.22 conversion kit problem

JohnPL · January 31, 2002, 07:24 AM

My Ciener kit functioned perfectly for the first 500 rounds, which surprises me as I had heard that it may take some time for the unit to "break in". My problems started later. Now I'm getting failures to fire on 5 out of 10. If I re-thumb the hammer back on the round that didn't fire, it will then fire. I followed all Ciener recommendations (Win Super-X hi vel, constant cleaning) but the problem persists. Guy at the range suggested I replace the recoil spring, his theory being that it has lost some strength and is not closing the slide completely, thereby causing light pin strikes, and that the first strike lighly impacted the primer but fully shut the slide and the re-strike then fully contacts the primer. Does this seem right? If it is, can I simply stretch the spring out myself when this problem occurs? How can you judge the amount to "re-tension" the spring? BTW, Ciener has been great with providing advice and willing to do warranty work on the unit, but want me to ship my full-size frame along with the conversion unit back to them for testing, which I'm reluctant to do.

Bottom Gun · January 31, 2002, 12:30 PM

Check the slide to make sure it's returning to battery position next time it starts screwing up. See if you can push the slide forward by hand. If you can, it may indeed be the spring. Don't stretch the spring though. You can't rejuvenate it by doing that. If you can isolate the problem to the spring, call Ceiner and ask them to send another spring.

Might be a piece of crud inside preventing the firing pin from travelling fully forward too. I'd check the firing pin protrusion.

Have you had it completely apart? Might not hurt to take the pin out and run some solvent or scrubber through the slide. Check the pin to make sure the tip hasn't chipped. Check inside the frame for burrs.

I'd also check to insure the slide isn't dragging on your frame. Might want to take a toothbrush and scrub the rails and slots with solvent.

Most .22 ammo is dirty and it leaves a lot of crud in your gun. This is why it's best not to overlube the gun. I like to use dry lube in mine.

If the unit travels freely on your frame, I'd be a bit reluctant to send my frame to Ceiner, but I would send the conversion unit back if cleaning doesn't solve the problem.

FWIW, their service is excellent. I returned my unit to them last year when the lug broke off the barrel and they had it back to me within two weeks with a new barrel.

My two cents.

Hope that helps. Let us know how you make out.

JohnPL · February 1, 2002, 07:12 AM

BG-
Thanks for the advice. One question: How do you remove the firing pin from the slide? Do you punch out the cross pin?

Hkmp5sd · February 1, 2002, 07:52 AM

Get Ciener to ship you a new kit to try in your gun. If it still fails, it's the gun (probably). If not, it's the kit. I have two of his kits, one for my AR-15 and one for my M16A1. The only difference is an extra piece to add weight to the carrier for the M16. I've noticed that the M16 kit works better in my AR than the AR kit.

One benefit of living where I do, I can drive over to his shop and hand him the gun when I'm having problems.

Bottom Gun · February 1, 2002, 10:04 AM

John,

I'm out of town right now and don't have my conversion here, but if memory serves me, it IS pinned in place.
Just be sure to pad the underside with something soft so you don't mar the finish when you drift the pin out.

January 31, 2002, 07:24 AM	#1
JohnPL Senior Member Join Date: January 31, 2001 Posts: 105	.22 conversion kit problem My Ciener kit functioned perfectly for the first 500 rounds, which surprises me as I had heard that it may take some time for the unit to "break in". My problems started later. Now I'm getting failures to fire on 5 out of 10. If I re-thumb the hammer back on the round that didn't fire, it will then fire. I followed all Ciener recommendations (Win Super-X hi vel, constant cleaning) but the problem persists. Guy at the range suggested I replace the recoil spring, his theory being that it has lost some strength and is not closing the slide completely, thereby causing light pin strikes, and that the first strike lighly impacted the primer but fully shut the slide and the re-strike then fully contacts the primer. Does this seem right? If it is, can I simply stretch the spring out myself when this problem occurs? How can you judge the amount to "re-tension" the spring? BTW, Ciener has been great with providing advice and willing to do warranty work on the unit, but want me to ship my full-size frame along with the conversion unit back to them for testing, which I'm reluctant to do.

February 1, 2002, 07:52 AM	#4
Hkmp5sd Senior Member Join Date: December 15, 2001 Location: Winter Haven, Florida Posts: 4,303	Get Ciener to ship you a new kit to try in your gun. If it still fails, it's the gun (probably). If not, it's the kit. I have two of his kits, one for my AR-15 and one for my M16A1. The only difference is an extra piece to add weight to the carrier for the M16. I've noticed that the M16 kit works better in my AR than the AR kit. One benefit of living where I do, I can drive over to his shop and hand him the gun when I'm having problems. __________________ NRA Certified Instructor: Pistol, Rifle, Shotgun, Home Safety, Personal Protection, Range Safety Officer NRA Life Member

January 31, 2002, 12:30 PM	#2
Bottom Gun Senior Member Join Date: October 13, 1998 Location: Arizona Territory Posts: 1,092	Check the slide to make sure it's returning to battery position next time it starts screwing up. See if you can push the slide forward by hand. If you can, it may indeed be the spring. Don't stretch the spring though. You can't rejuvenate it by doing that. If you can isolate the problem to the spring, call Ceiner and ask them to send another spring. Might be a piece of crud inside preventing the firing pin from travelling fully forward too. I'd check the firing pin protrusion. Have you had it completely apart? Might not hurt to take the pin out and run some solvent or scrubber through the slide. Check the pin to make sure the tip hasn't chipped. Check inside the frame for burrs. I'd also check to insure the slide isn't dragging on your frame. Might want to take a toothbrush and scrub the rails and slots with solvent. Most .22 ammo is dirty and it leaves a lot of crud in your gun. This is why it's best not to overlube the gun. I like to use dry lube in mine. If the unit travels freely on your frame, I'd be a bit reluctant to send my frame to Ceiner, but I would send the conversion unit back if cleaning doesn't solve the problem. FWIW, their service is excellent. I returned my unit to them last year when the lug broke off the barrel and they had it back to me within two weeks with a new barrel. My two cents. Hope that helps. Let us know how you make out.

February 1, 2002, 07:12 AM	#3
JohnPL Senior Member Join Date: January 31, 2001 Posts: 105	BG- Thanks for the advice. One question: How do you remove the firing pin from the slide? Do you punch out the cross pin?

February 1, 2002, 10:04 AM	#5
Bottom Gun Senior Member Join Date: October 13, 1998 Location: Arizona Territory Posts: 1,092	John, I'm out of town right now and don't have my conversion here, but if memory serves me, it IS pinned in place. Just be sure to pad the underside with something soft so you don't mar the finish when you drift the pin out.