Re-barreling a sporterized Rem O3A3

Pcarney · October 31, 2019, 09:51 PM

I have a very nice sporterized Remington 03A3 that was built by a very talented smith out of Georgetown Ky who is long since passed away.
It has the old 2 groove barrel which has been cut back and tapered to a hunting contour.
I cannot get a good group out of it using factory loads, hand loads or anything.
I would like to re-barrel with a good quality custom barrel without spending a fortune.
Anyone have any leads on a 30-06 custom barrel preferably with a hunting taper?
I talked to my local smith and he said look around online,... somebody probably has one that they took off in favor of another caliber.
I have a bunch of 30-06 bullets and hand loads and want to keep at least one 30-06 in my collection.
Thanks for the help,........Patrick

J.G. Terry · November 1, 2019, 02:41 AM

Using a take-off is risky. Why would the barrel be off a Springfield? Check out Shaw and McGowen barrels and others. That take-off barrel business would really turn me off. I'd be tempted to look elsewhere for my work.

Pcarney · November 1, 2019, 08:10 AM

Thanks for the reply J.G
I will look into the companies you mentioned.

Jim Watson · November 1, 2019, 09:34 AM

Agree, you don't know why a takeoff was taken off.
To change calibers or to replace a shot out bore? The want ad might not give the actual reason.

You might could connect with a target shooter or his gunsmith and get a 30" barrel which you could shorten from breech and muzzle to get a good throat and crown. One competitor said all his friends had hunting rifle barrels turned down from his heavy barrels that happened not to shoot .30 NM well but fine with commercial.

Or you could just send in an order
https://estore.thecmp.org/Catalog/Item/065CRI/A3

I'd get the A3 barrel for a sporter, no spline cut for the 03 ladder sight.

tango1niner · November 1, 2019, 09:55 AM

I have had more than a few O3-A3 Springfield rifles. Most, if not all had 2 groove barrels. I would suggest you do a thorough cleaning of the bore before you condemn it. I have never had one (with a bright and shiny bore) that would not shoot into an inch at 100 yds. The load I typically used is/was 45 grns. of IMR 4895 with a 165 grn. Hornady spitzer or Sierra 168 grn. match bullet.

You mentioned cutting back and tapering so I would ask how thin a profile is it? Most were just cut back to remove the sight cuts, sanded, polished, and recrowned. How is the crown.
Is the barrel free floating or hitting the stock? I would look all these things over well before I rebarrelled. Guns with a conical breech and extractor cut require a little more work than just screwing a barrel in.

T. O'Heir · November 1, 2019, 12:34 PM

What's your budget? Keep in mind that a good smithy is a very busy guy. Just a barrel change can take months. And you'll pay for his time to do it.
Mind you, the easiest solution is one of the Criterion barrels. That $199 is slightly less than what Criterion wants direct too.
Just changing the barrel may not fix the accuracy issue either. You need to look at the bedding, sights and trigger as well. None of which are a big deal.

Ben Dover · November 1, 2019, 12:38 PM

I would have a gunsmith check the receiver face for squareness, chase the threads and install a "Sporter contour" Shilen barrel.

My old Springfield 03A3, .30-06 managed 1/2 groups with 150 Speer hunting bullets with the Shilen barrel.

J.G. Terry · November 1, 2019, 07:23 PM

The advice to clean the barrel and shoot again is very good. If your old time gunsmith had built the rifle as you described I'd bet some money it would shoot at one time. Make sure screws are snug. Also, make sure that Bubba has not been at it since the rifle was put together. It's easy to suggest going to a good gunsmith. Those are hard to find these days. What about your sights? Scope or iron sights?

Pcarney · November 1, 2019, 10:33 PM

Now running an older luepold vari x2 in good shape but was using an even older Universal 4 x with fine cross hairs.
Base and rings are good and tight.
Screws holding stock were good and tight.
Stock is not bedded with any bedding compound,.... barrel is free floated.
It’s been a while since I got the rifle out to really look it over again,.. I’m just getting back around to addressing the problems with accuracy again.
I have other rifles I can use for deer hunting but would one day like to use this old baby to bag a deer,... but it’s lack of accuracy prevents me from hunting with it.

RC20 · November 2, 2019, 11:36 AM

Here you go

https://criterionbarrels.com/product.../m1903-barrel/

The barrel are very good quality ala shooting accuracy is better than original which was pretty good.

With the milling of the profile, I doubt it but if you want to try cleaning. Both products mentioned are the best I have ever found (and yes I looked) and they are non haz and low odor or no odor.

You can use them for the gun and any gun you own. The CK2k is my mainstay for my target rifles (perfect mirror finish after 3,000 rounds) I clean the warm each time. So even if you try and it fails they are not a waste.

Get Carbon Killer 2000 (CK2k in my shorthand) , shoot it till warm (5 shots fast) then with a nylon brush and an eye dropper, drizzle the CK2k on the brush, run it through the bore.

When it exits, drizzle CK2k on it again and 5 strokes with the last one out the end of the bore.

Drizzle again, then run a patch. Repeat till a very light blue color (if its bad it will be about 5 cycles of muddy)

If he has checked it for no copper then shoot for accuracy.

If he has not and you can't tell, then get Bore Tech Eliminator as well and repeat the drill.

If you get evidence of copper (blue on the patch) then once that is gone, repeat the CK2k.

If it was shot and coopered, you can have layer of carbon, copper, Carbon , copper or copper, carbon, copper carbon.

The CK2k is pretty good with copper but not as good as the Bore Tech.

I have cleaned up some mil surp barrels that were god awful to just awful (that is a joke, they are pretty rough if if you look at them with a boro scope, though that has nothings to do with shooting accuracy)

RC20 · November 2, 2019, 11:45 AM

Quote:

I have had more than a few O3-A3 Springfield rifles. Most, if not all had 2 groove barrels. I would suggest you do a thorough cleaning of the bore before you condemn it. I have never had one (with a bright and shiny bore) that would not shoot into an inch at 100 yds. The load I typically used is/was 45 grns. of IMR 4895 with a 165 grn. Hornady spitzer or Sierra 168 grn. match bullet.

We had my dads Sporter redone as the old chamber was a mess.

Upshot is its an honest 1 1/4 MOA all day long, but not better. The receiver face was squared.

The reality is these were mass mfg barrels, Pre WWII they were cut and rough, WWII was the button rifle system.

Basically its crap shoot, you will get a decent hunting barrel out of them almost for sure (though spare barrel were not shot and tested to mil spec standards)

For what you pay for, a Criterion is by far the best way to go if you want a standard 03 profile. Those are truly accuracy produced, very high quality control, mfg stands behind them.

If I had known about them when we did my dads rifle it would have been a toss up in getting it back to as close to original as we could get or the better accuracy of a Criterion would give.

michaelcj · November 3, 2019, 02:16 PM

Douglas Bbl I had installed on a 03A3 action for a "custom" 7x57 shoots MOA all day long with handloads from 139gr to 160gr.

Well worth the money spent on the Bbl and a competent Smith.

RC20 · November 3, 2019, 02:21 PM

PS: All the barrels have their own codes for taper, some are downright pencil which I think is bad (I don't like skinny barrels) and some are bull with none.

You have to look at each mfg.

Criterion maintains the original 1903 profile. Its a pretty good one but there are a wide variety of others.

TRX · November 6, 2019, 12:21 PM

> cannot get a good group

What's your definition of a "good group"?

langenc · November 10, 2019, 01:35 PM

20 yrs ago I had a friend that was taking a community college sponsored gun smith class. A local gunsmith came to the college and supplied all needed tools.

Friend needed a 'project gun(s)'. He used my sporterized 03. I wanted a high priced barrel. They talked me into a new OE 03 barrel, 2 groove, I believe. Cost me $75. It shoots better than me. Wish Id got the old barrel back so I could have sectioned it to see what it looked like 'inside'.

Ill never wear this one out.

October 31, 2019, 09:51 PM	#1
Pcarney Junior Member Join Date: October 31, 2019 Posts: 3	Re-barreling a sporterized Rem O3A3 I have a very nice sporterized Remington 03A3 that was built by a very talented smith out of Georgetown Ky who is long since passed away. It has the old 2 groove barrel which has been cut back and tapered to a hunting contour. I cannot get a good group out of it using factory loads, hand loads or anything. I would like to re-barrel with a good quality custom barrel without spending a fortune. Anyone have any leads on a 30-06 custom barrel preferably with a hunting taper? I talked to my local smith and he said look around online,... somebody probably has one that they took off in favor of another caliber. I have a bunch of 30-06 bullets and hand loads and want to keep at least one 30-06 in my collection. Thanks for the help,........Patrick

November 1, 2019, 02:41 AM	#2
J.G. Terry Senior Member Join Date: January 24, 2014 Posts: 577	Using a take-off is risky. Why would the barrel be off a Springfield? Check out Shaw and McGowen barrels and others. That take-off barrel business would really turn me off. I'd be tempted to look elsewhere for my work. __________________ Intentionally Antagonizing Another MemberInsults and Ad Hominems

November 1, 2019, 12:34 PM	#6
T. O'Heir Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 12,453	What's your budget? Keep in mind that a good smithy is a very busy guy. Just a barrel change can take months. And you'll pay for his time to do it. Mind you, the easiest solution is one of the Criterion barrels. That $199 is slightly less than what Criterion wants direct too. Just changing the barrel may not fix the accuracy issue either. You need to look at the bedding, sights and trigger as well. None of which are a big deal. __________________ Spelling and grammar count!

November 1, 2019, 12:38 PM	#7
Ben Dover Senior Member Join Date: April 11, 2013 Location: High up in the Rocky Moun Posts: 665	I would have a gunsmith check the receiver face for squareness, chase the threads and install a "Sporter contour" Shilen barrel. My old Springfield 03A3, .30-06 managed 1/2 groups with 150 Speer hunting bullets with the Shilen barrel. __________________ The soldier's pack is not so heavy a burden as the prisoner's chains. Dwight Eisenhower It is very important what a man stands for. But it is far more important what a man refuses to stand for.

November 1, 2019, 07:23 PM	#8
J.G. Terry Senior Member Join Date: January 24, 2014 Posts: 577	Screws tight? Scope? The advice to clean the barrel and shoot again is very good. If your old time gunsmith had built the rifle as you described I'd bet some money it would shoot at one time. Make sure screws are snug. Also, make sure that Bubba has not been at it since the rifle was put together. It's easy to suggest going to a good gunsmith. Those are hard to find these days. What about your sights? Scope or iron sights? __________________ Intentionally Antagonizing Another MemberInsults and Ad Hominems

November 1, 2019, 08:10 AM	#3
Pcarney Junior Member Join Date: October 31, 2019 Posts: 3	Thanks for the reply J.G I will look into the companies you mentioned.

November 1, 2019, 09:34 AM	#4
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 18,539	Agree, you don't know why a takeoff was taken off. To change calibers or to replace a shot out bore? The want ad might not give the actual reason. You might could connect with a target shooter or his gunsmith and get a 30" barrel which you could shorten from breech and muzzle to get a good throat and crown. One competitor said all his friends had hunting rifle barrels turned down from his heavy barrels that happened not to shoot .30 NM well but fine with commercial. Or you could just send in an order https://estore.thecmp.org/Catalog/Item/065CRI/A3 I'd get the A3 barrel for a sporter, no spline cut for the 03 ladder sight.

November 1, 2019, 09:55 AM	#5
tango1niner Senior Member Join Date: March 5, 2009 Location: NY Posts: 317	I have had more than a few O3-A3 Springfield rifles. Most, if not all had 2 groove barrels. I would suggest you do a thorough cleaning of the bore before you condemn it. I have never had one (with a bright and shiny bore) that would not shoot into an inch at 100 yds. The load I typically used is/was 45 grns. of IMR 4895 with a 165 grn. Hornady spitzer or Sierra 168 grn. match bullet. You mentioned cutting back and tapering so I would ask how thin a profile is it? Most were just cut back to remove the sight cuts, sanded, polished, and recrowned. How is the crown. Is the barrel free floating or hitting the stock? I would look all these things over well before I rebarrelled. Guns with a conical breech and extractor cut require a little more work than just screwing a barrel in.

November 1, 2019, 10:33 PM	#9
Pcarney Junior Member Join Date: October 31, 2019 Posts: 3	Now running an older luepold vari x2 in good shape but was using an even older Universal 4 x with fine cross hairs. Base and rings are good and tight. Screws holding stock were good and tight. Stock is not bedded with any bedding compound,.... barrel is free floated. It’s been a while since I got the rifle out to really look it over again,.. I’m just getting back around to addressing the problems with accuracy again. I have other rifles I can use for deer hunting but would one day like to use this old baby to bag a deer,... but it’s lack of accuracy prevents me from hunting with it.

November 2, 2019, 11:36 AM	#10
RC20 Senior Member Join Date: April 10, 2008 Location: Alaska Posts: 7,014	Here you go https://criterionbarrels.com/product.../m1903-barrel/ The barrel are very good quality ala shooting accuracy is better than original which was pretty good. With the milling of the profile, I doubt it but if you want to try cleaning. Both products mentioned are the best I have ever found (and yes I looked) and they are non haz and low odor or no odor. You can use them for the gun and any gun you own. The CK2k is my mainstay for my target rifles (perfect mirror finish after 3,000 rounds) I clean the warm each time. So even if you try and it fails they are not a waste. Get Carbon Killer 2000 (CK2k in my shorthand) , shoot it till warm (5 shots fast) then with a nylon brush and an eye dropper, drizzle the CK2k on the brush, run it through the bore. When it exits, drizzle CK2k on it again and 5 strokes with the last one out the end of the bore. Drizzle again, then run a patch. Repeat till a very light blue color (if its bad it will be about 5 cycles of muddy) If he has checked it for no copper then shoot for accuracy. If he has not and you can't tell, then get Bore Tech Eliminator as well and repeat the drill. If you get evidence of copper (blue on the patch) then once that is gone, repeat the CK2k. If it was shot and coopered, you can have layer of carbon, copper, Carbon , copper or copper, carbon, copper carbon. The CK2k is pretty good with copper but not as good as the Bore Tech. I have cleaned up some mil surp barrels that were god awful to just awful (that is a joke, they are pretty rough if if you look at them with a boro scope, though that has nothings to do with shooting accuracy) __________________ Science and Facts are True whether you believe it or not Last edited by RC20; November 2, 2019 at 11:54 AM.

November 3, 2019, 02:16 PM	#12
michaelcj Senior Member Join Date: June 15, 2011 Location: Lopez Island, WA Posts: 279	Douglas Bbl I had installed on a 03A3 action for a "custom" 7x57 shoots MOA all day long with handloads from 139gr to 160gr. Well worth the money spent on the Bbl and a competent Smith.

November 3, 2019, 02:21 PM	#13
RC20 Senior Member Join Date: April 10, 2008 Location: Alaska Posts: 7,014	PS: All the barrels have their own codes for taper, some are downright pencil which I think is bad (I don't like skinny barrels) and some are bull with none. You have to look at each mfg. Criterion maintains the original 1903 profile. Its a pretty good one but there are a wide variety of others. __________________ Science and Facts are True whether you believe it or not

November 6, 2019, 12:21 PM	#14
TRX Senior Member Join Date: September 24, 2008 Location: central Arkansas Posts: 400	> cannot get a good group What's your definition of a "good group"?

November 10, 2019, 01:35 PM	#15
langenc Senior Member Join Date: August 19, 2007 Location: Montmorency Co, MI Posts: 1,551	20 yrs ago I had a friend that was taking a community college sponsored gun smith class. A local gunsmith came to the college and supplied all needed tools. Friend needed a 'project gun(s)'. He used my sporterized 03. I wanted a high priced barrel. They talked me into a new OE 03 barrel, 2 groove, I believe. Cost me $75. It shoots better than me. Wish Id got the old barrel back so I could have sectioned it to see what it looked like 'inside'. Ill never wear this one out.