brass in my press with a die (the first time). I've broken several pins over the years (both RCBS and Lyman), while the pins are dirt cheap its a pain. So, what I do is, do it in a separate step. I'm not a fan of LEE products, except for one, the manual punch and base decapper. The one where you use a hammer. Its not fast but it is 100% positive. You feel the pin in the flashhole, so off center holes are not a problem (though I do recommend segregating those cases) Berdan cases aren't a problem, because you can't get the pin in the flashhole, so that tells you to LOOK and see what's going on. Also, the sturdy punch shaft works to round out any bent case mouths. Have NEVER broken one of their pins, even though my oldest .30 punch has the head mushroomed out a bit from being beaten on for decades. There is a size for .30 and one for .22. Its slow, its a little dirty, and labor intensive, BUT like reaming/swaging the primer pockets, you only need do it once. I consider it a part of prepping GI brass, PRIOR to sizing. Plus, getting to wack something from time to time is a bit therapeutic! __________________ All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better.

January 9, 2018, 11:52 PM	#23
Northof50 Junior member Join Date: January 5, 2018 Location: Northeast USA Posts: 232	Cool idea 44AMP. Midway is sending me my replacement die. Until then, the idea of a punch is a good one. Thanks

January 10, 2018, 09:31 AM	#24
cw308 Senior Member Join Date: September 2, 2010 Location: Plainview , Long Island NY Posts: 3,863	I use a universal decapping die , first step on the RockChucker . Then wet tumble an size . What quantity are you loading at a time. I'm not reloading alot at a time , when removing primers there have been times I could feel the pin stop but never bent or broke a pin . My have to slow down your reloading . Easy for me to say , I'm not loading quality.

January 17, 2018, 07:45 PM	#25
629StealthHunter Junior Member Join Date: December 29, 2017 Posts: 7	I have had very good luck with the inexpensive Lee Reloader Press and Lee Universal Decapping Die. This was the first press and die that I purchased about 18-19 years ago. I stocked up on once fired brass and decapped lots of brass especially 223 with crimped primer pockets. I then ordered a rock chucker for my sizing/seating etc. The sole purpose of my Lee press is decapping before a good brass cleaning. I have seen a lot of reloaders use the Lee Reloader press for all steps of reloading with good results. I have broken very few decapping pins. I will say this, do not force or rush decapping this way. Sometimes you have to wiggle or align the case for things to line up.