Black powder data

RWBlue01 · August 29, 2010, 03:49 PM

Black powder dataCan I get a sticky on this?
Maybe it is because I am away from my blackpowder guns, but this seems like a good idea. I would like to collect some data. I am hoping that by analyzing multiple loads with multiple data points, I can get a deeper understanding.

Please list your data in the following way.
Weight of projectile in grains
Weight of powder in grains (even though we are measuring it by size)
Size of powder (FFg, FFFg)
Brand of blackpowder, or state if you are not using real blackpowder.

Caliber in inches
Length of barrel
Lock (Flint, Cap, match)

Velocity in FPS
Other (Accuracy, recoil, un-burnt powder)

Thanks

the Black Spot · August 29, 2010, 04:03 PM

177 grain roundball.
60 grains of schuetzen 3F black powder
flintlock
33 inch barrel
.50 caliber
1-48 twist

not sure of velocity, hope someone can tell me. it will shoot 1.5" groups at 50 yards.

mykeal · August 29, 2010, 07:04 PM

Just buy a Lyman Black Powder Handbook study away. Everything you're asking for is in there.

RWBlue01 · August 29, 2010, 07:53 PM

"Just buy a Lyman Black Powder Handbook study away. Everything you're asking for is in there."

Very cool, so this can tell me what an optimal load for a barrel length, and bore diameter. (I expect velocity to increase constantly up to a point and then there will be diminishing returns. I expect powder will not burn up in the barrel.)

Or tell "the Black Spot", the expected velocity is for his load?

kwhi43 · August 29, 2010, 08:14 PM

11 inch pistol .32 cal round ball weight I think 50 grs. 17.5 grs Goex FFF
Black Powder .010 patch lube wet. 1200 fps. Accuracy load

darkgael · August 29, 2010, 08:54 PM

Lyman GPR Flintlock. 32 inch barrel 1-60" twist.
Primed with FFFFg powder - about six grains.
.490 cal Lead round ball (177 grains)
0.010 lubed patch.
90 grains of FFg Goex
0.030 Walters Wad over the powder.
Muzzle Velocity = nominal 1900 fps.
Accuracy - three consecutive shots at 100 yards, benched:

kwhi43 · August 29, 2010, 09:02 PM

45 cal Flintlock rifle 32 inch barrel 90 grs Goex FF .454 round ball .022
Teflon coaded patch 1-60 twist 2,000 fps 100 yds 5 shots.

darkgael · August 30, 2010, 02:06 PM

kwhi43: Now that is a nice target. Good shootin'.

Pete

Doc Hoy · August 30, 2010, 03:37 PM

Mine is somewhat old but the data is good.

You have to be careful because there are some errors. In one case a bullet weight is listed incorrectly for an entire table.

Velocity is provided. You may not find ballistic data for every barrel you have in mind but it will be close.

RWBlue01 · August 31, 2010, 07:33 PM

Looks like the book is in my future, but until I get it.....

Can someone look up the velocity numbers for a Rem 1858? I just need a max load and if they have one a most accurate velocity.

Thanks

Doc Hoy · September 1, 2010, 06:19 AM

My book, printed in 1974 did not use a Remington for tests. They used an 1860 Army with a .451 round ball.

With G-O fffg they got:

Gr. Vel.
19 706
22 752
25 805
28 885
31 933
33 979
37 1032

They called 37 heavy enough to use a "special pressure revolver."

Rifleman1776 · September 1, 2010, 08:23 AM

Don't get hung up on data and numbers.
BP shooting is not modern gun shooting.
As long as what you are doing is safe, all that counts is what works for you.
There are too many variables and puzzling unknown variables for strict loading rules to apply perfectly.
Join the NMLRA (National Muzzle Loading Rifle Association) and read the magazine.
The Lyman manual is interesting but it is not gospel.

RWBlue01 · September 1, 2010, 08:51 PM

Rifleman1776, I understand what you are saying, but then again no. Although the book numbers are just that "book numbers" and may or may not match my numbers......

I have been studying terminal ballistics for many years. I have done practical tests. I have done book studies. I look at it from a historic prospective. I look at it from a hunters prospective.

In this case, I was just mentally comparing it to 45LC and 45ACP.

August 29, 2010, 03:49 PM	#1
RWBlue01 Senior Member Join Date: March 16, 2008 Posts: 178	Black powder data Black powder dataCan I get a sticky on this? Maybe it is because I am away from my blackpowder guns, but this seems like a good idea. I would like to collect some data. I am hoping that by analyzing multiple loads with multiple data points, I can get a deeper understanding. Please list your data in the following way. Weight of projectile in grains Weight of powder in grains (even though we are measuring it by size) Size of powder (FFg, FFFg) Brand of blackpowder, or state if you are not using real blackpowder. Caliber in inches Length of barrel Lock (Flint, Cap, match) Velocity in FPS Other (Accuracy, recoil, un-burnt powder) Thanks

August 29, 2010, 04:03 PM	#2
the Black Spot Senior Member Join Date: September 9, 2009 Location: arkansas Posts: 218	177 grain roundball. 60 grains of schuetzen 3F black powder flintlock 33 inch barrel .50 caliber 1-48 twist not sure of velocity, hope someone can tell me. it will shoot 1.5" groups at 50 yards. Last edited by the Black Spot; August 29, 2010 at 09:48 PM.

August 29, 2010, 08:54 PM	#6
darkgael Senior Member Join Date: February 9, 2006 Location: Homes in Brooklyn, NY and in Pennsylvania. Posts: 5,473	data Lyman GPR Flintlock. 32 inch barrel 1-60" twist. Primed with FFFFg powder - about six grains. .490 cal Lead round ball (177 grains) 0.010 lubed patch. 90 grains of FFg Goex 0.030 Walters Wad over the powder. Muzzle Velocity = nominal 1900 fps. Accuracy - three consecutive shots at 100 yards, benched: __________________ “Auto racing, bull fighting, and mountain climbing are the only real sports ... all others are games.” Ernest Hemingway ... NRA Life Member

August 30, 2010, 02:06 PM	#8
darkgael Senior Member Join Date: February 9, 2006 Location: Homes in Brooklyn, NY and in Pennsylvania. Posts: 5,473	Yeah! kwhi43: Now that is a nice target. Good shootin'. Pete __________________ “Auto racing, bull fighting, and mountain climbing are the only real sports ... all others are games.” Ernest Hemingway ... NRA Life Member

August 30, 2010, 03:37 PM	#9
Doc Hoy Senior Member Join Date: October 24, 2008 Location: Naples, Fl Posts: 5,440	Lyman Black Powder Handbook Mine is somewhat old but the data is good. You have to be careful because there are some errors. In one case a bullet weight is listed incorrectly for an entire table. Velocity is provided. You may not find ballistic data for every barrel you have in mind but it will be close. __________________ Seek truth. Relax. Take a breath.

August 29, 2010, 07:04 PM	#3
mykeal Senior Member Join Date: October 8, 2006 Location: Northern Michigan Posts: 2,772	Just buy a Lyman Black Powder Handbook study away. Everything you're asking for is in there.

August 29, 2010, 07:53 PM	#4
RWBlue01 Senior Member Join Date: March 16, 2008 Posts: 178	"Just buy a Lyman Black Powder Handbook study away. Everything you're asking for is in there." Very cool, so this can tell me what an optimal load for a barrel length, and bore diameter. (I expect velocity to increase constantly up to a point and then there will be diminishing returns. I expect powder will not burn up in the barrel.) Or tell "the Black Spot", the expected velocity is for his load?

August 29, 2010, 08:14 PM	#5
kwhi43 Senior Member Join Date: August 21, 2008 Location: Kansas City Posts: 1,393	11 inch pistol .32 cal round ball weight I think 50 grs. 17.5 grs Goex FFF Black Powder .010 patch lube wet. 1200 fps. Accuracy load

August 29, 2010, 09:02 PM	#7
kwhi43 Senior Member Join Date: August 21, 2008 Location: Kansas City Posts: 1,393	45 cal Flintlock rifle 32 inch barrel 90 grs Goex FF .454 round ball .022 Teflon coaded patch 1-60 twist 2,000 fps 100 yds 5 shots.

August 31, 2010, 07:33 PM	#10
RWBlue01 Senior Member Join Date: March 16, 2008 Posts: 178	Looks like the book is in my future, but until I get it..... Can someone look up the velocity numbers for a Rem 1858? I just need a max load and if they have one a most accurate velocity. Thanks

September 1, 2010, 06:19 AM	#11
Doc Hoy Senior Member Join Date: October 24, 2008 Location: Naples, Fl Posts: 5,440	RW My book, printed in 1974 did not use a Remington for tests. They used an 1860 Army with a .451 round ball. With G-O fffg they got: Gr. Vel. 19 706 22 752 25 805 28 885 31 933 33 979 37 1032 They called 37 heavy enough to use a "special pressure revolver." __________________ Seek truth. Relax. Take a breath.

September 1, 2010, 08:23 AM	#12
Rifleman1776 Senior Member Join Date: April 25, 2010 Location: Arkansas Posts: 3,309	Don't get hung up on data and numbers. BP shooting is not modern gun shooting. As long as what you are doing is safe, all that counts is what works for you. There are too many variables and puzzling unknown variables for strict loading rules to apply perfectly. Join the NMLRA (National Muzzle Loading Rifle Association) and read the magazine. The Lyman manual is interesting but it is not gospel.

September 1, 2010, 08:51 PM	#13
RWBlue01 Senior Member Join Date: March 16, 2008 Posts: 178	Rifleman1776, I understand what you are saying, but then again no. Although the book numbers are just that "book numbers" and may or may not match my numbers...... I have been studying terminal ballistics for many years. I have done practical tests. I have done book studies. I look at it from a historic prospective. I look at it from a hunters prospective. In this case, I was just mentally comparing it to 45LC and 45ACP.