.32 Smith and Wesson Long for Stevens Favorite

[Doc Hoy]

I have read the precautions for posting in this forum.

I modified the breach block for this rifle to be used with center fire cartridges. Rifle is rechambered for .32 Long. I have never fired the rifle.

I am using the dies from Lee, set up for the long cartridge. Case is from Prvi Partizan (.32 Long)

Also using the .311 round nose (93 Grain) from Lee. Length of the bullet is .509.

I adjusted the dies for a nice crimp just over the last lube ring. Problem is that I get a cartridge with an OAL of 1.21 when it should be 1.28. It fits the chamber properly. But moving the bullet out for the correct OAL exposes the last ring.

I will be using BP only in these rounds.

Should I be concerned that the bullet is .05 short?

I have not yet loaded any live ammunition for this rifle. I have not fired any ammunition of this description. The load is not tested.

[RoyceP]

The Stevens Favorite is typically chambered for .32 Rimfire ammunition. Are you saying that you modified it to use 32 S&W Long? Pretty sure that's a more powerful loading. I think you are potentially treading water here.

[RoyceP]

So I looked into this a bit more. What I found was that 32 rimfire bullet diameter is .316" while the 32 S&W Long is .312" diameter. That's not going to work well.

[mkl]

if only for holy black you should be okay.

Should you wish to use smokeless, a load for the short or long .32 should be okay (not the modern .32's !the old ones!!!

The low pressure modern loads [well modern in the 1920's] do not exceed black powder pressures to the best of my knowledge.

DO NOT use modern .32 magnum aor similar loads or your gun is a bomb!

[Doc Hoy]

Royce,


Yes. On the barrel the caliber is .32 Long. A .32 S&W Long would not fit the original chamber so, I agree that the marking means .32 rimfire long. I could not find a pressure for that cartridge, nor could I find pressures for BP loads for the .32 S&W long.

The dimensions of the PP cases are, .334 to 336. (dia) and .91 (case length). PP sells these as .32 S&W Long. After reaming and finishing the chamber to .32 S&W dimensions, the case fit very well. It also fit very well to a bullet described in the first post (OAL - 1.21) I cannot say the fit is perfect until I fire a couple rounds and make sure the case does not change appreciably in dimensions.

MKL,

Agree completely. I will never load smokeless powder in these rounds, nor will I ever sell the rifle.

The new breach block is nice and tight. Firing pin relocated to hit the primer rather than the rim.

I am purposely avoiding the mention of powder choice or charge so as to stay on the safe side of the forum. I have not tested these rounds. I have not tested the rifle. I recommend extreme caution in all aspects of firearms and especially in a situation such as this in which the arm or the round is not the original design.

[Jim Watson]

Since the correct load of black powder is FULL a little variation in OAL will not matter much.

Lots of BPCR shooters do not crimp at all for single shots.

[Doc Hoy]

Favorite has a 22 inch barrel. I wonder if barrel length impacts that decision.

Tnx,

[Jim Watson]

What decision? The "no airspace over black" guideline applies to nearly all guns from 2" Deringer to 34" Creedmoor. You can tinker with the degree of compression to fine tune accuracy, but that will be down the road a ways if at all.

Nearly all, because the Schuetzen shooters will breech seat a bullet and chamber a loaded case behind it, but that is very specialized.

Crimp may improve ignition, residual flare can even help center the cartridge in the chamber. Another one of those things to fool with for fine tuning.

[Doc Hoy]

...in single shot rifles. It appears from your response that BPCR shooters deliberately leave the round uncrimped. If that is the case, what are they seeking to achieve by not crimping the rounds?

[Unclenick]

Navy Arms had some 32 Rimfire ammo made up in the 1980s that I remember seeing in gun shows for a year or so back then. IIRC, like the 22 Rimfire, it used a heeled bullet, which explains why brass for a centerfire cartridge with straight-sided bullets of proximal size would not fit without reaming the chamber out for them.

[Doc Hoy]

Loaded fifty BP rounds with the lead I mentioned above.

I think the bore of this rifle is preventing it from shooting accurately but it does shoot reliably.

I string-fired ten rounds without a hang fire. The remaining rounds were fired on a rest, also without incident.

I noted that the primers are backing out upon discharge. Small pistol primer which is right for this case. (.32 S&W Long)

I slugged the bore and I do get very shallow engraving of rifling.

Bore is pitted.

I like this rifle but it is not really a shooter yet.

Any comments on the primer issue would be appreciated. I am thinking that instead of headspace, the issue is over pressure either from the bore or from the crimp.

The next fifty I load will be crimped less.

[Doc Hoy]

I did not recrown the barrel.

[Unclenick]

Primer backing out is a low-pressure sign. See if you can compress more powder in or go to a finer grain size.

[Doc Hoy]

More pressure would increase accuracy too Huh?

[Unclenick]

It could if it makes ignition more consistent. I would also check that the case is full, as Jim Watson said. Measure your case lengths and your COL, then determine seating depth as follows:

Seating Depth = Case Length + Bullet Length - COL.

With that depth calculated, set your caliper to that number, then use the depth probe sticking out of the back of the beam to check the level of your powder by parking the flats on the back of the beam on the case mouth and seeing that the tip of the probe makes it to the powder surface and sticks in by the amount you want to compress the load. My BP experience is limited to muzzle loading and cap and ball revolver, but it's been pointed out to me that there are dies available for BP cartridges that help compress the charge. I also see Buffalo Arms has compression stems that fit various commercial die bodies already out there. You may want to look at this page. The compression they are recommending is substantial. Claims of increased accuracy go with it.

[Doc Hoy]

I get a seating depth of about .250. Filling the case to about .100 from full, I think low compression may be a problem. I use a card to protect the bullet base.

If case fill is .800 (.100 from full), I compress .150 of that .800. (about 19%)

If I fill to a full .92, then seat the bullet by .250, compression will be greater.

Has anyone seen a chart that lists recommendations for compression? I do understand that the many factors might make such a chart to difficult to use.

[Jim Watson]

You slugged the bore. What is the groove diameter vs bullet diameter?

When I was new in BPCR, the GOEX rep said the starting load was to dump the case full of powder, weigh it, and load that much with drop tube and/or compression die to make room for the bullet. Don't compress the powder with the bullet, it will deform the soft cast bullet.
You could use a short rod in the seating die to save the cost of a compression die.

On the other hand, I found Swiss did better with light compression, only about the thickness of the over powder wad.

[Doc Hoy]

.303 and .306.

Is compressing with the wad in place as easy on the bullet?

Tnx,

[Jim Watson]

Bullet larger than groove is better than undersize.

I was loading target ammo, a lot of CAS and plinkers just hard seat the bullet to compress.

What bullet lube? I used SPG on .38-55, whatever Montana Bullet Works provided on .40-65. A friend and I made up two Internet Recipes, one was pretty good, the other was better off as casting flux.

[Doc Hoy]

Does that translate to higher pressure is better than lower pressure (within limits)?

Lube is a mix of bees wax and lard.

I have had consistent performance (which I define as reliable accuracy, and MV [measured very casually]), with compressing with the wad and bullet in .45 Colt, 45-70, .44 and .44-40. But the bullet and arm will generally outshoot my eyes.

I do not shoot and have not shot for competition since the Navy, pre-1990. I never shoot with anyone around since two people on a range is almost always more than twice as dangerous as one.