Best home defense shot?

[mr00jimbo]

Lemme guess, 00 or 000 buckshot, right? I went in looking for some today to get comfortable shooting out in the woods, just some regular shooting out in the woods. I tried to find some, but couldn't, and the only thing I found was Winchestr super X "heavy game loads"....2 lead shot.

Now I got to thinking...would a 2 shot be sufficient for home defense? The box says, "Heavy Game Loads" so I'd assume they're used for hunting bigger game?

Pardon my ignorance in the posts, I am making my transition from a handgun guy to a long arm guy!

[coolridelude]

i use 00. you can get reduce recoil 00.

What kind of SG do you have?

i think Heavy Game Loads is bird shot. did it come in a box with 25rnds? if so then it is for birds.

i think most slugs and buckshots come in a box with 5 rnds.

here is an example of buckshots.
http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/66074-7258-2468.html


hope that helps.

[maas]

they will work fine since the intruder is in your house and it wont be a long shot. also the sound of the rack is going to be a lot of a deterrent, after that he doesn't care if you have 8s or OOObuck

[jhgreasemonkey]

I use #1 buck. I just like the destructive results it has given me on random targets. Boards, buckets, cans, old t.v.s, etc. You might be a redneck if your idea of fun shooting is to roam around the woods for piles of junk to shoot.

[mr00jimbo]

Thanks for the replies! Yep it's a box of 25, I guess for birds. Ah well. The shotgun is an 870 Synthetic 18" that i just got about 2 weeks ago.

[sawyerrog]

try some remington tac 8 loads

[donkee]

I just use the Winchester 15 round pack 00 buck from wally world. K-mart has it on sale in 5 round packs for like 1.50 a box around the time deer season starts. Pickup about 50 boxes when it's on sale. Never hurts to have extras......

[Syntax360]

#1 buck is the best you can get - 30% more wound potential than 00. Check out firearmstactical.com - they have a good, scientific writeup covering the best defense load for 12 gauge shotguns.

[scottys1]

Another factor for home defense loads is the pattern it throws and whether or not it shoots to point of aim. This can vary significantly from load to load.

Take a few prospective loads to the range and pattern them at a realistic distance, such as may occur inside your home, from your gun. Knockdown power only counts if you can hit the bad guy with a pattern sufficient to stop his felonious activities.

[gak1]

I remember a medical journal saying even 00 buck failed to penetrate to the spine, so I've grown rather fond of the Winchester Supreme 3" 000.

Hopefully the zombies stay in the movies where they belong.

[Doubletaptap]

Fellers there's one thing you have to remember about blasting someone with a shotgun/any gun, in your home....COURT!!!!
We are caught in a catch 22. Intent to kill. You don't want intent to kill.
The judge is going to ask what type of round you used. For your skin it had better be something that shows you didn't have intent to kill,just to stop the problem.Buckshot is not good for judges to hear,no matter what size it is. Neither is slugs.Or 44mags of 357 mags,silver tips,black talons,anything like that.
On the other hand, if you don't kill the person, he's going to sue your pants off for damages.Or come after you when he gets out of the hospital and healed up.
So we have a decision to make.
What can we blast somebody with and make it a "clean shoot"?
I personally use #6 shot in my 12ga. Improved cylinder barrel of 20".She's a pump. I can't see where someone getting hit with one of those at "inside home" distances is going to walk away.And if they try I'll give em' another.
One thing folks forget about shooting somebody is court. If the judge had a bad day, or is a anti-gunner,or just don't like your looks or attitude, it could all go wrong for you,even if you were in the right.Remember,CYA! If ya have ta shoot em', make sure they're dead.And Oh woe how you dreaded to have to do that.Crying and being in shock will help.

Many years ago I had problems with a couple thugs coming around my garage at night. I had a expensive hot rod in there.Plus I was married and had a 5yr. old girl.I thought if they got brave they'd be around the house next.
One day I flagged down a HPD officer driving by and asked what would happen if I blasted them .
His reply was,"make sure to drag them inside if you do".
Now that's what I call a positive!!

[LSU12ga]

Thats a good point, but you should also be mindful of other state laws.

For instance this is why i love my state.

this is from an article in the paper about a man that killed someone that was assulting a cop, and the man weas perfectly justified. If you look up some stories about Louisiana self-defence youll see its perfectly legal (and occurs often) to kill an intruder before being attacked......

LOUISIANA LAW PERMISSIVE ON DEADLY FORCE

....

Louisiana allows the use of deadly force in self-defense or defense of others to “prevent a violent or forcible felony involving danger to life or great bodily harm.” People also can shoot intruders inside a home, business or car even if there is no such threat — and need not make any effort to retreat.

“Louisiana has the broadest self-defense law in the country,” said Stuart Green, an LSU law professor who specializes in criminal law. “The questions raised in this case are, ‘Was the police officer in imminent danger of losing his life or suffering great bodily harm?’ and ‘Was the killing necessary to save him?’ But even if it wasn’t, the issue in this state is whether his purpose was preventing a violent forcible felony involving danger to life or great bodily harm. And I think you can make a good argument for that.”

you do give good advice about making sure to kill the intruder and being mindful of what the courts will think. However it does not always apply, you may never see a court in louisiana, even if you injure the guy.

Last semester a student shot a robber near campus, the robber was in the hospital and is being charged, the student was told good job and jnot charged.

edit: I didnt mean to thead jack. I would suggest 00 buck, ive patterend it from my 870 abnd it was a nice decently tight spread with an cyl. choke. I like the remington 00buck becuae its 2.50 a box at academy.

good luck on finding one that fits.

Gak: I hate zombies. almost as much as i hate aliens. but way more than i hate vampires. When the zombies come, will you be ready?

geaux tigers.

[revjen45]

In choosing shot size for a SD shotgun you have to consider possibilities for harm to innocent parties. If you live in an apartment magnum buchshot loads are a poor choice due to penetration. With a shotgun you are virtually guaranteed that some of the shot will miss the target. Even If you "got off" legally how would you feel if stray shot killed your neighbor's kid in the next apartment? If penetration is a consideration choose a light bird load- at inside the room distances the perp won't know what shot size hit him. If you have no close neighbors go for the gusto and load with whatever buckshot you find with a pattern you like.

[Syntax360]

Originally posted DoubleTap.
Fellers there's one thing you have to remember about blasting someone with a shotgun/any gun, in your home....COURT!!!!
We are caught in a catch 22. Intent to kill. You don't want intent to kill.

Guys, why does this always have to come up when discussing DEFENSIVE situations? If you had a justifyable reason to drop a hammer on the perp to begin with, what you used to do it is -not- going to be brought into the equation provided your shots were true (ie your neighbor doesn't have a nice bullethole in their front door) and the firearm/ammunition were legal. We always get dragged back into this ridiculous arguement about ammunition, etc., when we all know that hundreds of times a day across gun boards all over the net this arguement is refuted left and right every single time. This doesn't happen. If you had every right to send the perp into the next life, it doesn't matter if you used the most tacticool .44mag in the world loaded with *gasp* black talons. I think it's high time we stop beating this dead horse.

/end rant - sorry

Birdshot makes a lot of sense provided overpenetration is a huge concern. Just keep in mind that it is definitely not guaranteed to penetrate deep enough to disrupt the BG's vitals.

[skeeter1]

I've got some 000 Magnums (why, I don't know), but I think they're too much for HD. I've got a got a box of #2s (goose hunting days) and a box of #5s (duck hunting days). I'm sure either one would would work for HD. At 20-30', they'd open up to maybe 2-3". That should be more than sufficient. 1-1/8 oz. of lead is alot, and I don't think the shot size would matter much.

[Stan_TheGunNut]

I load #4 shot turkey loads in my shotgun for home defense. Where I live, it seems to be a good compromise between penetration/overpenetration. Also, even number 8 birdshot to the perps face is going to make him rethink his intentions. Fortunately, SC passed it's own 'castle doctrine' law, so in a justified shooting, the good guy doesn't have to worry about lawsuits.

['75Scout]

Unlike some other members posted. You should be able to keep all the pellets of buckshot on a bg in you aim COM. At home defense distances you shotgun should have a very very tight pattern. If you can't get every pellet on a target at 10-15ft then I'd get rid of than gun. Also I'd go with any buck, they should all work good enough.

I currently use 00 but will be switching to #4 buck because I recently moved into an apartment. #4 will be less likely to over penetrate and at the ranges it will be deployed should still penetrate deep enough to reach vital organs. I would never use bird shot. It will cause massive tissue and nervous system damage but I'd seriously doubt there would be any pellets that penetrated deep enough to damage vital organs.

[Doubletaptap]

Syntax360, have you ever been to court after a shooting?
I have and what I wrote above isn't fairy tales. It does happen and a person can get his life messed up bad by it.
All judges are not fair,and some just depend on how they feel that day,or how you look to them. Could be something as simple as your attitude in talking to the bench.
Judges are human beings just like policemen. But every policeman you meet isn't kind and courteous.
Maybe you should start spending some time in civil court and sitting a few HD shooting cases.
At least talk to a policeman and see what they have to say about the issue.
Having the attitude"it just don't happen" will come back one day and bite you where it hurts.
It's true most cases are ok, but some don't work out right if everything don't fit into the puzzle like it should.
Arming yourself with the biggest baddest thing you can find is not smart and inconsiderate of the safety of others. And it will put you in the hot seat in court. You'll be asking yourself,"who's on trial here".
I'm not writing for a battle of words. Just to inform those that want to listen to CYA!!!!!! Defensive situations or not,the outcome could surprise you.

On a last note, you telling me if I shoot you with a 12ga. with #6 shot in my apartment,you're going to keep on coming?? Gosh, maybe I need some kryptonite!!!

[CraigJS]

Most any size shot at home defence distances 0-20'+- is going to put a NASTY shot pattern of dinner plate or smaller size into the BG's body.. That said, I use #4 buck!

[glock23777]

Here is my theory. I like #8 bird shot. At close range this is a very effective round. As a prior paramedic I've seen the effects. Also #8 will not penetrate multiple layers of sheetrock so that helps with over penetration in the house.

[hpg]

#4 Buckshot works very good. hpg

[Rimrod]

The larger the pellets the deeper the penetration but you get fewer pellets per load. Smaller pellets penetrate less but cause massive shallow damage because there are more of them. Magum loads have more pellets than a standard load but also have less velocity and pentration. Basically the larger the shot size the better, but even game loads will do significant damage to a human.

At the distances in a home the shot will not spread very much. At extremely close ranges the shot will not spread at all and will act like a prefragmented slug. And contrary to popular belief you can miss with a shotgun.

I do not feel the shotgun is the ultimate combat weapon but is more suited for special situations. And home defense is one of those situation. Good luck.

[banditt007]

reduced recoil if you can get it #1 to 00 aught buckshot, 2 3/4" is top choice IMO.

bird shot is for birds.

[Syntax360]

Originally posted by DoubleTap.
On a last note, you telling me if I shoot you with a 12ga. with #6 shot in my apartment,you're going to keep on coming?? Gosh, maybe I need some kryptonite!!!

I certainly wouldn't keep coming, but a 6'2 300lb. meth addict may. And even if I wouldn't keep coming, with all my vitals intact, I certainly could shoot back. Seems like a bad situation to be in when #1 buck would have done the job a lot beter, but that's just my opinion.

Or even better yet, what's the judge gonna say when you had to shoot the BG multiple times at near point blank range with birdshot to get the job done? Sure would have "looked" (because we're not talking about effectiveness here, we're talking about appearances, right?) a lot better to be the John Q. Public who had to shoot a home invader once, effectively, to defend his family, rather than be the Rambo who blasted away until there was less flesh than clothing.

Not trying to be hostile or get into some huge debate here, but I'm curious what job you have or what prior experiences have put you in a court room after self-defense shootings. Perhaps you could enlighten us all, having been there and done that.

[AAshooter]

Recommending bird shot as a home defense round as a the right answer for the "typical situation" is bad advice. Is it possible to stop and attack with bird shot? Sure. For a given situation, it may work just fine. However, for the majority of situations, can you guarantee stopping a bad guy with bird shot? Not necessarily.

Bird shot has penetration problems for many home defense situations. Yes at extremely close ranges, it penetrates pretty impressively; however, I would like to dispatch the problem before it becomes a close encounter.

In much the same line of thinking, we should all carry .22 pistols for our CCW guns. They can also stop the aggressive bad guy some times. However, I think you would agree that most people should carry a more effective rounds to up their chances of survival.

Although the legal concerns are real, you need to take care of the immediate threat to make sure you are around to worry about the legal problems.