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Old December 20, 2018, 07:00 AM   #1
Mobuck
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Silencer Shop kiosk experience

Not nearly as easy or pleasant as I'd hoped/expected. I had everything entered(picture, forms completed, link to current purchase) except my finger prints but it still took 20 minutes. Spousal unit was only luke warm on the process and it took 45 minutes to get her prints, info, and picture entered. Son went in just after we left and even his prints took 15 minutes.
My take is the scanner is problematic for the average user and does a poor job of recording prints. Out of 20 prints from two people, we only got "GOOD" scans about 40% of the 20 prints. And even after spending so much time, we have no idea if those iffy scans will be acceptable.
In March of 2017, I had prints done at the local Sheriff's office and 9 of 10 were "excellent" according to the Deputy doing the printing. I doubt that things have changed so much in 1 1/2 years.
Oh, BTW, those prints were processed and results returned to my employer in about 4-5 days so FBI isn't the hang up in the vetting process for NFA stuff(as some are claiming). My FBI background check for a security clearance to access "sensitive materials" within a Federal agency took 5 days from the time I had the prints done until I was notified I'd passed.
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Old December 20, 2018, 11:29 AM   #2
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Five days and the FBI sounds like a National Agency Check.

My security clearance in the USAF took months and DIS did the investigations (had to update it every five years).

Good luck on your wait with BATFE
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Old December 20, 2018, 09:20 PM   #3
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Quote:
Mobuck Not nearly as easy or pleasant as I'd hoped/expected. I had everything entered(picture, forms completed, link to current purchase) except my finger prints but it still took 20 minutes. Spousal unit was only luke warm on the process and it took 45 minutes to get her prints, info, and picture entered. Son went in just after we left and even his prints took 15 minutes.
This is why I recommend the Single Shot Trust at Silencer Shop. They submit the Form 4 with only your name. after the tax stamp comes back you simply add your spouse and son to the trust.

Having multiple responsible persons on a trust just increases the odds of problems.





Quote:
My take is the scanner is problematic for the average user and does a poor job of recording prints. Out of 20 prints from two people, we only got "GOOD" scans about 40% of the 20 prints.
First, did no one at the store help you? I've found that more than 80% of the public can't/won't/don't follow the instructions on a Form 4473, much less follow the procedure on the SS kiosk.
Second, the "grading" is meaningless. I've seen the kiosk grade prints as "Excellent" that were smudged and perfect quality prints as "Fair".
Third, if no one was helping you they should have. The quality of scanned prints has a lot to do with how dry or oily your fingertips are. If your prints were faint....too dry, if they were smudged or blotchy....too oily.




Quote:
And even after spending so much time, we have no idea if those iffy scans will be acceptable.
In two years and roughly 500 buyers I've yet to have one kicked back because of fingerprints scanned at the SS kiosk.


Quote:
In March of 2017, I had prints done at the local Sheriff's office and 9 of 10 were "excellent" according to the Deputy doing the printing. I doubt that things have changed so much in 1 1/2 years.
Well he ain't a machine now is he?



Quote:
Oh, BTW, those prints were processed and results returned to my employer in about 4-5 days so FBI isn't the hang up in the vetting process for NFA stuff(as some are claiming).
Yeah. Remember all the way back to yesterday when I said you didn't understand the process? This is an example.
The ATF has nothing to do with the "vetting process"....that is 100% the domain of the FBI. You should know that.

ATF cannot act on a Form 1 or Form 4 application until the FBI returns a "Proceed" on the background check. While the Brady Law does not prohibit a gun dealer from transferring a firearm after the three business day delay....the ATF cannot do so on NFA firearms. They have to wait until the FBI background check returns a proceed. That may or may not include examination of your fingerprints. Yes, that's right, the FBI doesn't run every set of fingerprints from Form 1's and 4's.

I have 4-5 silencers sitting in my safe because one of the RP's on that trust couldn't be resolved on the FBI background check. Doesn't mean they were a prohibited person, just that the FBI couldn't or wouldn't give them a proceed. All have been sitting there for over fifteen months because the trust had to start the process all over (minus that one RP).


Quote:
My FBI background check for a security clearance to access "sensitive materials" within a Federal agency took 5 days from the time I had the prints done until I was notified I'd passed.
Good for you, but has nothing to do with firearms.
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Last edited by dogtown tom; December 20, 2018 at 09:27 PM.
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Old December 20, 2018, 09:30 PM   #4
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Does anyone know if DTT is a BATFE "plant"?
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Old December 20, 2018, 10:04 PM   #5
dogtown tom
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Quote:
Mobuck Does anyone know if DTT is a BATFE "plant"?
That's a pathetic putdown. You'll need to do better than that.
I'm a schoolteacher and FFL/SOT in Plano, Texas.
(and you know that)



Quote:
My FBI background check for a security clearance to access "sensitive materials" within a Federal agency
Sounds to me like you're the "plant".


That you equate knowledge of ATF regulations with being a plant tells me you don't know jack squat about ATF regs or their employees.
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Old December 22, 2018, 08:45 PM   #6
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NOPE
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Old December 23, 2018, 09:39 PM   #7
Areoflyer09
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My kiosk experience was the complete opposite. Prints were easy to get clear scans and the whole process including them teaching me how to use it and paying for everything took less than 40 minutes.
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Old December 23, 2018, 10:18 PM   #8
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I dunno what the difference would be. Even my Son and DIL had difficulty getting good quality prints. I can understand my problems due to arthritic joints and previously injured fingers but spouse and kids don't have those problems.
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Old December 24, 2018, 05:01 PM   #9
dogtown tom
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Quote:
Mobuck I dunno what the difference would be.
Seems like a clerk at the store helped him.


Quote:
Even my Son and DIL had difficulty getting good quality prints. I can understand my problems due to arthritic joints and previously injured fingers but spouse and kids don't have those problems.
It's difficult to roll your own prints perfectly because of human anatomy. Having someone else take your arm/hand/fingers and roll them for you is best.

By "good quality prints" are you referring to the grading of Excellent/Very Good/Good/Fair/Poor that the kiosk provides?

Or were your prints smudged, blotchy, faint, missing areas of detail?


Did you wipe off the scanner glass with the microfiber cloth clipped to it?

Answer those questions and I'll try to help.
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Old December 25, 2018, 09:50 PM   #10
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"Answer those questions and I'll try to help."
Really doesn't make any diff now as the prints have already been submitted "as is".
Scanner was cleaned multiple times
Fingers were cleaned with alcohol based hand sanitizer multiple times
Finger tips were rubbed, thumped, and kneaded before/during attempts
Additional pressure was applied to the backs of the fingers

Results were blotched, uneven, smudged, and had gaps.
In addition, there's no option for injuries. I've had a thumb tip cut off across the main "print area" and re-attached leaving only a blob in the "whirl" of the print and spouse has lost most of one thumb in an accident.
IIRC the ink print cards had a comment area to address these issues.
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Old December 28, 2018, 09:19 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dogtown tom
It's difficult to roll your own prints perfectly because of human anatomy. Having someone else take your arm/hand/fingers and roll them for you is best.
+1. I thought i was "assisting " my local PD fingerprint agent when i was rolling my own finger. She quickly said "relax your finger muscles, just let me press and roll your fingers, the impressions will come out much more crisp".
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