The Firing Line Forums

Go Back   The Firing Line Forums > Hogan's Alley > Tactics and Training

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old June 28, 2009, 08:55 PM   #1
Junior member
Join Date: October 22, 2008
Posts: 416
How do you defend yourself against an angry mob?

This is one low probability-high risk event that does happen and is not out of the realm of imagination. Examples of these occurrences are the following:

- Security contractors and soldiers getting attacked by angry mobs in Iraq and other parts of the middle east.

- Citizens being attacked during the LA Riots.

- Citizens being attacked by roving gangs during various hurricanes and other natural disasters.

Lets say you find yourself on the street and there is a group of 20 loosely organized males moving your way at a medium to high rate of speed. They are about 300 feet away. Under your shirt is a Glock 17 and you have 3 extra magazines stuffed somewhere on your person. You might be able to outrun them, but some of the group appear to be healthy 18 year old males and seem to be coming fast. Some of them appear to have clubs and pipes. They are yelling and charging in a hostile manner. No one appears to have a firearm.
JohnH1963 is offline  
Old June 28, 2009, 09:01 PM   #2
Doc Intrepid
Senior Member
Join Date: May 22, 2009
Location: Washington State
Posts: 888
Get in your car and drive away.

When there are more adversaries than you have rounds (sans reloads), the question becomes somewhat academic...
Doc Intrepid is offline  
Old June 28, 2009, 09:46 PM   #3
Senior Member
Join Date: June 18, 2004
Location: Central Ohio
Posts: 2,568
Many moons ago, . . . there was a movie that starred some karate guru, . . . and at the end of the movie he is in a living room with a whole room full of bg's wanting his hide and all he has are his hands, feet, and a lever action rifle.

He pops the "leader" right between the eyes (bg had on big ugly white rimmed '70's sun glasses).

He then pointed at the second in command and said something like "You're next".

All of a sudden the "mob" toned down, . . . hero left unscathed, . . . and the movie went on from there.

Moral: I believe that with the mob mentality that is out there today (from what I've seen and heard), . . . the above "plan" may be the only thing that could save your bacon. Anyway, . . . backed into the OP's corner, . . . that is plan "A" in my AO. Ya gotta remember that the biggest number of most mobs are just sheeple that found a leader, . . . sans leader, . . . sans mob, . . . to say nothing that I think most of them will find a good reason to go looking for a way out of Dodge when the .45's start exiting the barrel.

May God bless,
If you can breathe, . . . thank God!
If you can read, . . . thank a teacher!
If you are reading this in English, . . . thank a Veteran!
Dwight55 is offline  
Old June 28, 2009, 09:53 PM   #4
Join Date: April 23, 2009
Location: Tampa, Florida
Posts: 76
When they get in range start shooting. As they drop the rest will wise up. If they don't drop them too.
Never compromise, never surrender.
tpareloader is offline  
Old June 28, 2009, 09:57 PM   #5
Senior Member
Join Date: November 15, 2005
Location: free territory
Posts: 198
Hi Dwight,
Yes, figuring out which ones are the Alpha and Beta males will go a long way towards taking down a mob.Tom Brown gives some good illustration of this behaviour in his Tracker series
robmkivseries70 is offline  
Old June 28, 2009, 10:04 PM   #6
Drake Remoray
Junior Member
Join Date: June 28, 2009
Posts: 10
I think I would seek cover then go from there
Drake Remoray is offline  
Old June 28, 2009, 10:06 PM   #7
Senior Member
Join Date: February 16, 2009
Location: John's Creek, Georgia
Posts: 328
Defend against a MOB??

First you shoot the loudest MOB member in the head with two rouds, then the next loudest with two rounds if he is still standing, in short order the rest of them will retreat and be gone. The MOB's are only as good as the loudest (not best) member. Quickly Kill the leaders (Noise) and the rest will leave... Then do a 361 degree check and leave the area....
Steviewonder1 is offline  
Old June 28, 2009, 10:23 PM   #8
B. Lahey
Senior Member
Join Date: March 17, 2008
Location: Indiana
Posts: 2,857
Box of skunks, potato cannon
"A human being is primarily a bag for putting food into; the other functions and faculties may be more godlike, but in point of time they come afterwards."
-George Orwell
B. Lahey is offline  
Old June 28, 2009, 10:43 PM   #9
Senior Member
Join Date: May 3, 2008
Location: Ona,West Virginia
Posts: 1,215
duck,bob weave and find hard cover to shoot from,or better yet if at all possible don't get caught in the situation.
dabigguns357 is offline  
Old June 28, 2009, 10:46 PM   #10
Senior Member
Join Date: April 14, 2009
Posts: 897
I would seek higher ground and make it obvious I am armed.
Kyo is offline  
Old June 28, 2009, 10:53 PM   #11
Lost Sheep
Senior Member
Join Date: January 24, 2009
Location: Anchorage Alaska
Posts: 3,340
1 mob 1 gun?

Reminds me of the Sergeant who passed the order "Fire at will." A private then asked, "Which one is Will?"

How do you tell who is the leader?

Also, this scenario calls for a lot more information. Let's assess the threat in the few seconds I have.

Am I the target of the mob? (To determine the answer to the 3 essential questions: Is my life or the life of another at risk? Is the threat immediate? Is the means to carry out the threat credible?

The added questions of tactics (retreat/withdrawal or negotiation-are these alternatives available and do they give a higher or lesser likelihood of success?) is also open. Can I seek cover? Is my gun the only defensive tool around? and morals, Is this situation one which, next week, I will still feel justified in killing someone?

One handgun against a mob is slim odds. Going down fighting may sound good on paper (or on screen), but is hardly my first choice. Sam Colt's "equalizer" has its limits. My odds of survival may be better in hiding than in fighting.

Besides, at today's prices of ammunition, I would rather run to the left or right to see if they are coming at me or just in my direction.

Distance is your friend.

Another alternative is to pick up a pipe or a brick and start running in the same direction as the mob and yelling whatever it is they are yelling.

I don't have enough intelligence to figure out a good answer to this question.

(Take which meaning of the word "intelligence" in either way you think applies to me. Intelligence: information about a situation which allows conclusions to be drawn or capacity for learning, reasoning, understanding,)

Lost Sheep
Lost Sheep is offline  
Old June 29, 2009, 02:05 AM   #12
Senior Member
Join Date: November 28, 2008
Posts: 240
OP, that is probably a situation where you should try to get away at all costs. If your cornered then you will obviously try and fight back but with that many coming at you at once you will probably be overtaken eventually.
Re4mer is offline  
Old June 29, 2009, 02:31 AM   #13
Drake Remoray
Junior Member
Join Date: June 28, 2009
Posts: 10
Daniel-san best block no be there
What are you doing out on the street in such a situation?

Good grief Jim I'm a neurosurgeon, not a god
Ya know, I just don't speak Chinese
Drake Remoray is offline  
Old June 29, 2009, 06:05 AM   #14
Superhouse 15
Senior Member
Join Date: September 13, 2007
Location: Sunny Florida
Posts: 844
Pick up a club yourself and join in. Do that Sgt York "follow me" wave and blend in.
Superhouse 15 is offline  
Old June 29, 2009, 06:11 AM   #15
Senior Member
Join Date: February 27, 2009
Location: Missouri
Posts: 392
If you shoot someone who is a member of an organized gang on their turf, you are pretty much screwed! With them, its all about retribution. They take this "An eye for an eye" thing very seriously and very literally and I am sure they will not rest until you are dead.

And I have to ask too, what are you doing out in that situation in the first place?

As far as bring in Iraq as a contractor... As Superchicken used to say, "You knew the job was dangerous what you took it!"

"I don't like repeat offenders, I like dead offenders!" Ted Nugent

Last edited by scottaschultz; June 29, 2009 at 07:13 AM.
scottaschultz is offline  
Old June 29, 2009, 06:45 AM   #16
Senior Member
Join Date: September 26, 2005
Location: Northern Virginia
Posts: 6,141
Rex Applegate published a book on crowd and riot control probably 50 years ago. Find a copy and see what he had to say, though it goes without saying that it was written from a police standpoint and not from a personal safety standpoint. But Elmer Keith mentioned the subject. His solution was his ever-present .44.

Regarding security contractors in Iraq, I think they are part of the problem, rather than part of the solution. We could form battalions of mercernaries or a form of foreign legion instead, to have troops under military discipline, but that isn't the American way.
Shoot low, sheriff. They're riding Shetlands!
Underneath the starry flag, civilize 'em with a Krag,
and return us to our own beloved homes!
Buy War Bonds.
BlueTrain is offline  
Old June 29, 2009, 09:11 AM   #17
Double Naught Spy
Senior Member
Join Date: January 8, 2001
Location: Forestburg, Montague Cnty, TX
Posts: 12,109
Get in your car and drive away.

For a mob, I like the last 2 options the best.

In all seriousness, the best defense is to not be there...where "there" is the location of the mob.
"If you look through your scope and see your shoe, aim higher." -- said to me by my 11 year old daughter before going out for hogs 8/13/2011
My Hunting Videos
Double Naught Spy is offline  
Old June 29, 2009, 09:43 AM   #18
Senior Member
Join Date: March 11, 2005
Posts: 3,616
These are vastly different scenarios here.

For soldiers and security contractors, they are in a war zone and can fire back indiscriminantly if they do not back down. That is war and anyone who engages you is the enemy.

This is very different from the LA riots where you are dealing with civil unrest. Just because a mob is moving in your direction does not give you a right to start "mowing them down". Not even the police would do this unless they were fired upon. How do you know you are the target? Now if I was some of the drivers that got attacked, I would defend myself with lethal force if they tried to drag me out of my car and beat me up. First of all, I would avoid areas of civil unrest at all costs. The only reason I would go is if I had to pick up a loved to to remove them from the area of unrest. I would go with several people who would all be heavily armed. Anyone that approaches in a hostile manner will be starring down multiple barrels. Any agression will be met with gun fire. If I was caught in the riot unexpectedly, I would use my car as a weapon if needed. I would lay on the horn and plow through anyone that was intent on harming me. Always drive with your doors locked!

As for looters after a hurricane, I went through some of that after Hurricane Andrew. People were breaking into a mall and carrying stuff off. Are you going to shoot people indiscriminately over property (probably damaged anyways) or are you going to let insurance cover it? What if you owned a convenience store or grocery store? Could you really open fire on people just trying to get food and water for their families? Most people will say that those people should have been better prepared. What if they didn't have the money to stock up? Many people are at the subsistance level. Are you just going to mow them down? Not me. Now if they are forming gangs and roaming my neighborhood, I will blockade the street (maybe the whole gated community) with my neighbors and limit access to residents only. Visitors would need approval from the resident before being allowed in. If a mob approached, they would be warned to turn back. If they continued to approach, a warning shot might be fired. If they continued still, shots might start firing until they turned away.
The ATF should be a convenience store instead of a government agency!
stephen426 is offline  
Old June 29, 2009, 10:06 AM   #19
Senior Member
Join Date: July 30, 2007
Posts: 1,041
I always liked the story about the Sheriff standing there with the double barrel holding off the lynch mob. Someone yells "He only has two shots with that gun". The Sheriff replies back, "Are you volunteering to take one of those two shots?" and the mob backs off. As long as the mod thinks you won't shoot you are in trouble but when you shoot one the rest have a tendency to disburse or at least the vast majority of sane ones.
PT111 is offline  
Old June 29, 2009, 10:09 AM   #20
Brian Pfleuger
Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: June 25, 2008
Location: Austin, CO
Posts: 19,435
I make pizzas faster. The only angry mob I'm going to see is when I'm 10 minutes behind on New Years Eve.
Nobody plans to screw up their lives...
...they just don't plan not to.
-Andy Stanley
Brian Pfleuger is offline  
Old June 29, 2009, 10:10 AM   #21
Senior Member
Join Date: April 3, 2009
Posts: 118
ninja training and focus
flyguyskt is offline  
Old June 29, 2009, 10:21 AM   #22
Senior Member
Join Date: January 19, 2009
Location: WI
Posts: 1,162

This thread is all sorts of FAIL.

It's a trick. Get an axe.

Last edited by goodspeed(TPF); June 29, 2009 at 10:27 AM.
goodspeed(TPF) is offline  
Old June 29, 2009, 10:21 AM   #23
Senior Member
Join Date: March 17, 2007
Location: Western NY
Posts: 925
one degree - Makes all the diffrence

Then do a 361 degree check and leave the area
What does that additional one degree give you tactically???
See Ya!
kayakersteve is offline  
Old June 29, 2009, 10:27 AM   #24
Big Ugly Tall Texan
Senior Member
Join Date: June 25, 2009
Location: El Paso, Texas
Posts: 174
Get away if you can. Failing that...

The situation you described is pretty much no-win. If you can, slip away while they are still fairly distant. Just because some are coming hard and fast doesn't mean they are coming hard and fast FOR YOU.

If you can't get away, keep the Glock concealed and try to be an non-threatening as you can until a threat is aimed directly at you.

If some guy yells something like "Get the big white boy with the bald head, no teeth and a stupid expression", then I would produce the pistol and if he didn't back down IMMEDIATELY, I would shoot him between the eyes, while still trying to find a way out.

Whatever you do, don't start with spray and pray. I would only shoot those who showed themselves to be an immediate threat to me. Like I said, you know why the mob is angry. It may have nothing at all to do with you.
Big Ugly Tall Texan is offline  
Old June 29, 2009, 10:55 AM   #25
Yankee Doodle
Senior Member
Join Date: December 5, 2004
Posts: 619
Announce in a loud clear voice that " I am HIV positive, and am starting to show the symptoms of AIDS. If any of my blood gets on anyone, they are doomed to a slow painful death".
Then, slowly walk through the middle of the crowd and leave the area.
Yankee Doodle is offline  

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:49 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
This site and contents, including all posts, Copyright © 1998-2018 S.W.A.T. Magazine
Copyright Complaints: Please direct DMCA Takedown Notices to the registered agent:
Contact Us
Page generated in 0.10520 seconds with 8 queries