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Old January 20, 2023, 11:57 PM   #1
tangolima
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22-250 rifle

Sounds like an interesting caliber to tinker with. Itching to get an ar-10 chambering that.

Does it burn barrel fast?

Thanks for your inputs.

-TL

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Old January 21, 2023, 03:39 AM   #2
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It's all relative. And mostly it depends what you shoot and how. If you shoot light bullets at over 4,000, it will toast your barrel quicker than 55s at 3,700. If you engage in rapid fire, your barrel won't last long.

I used to shoot 22-250 from a heavy barreled Remington 700. This one had a 1:14 twist, so it liked 40 gr bullets at 4,000+. One hole groups. Get a faster twist barrel, treat it right, and it will last a long time. Just not as long as a .308.

As you can see in my other post, I'm going to the original barrel burner - 220 Swift. I have been reading Ken Waters' old articles on this, and his belief is that modern steel barrels and sensible loading actually allow pretty good barrel life in these 22 caliber fire breathers. But they don't last forever. A few bucks for a new barrel, and enjoy!
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Old January 21, 2023, 10:18 AM   #3
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Yes, it'll burn the barrel out faster than a .223/5.56. However, if you're not after speed and coupled with the right twist you can shoot some of the heavy long range .224 caliber bullets. You might do an internet search on the .22 Creedmoor, it is basically the same as a .22-250 AI. I imagine you'll see a SAAMI certification on that cartridge soon.
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Old January 21, 2023, 11:31 AM   #4
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Thanks guys. Looks like barrels tend to have slow twist for fast MV with light bullets. 1:14 may be questionable for 55gr.

I think throat erosion happens first. Do you set back the barrel to have a 2nd life, or just put in a new barrel? Barrels are not terribly expensive, but one will cost more than a few bucks.

-TL

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Old January 21, 2023, 12:08 PM   #5
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I never tried 55s in my 22-250, but others have reported success. My 220 Swift is 1:12. "A few bucks" in this game is more correctly "a few C-notes". At least replacing a barrel in an AR-10 is not arduous.
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Old January 21, 2023, 12:45 PM   #6
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1:12 sounds like a better choice. 3700fps is mighty fast enough for me. Swapping out an AR barrel is indeed quite easy.

22 creedmoor is attractive too.

-TL

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Old January 21, 2023, 02:52 PM   #7
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I've had at least one .22-250 since the 70s. Bolt guns, all. From custom built to Winchester M70Varmint. Its a fine cartridge and does great work for what it is meant to be.

1-14" is the usual twist. 55gr and under, its fine. Back in the 70s, one maker did 1-12" eight others all did 1-14". This was the usual twist for nearly ALL .22 centerfires all the way back to the 20s.

Back when the heaviest bullets common were the Sierra 63gr semi spitzer and you were kind of odd if you shot those, it was the "deer bullet" where .22CF was legal for deer.

My current .22-250 is a Win M70Varmint. 1-14" twist. 55gr goes into an inch or sometimes 3/4" when I'm having a good day. 52-53gr match bullets do 3/4" to 1/2" when I'm having a good day. The 63gr Sierras go into 2 inches, or a bit less. Good enough for deer, a bit suboptimal for small varmints.

To get full performance, you need a long-ish barrel. More than 22" is better than less, and 24" or 26" gives you more of what the .22-250 is best at. Speed. Longer barrels allow higher speeds without as much need for "throat roasting" loads.

I would be interested in hearing first hand accounts of the AR in .22-250. Personally I think they would be a dissapointment and possibly a pain in the butt. Not the barrel accuracy or trigger, modern AR pattern rifles can be excellent in those aspects. What I'd be concerned more about is getting them to run reliably. Specifically under/over gassing the action. Also what barrel length? 20? 22? if those are your choices, you're giving up some velocity.

Additionally there is the whole matter of carrying around more rifle than needed. Doesn't matter for bench shooting, but if you're actually hunting, it does. Varmint barrel bolt gun with scope can go 12lbs what is an AR going to weigh without a varmint contour barrel??

Additionally, with a bolt action when you roast the throat, you can have the barrel pulled, set back, rechambered and reinstalled on your action. With an AR, you must replace the barrel assembly. Easier to do at home but you do need an entire new barrel assembly.

The .22-250 easily gives you 5-600fps more than the .223 and even more is possible if you push things. That, to me is a significant difference.

I load for .22 Hornet, .221 Fireball, .222 Rem, .223 Rem and .22-250, Varmint guns, light sporters or heavy varmint bolt action or single shots (other than .223 which I run in semi autos). Not benchrest guns.

.22-250 is king of the heap for me. The .220 Swift goes a little faster, at top end speeds, but the oddball case is it based on just turns me off. The .22-250 is the standard .473" head size which is just better for me.

If you want to shoot the ultra heavy (70gr+) .22 bullets now available, in a .22-250, get a barrel made with the twist that's right for them, not the usual 1-14 or 1-12. Good luck finding reloading data for them in that cartridge, though.

I think its a great round, but in an AR pattern rifle, I have my doubts...YMMV, good luck!
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Old January 21, 2023, 05:02 PM   #8
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Are you building or buying an AR-10 already built? I haven't seen AR-10 rifles configured in .22-250, but honestly I haven't looked. I figured it was a custom build so a 1:8 twist barrel would be just as easy to order as a 1:12 or 14.
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Old January 21, 2023, 05:57 PM   #9
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You can certainly set back an AR barrel. Unthread the barrel extension (special wrench) and set back as normal, almost.

Bear Creek has rifle for cheap. Laugh at me all you want, but even they can't out cheap me. They sell the complete uppers. 16" to 24". I am going full tilt 24". I don't hunt. Why bother? Why not? I want to have an AR-10. May just pick a funky caliber to start the journey.

Well they only have 1:14. If it is good for stabilizing 55gr BT bullet, I'm in. Even better if 62gr is a go too.

Based on what I read, the biggest pain is the magazine. Magpul mag with modified (probably 3D printed) single stack follower works fine with reduced # of rounds. I wouldn't mind.

-TL

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Old January 21, 2023, 06:31 PM   #10
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Just a word from the voice of experience:
If you put a barrel on a 22-250 with a faster twist than 1:12, you will run into the structural limits of your bullets unless you slow your bullets down.
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Old January 21, 2023, 06:40 PM   #11
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A point I forgot to mention, bullet selection for twist and speed.

if all you're shooting is paper, you might look at solid copper but no matter which bullets, do contact the maker and see if there are upper velocity and twist rate limits.

Don't shoot Hornday SX at .22-250 speeds, they aren't made for that (for just one example).
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Old January 21, 2023, 07:32 PM   #12
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I don't think I can put myself to shoot solid bullets. Too expensive. The bullet is too long for stability. The normal stuff for ar-15 is the goal. I have a bunch of 55gr and 62gr BT.

-TL

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Old January 22, 2023, 09:12 AM   #13
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I'd recommend looking into feeding a 22-250 in a AR10. I say this as there is a lot of taper in 22-250 case which may lead to stacking/feeding issues. A 22-250AI or 22 Creedmoor has less case taper and may work better from the AR10 magazine.
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Old January 22, 2023, 11:34 AM   #14
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Similar to ar-47, magazine is a problem. AR-47 has enough popularity for manufacturers to design dedicated magazines. But for 22-250 the only thing is the modified Magpul magazine. It works well up to 5 rounds, I think. It is quite ok for now. I actually single load my auto loaders quite often anyway. Some of my loads are too long to fit in the magazine.

-TL

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Old January 23, 2023, 12:20 AM   #15
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77V

I've had a Ruger 77V in 22-250 for many years, a tang safety, red butt pad model. Bought used with a very low round count, and it has not been shot all that much since, but I cannot part with it because of its splendid accuracy.

Rifle came with a demo target and a five shot. one hole group about the size of a dime and a load recommendation using 4064 powder and the Sierra 52 gr Match BTHP. Without any case prep or land chasing, the rifle shot as well for me too, and I've not run any other combo through it.
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Old January 23, 2023, 01:13 AM   #16
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My "load prep" is FL sizing, trimming to trim to length when cases are at max length, cleaning primer pockets (habit) and loading. Bullets are seated based on 55gr factory loads and there is no chasing the lands in any way.

My Win 70V turns in 1 inch with about every 55gr and a bit less with 52-53gr match bullets. Never done any work to the rifle, other than adjusting the trigger with the built in factory adjustments.

Rifle doesn't really seem to care which med rate IMR Powder I use, and I've also gotten good results with Win 748. Never bothered to try anything else.

If it ain't broke, why try and fix it??
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Old January 23, 2023, 10:40 AM   #17
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I had a .22-250 Rem when they first came out (1960s). I really liked the cartridge and it got me quite a few varmints here in Maine...mostly crows and woodchucks. It was very accurate and I loaded down a bit, to save the bore. It killed at least as well as the 30-06 I was using before. Today, I own a couple of .223s, and don't actually go out "hunting varmints", though will take a coyote or two when I see them. One day, I sat on my bench at the edge of the blueberry field down back and some turkeys were walking around a hundred yards away and to my left a bit. Suddenly, a coyote that may have been sleeping, popped up, about 50 yards away, so I shot it with my .223. It was still moving a bit, so I stood up to get a better angle and when I did, another one popped up about 160 yards away and started running straight away from me. I shot and it was dead when it hit the ground, about 200 yards away. Sorry, but I felt pretty smug about that second kill!
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Old January 24, 2023, 04:13 PM   #18
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Here's a tidbit, you can load a .22-250 and a .45-70 to identical calculated energy (ft/lbs).

Check it out, next time someone touts energy in ft/lbs as being the sole decisive factor. With exactly the same energy one is much better suited for shooting buffalo than the other, and the reverse for small varmints at longer ranges.
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Old January 25, 2023, 09:09 AM   #19
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If your wanting this to function in an ar10 it would probably be a less headache to go 22 creedmore. I feel like your going to need to atleast need to modify mags to get 22-250 to feed in an ar10 . The 22 creed should be a simple barell swap and go.
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Old January 26, 2023, 06:38 AM   #20
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I've had a couple of .22-250s and loved what they do on varmints. I also shot a deer with one and it did a good job with a lung hit. It's not a good idea to shoot at a deer running away from you. It can cause a nasty wound, but the deer may get away and suffer from a very bad hip wound.
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Old January 27, 2023, 11:47 PM   #21
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I traded for 22-250 many years ago. Sold the 250 a year or two later after its purchasing.
"Went out a tavern door and down the road for >cash and a case of Schmidt wide mouths."
I already owned a Rem Model 7 223 before the 22-250. <Littl' cartridge is fast and a hard hitter. But its brass? you seldom find first fire 22-250s laying around.
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Old January 28, 2023, 02:06 AM   #22
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Quote:
But its brass? you seldom find first fire 22-250s laying around.
Top end perormance is rarely cheap, and serious reloaders don't leave brass laying around unless its used up or non reloadable.

you can get 600fps or more speed from a .22-250 than a .223 and for varmint shooting speed is GOOD.
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Old January 28, 2023, 03:47 PM   #23
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Quote:
there is a lot of taper in 22-250 case which may lead to stacking/feeding issues. A 22-250AI or 22 Creedmoor has less case taper and may work better from the AR10 magazine.
Sorry, but that is exactly backwards. A case with more taper is more difficult to get stuck in a chamber. This is where the whole "steel cases vs brass cases" issue comes from. With a tapererd case, you only have to just barely budge it before it comes off the chamber walls, a straight case you have to move quite a bit before it comes off the chamber wall.
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Old January 28, 2023, 04:22 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scorch View Post
Sorry, but that is exactly backwards. A case with more taper is more difficult to get stuck in a chamber. This is where the whole "steel cases vs brass cases" issue comes from. With a tapererd case, you only have to just barely budge it before it comes off the chamber walls, a straight case you have to move quite a bit before it comes off the chamber wall.
Issue with feeding, not extraction. It is similar to AR-47.

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Old January 28, 2023, 04:48 PM   #25
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Tapered cases feed better, too. Straighter cartridges feed from magazines easier but are harder to feed into a straight chamber because you are trying to fit a cartridge into a hole that is about the same diameter as the as the cartridge shoulder, it has to be very precise. Tapered cartridges feed better into chambers because the shoulder is a lot smaller than the base, your mechanism can be sloppy. But they have issues feeding out of a magazine because of the larger base These are engineering/developer issues that are resolved during firearm design.
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