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November 29, 2011, 01:21 AM | #251 |
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1)good article^
and 2)tom, let me rephrase though I felt I made my point: at the moment it is as good as it gets. I'll take what I can get & the good w/the bad. as for a ccw database. this is inevitable. states keep track of who has permits too, and in fact a federal database might allready exist even though it is virtually pointless @ the moment since states handle their own(all it would be is a list of already existing lists anyways). they have a right to keep track of those that have permits. some might dispute it, but you will need to renew your permit eventually just like a license. now, I have been hearing for DECADES how the DMV is National now that maybe in some places but more often than not it seems to stay at the state...you can purposely or by mistake slip thru the cracks with the state thing(call that the last paragraph babble but I used that growing up in my favor on more than one occaision). Heck you can even get away w/2 licenses...they don't even cancel the old outofstate one when you turn it in upon getting new one in new state
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November 29, 2011, 05:44 AM | #252 |
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It might be established that the right to keep and bear arms is in fact fundamental, but it is still open to interpretation if that means to carry, correct?
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November 29, 2011, 07:36 AM | #253 | ||
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My curiosity is up with regards to where people are living that are in favor or against this bill. Are folks for this bill that are living in states that are the short list of reciprocity states. Here in FLA we are reciprocity with 33 states. Just curious. Maybe the mods could set up a poll as to in favor and against with state of residence.
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November 29, 2011, 08:26 AM | #254 | |
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Quote:
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"The bended knee is not a tradition of our Corps"-LtGen. Holland M "Howlin' Mad" Smith, USMC,1949 Have you forgotten yet? Look down and swear by the slain of the War that you'll NEVER forget. [Siegfried Sassoon,"Aftermath,"1919] |
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November 29, 2011, 10:33 AM | #255 | |
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I am sure location has something to do with "for or against". Those with reciprocity have something to lose, those that dont have it, have nothing to lose. |
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November 29, 2011, 11:42 AM | #256 |
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I am not worried about losing reciprocity - I am worried about letting the Fed get involved in this - because they only know how to do things in a one-size-fits-all mentality - whether it is education, welfare, health, etc. - the gov't devises one solution - but what might work well in one area may not be feasible in another - but that doesn't matter to them. Secondly, once you let this camel's nose under the tent, it will soon be in bed next to you - this can easily go completely against everything with an edict or decree made by some newly appointed "czar of whatever" that will now be in control of CCW. If you really think DC, NYC, and the rest are going to allow you from out of state to carry more freely than they do their own residents, you are kidding yourselves. Things will become more strict, not less.
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November 29, 2011, 01:19 PM | #257 | ||
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If you really think you're going to be able to carry in New York City, Baltimore, or Washington DC with the passage of this bill, I've got some oceanfront property in Nevada you might like.
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November 29, 2011, 03:25 PM | #258 | ||
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Tom
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November 29, 2011, 03:55 PM | #259 |
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guyz, these scotch drinkin, cigar smokin, revolver weildin dudes didn't put this bill together to play games or control you. They did it to help their constituents for the greater good and because they can. Do you really trust them all alone at the state level but think they're picking on you when they get in a pack. Roll with it. There is more power in numbers!
now for what I just remembered why I came back for another post: as for the camel nose and it is amazing how people can honestly see things completely differently, I see it as a foot in the door when this bill passes & that is why the antis hate it. They don't want to give it up because by that point they will know THEY'RE SCREWED(but of course they can huff and puff to get some votes when it happens + I'm fine with that
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November 29, 2011, 04:43 PM | #260 |
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How much for that property?
And yes, I do forgive you.
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November 29, 2011, 05:15 PM | #261 | |
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We're still living with the fallout from that.
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November 29, 2011, 05:45 PM | #262 |
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sometimes you win and sometimes you lose. there are examples when it went the other way. we might have to put a bottle of scotch on this one someday.....
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November 29, 2011, 06:39 PM | #263 |
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DAUGHERTY16
DAUGHERTY16 (original poster), get back in here
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November 30, 2011, 02:57 AM | #264 |
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We'll see what happens.
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November 30, 2011, 08:40 AM | #265 | |
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People are convinced that the FOPA (which, after all is based on interstate commerce, doesn't apply if you are traveling between contiguous states. So if I live in New Mexico and I go to Arizona to buy something, that's NOT interstate commerce? Other people believe that the FOPA allows ONLY for actual travel -- to the extent that it doesn't allow the traveler to stop for gas, food, or potty breaks, let alone stopping to sleep for the night. Does the FOPA actually say that if I'm driving from Maine to San Diego I have to drive straight through, that if I stop to sleep in Des Moines I am no longer under the umbrella of the FOPA? I don't think any of the above make sense. But, given the lousy wording of the law, I understand how people come to have these fears. The FOPA was never a good bill. It was a not-so-bad idea, but horribly executed from the outset. In reality, it's clear that whoever drafted it never thought beyond travel by private auto. |
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November 30, 2011, 09:18 AM | #266 | |
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Nationalization is not the answer, nor is allowing the feds the authority to control it - which is what will happen here We let the feds start to control schools and education some decades back and the kids are dumber than ever - they screw up things very easily and then build a bureaucracy to control and oversee it - we do not need that with gun ownership or carry |
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November 30, 2011, 03:03 PM | #267 | |
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Before the laws were amended, If you lived across the street from a school or were driving past the school you were in violation of the CC law providing you had a CC license. Duh-huh jeez we didn't think of that. Big whoops. As it stands looking at things as I approach 60 years old the federal government has done plenty wrong/get plenty wrong and when it is realized it takes forever to correct it or they just say screw it and do nothing. Living in FLA I am more than happy with the current respiratory agreement that FLA has with other states. Born and raised in NYC I have no desire to go back to the big apple, NJ, DC, IL, CA. This again as others have stated is NOT THE MAGIC CURE ALL PILL. Folks that are so engraved in the 2 nd. amendment and have had no luck getting CCW permits laws changed can always move if it means that much to them.
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November 30, 2011, 03:28 PM | #268 | |
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"The bended knee is not a tradition of our Corps"-LtGen. Holland M "Howlin' Mad" Smith, USMC,1949 Have you forgotten yet? Look down and swear by the slain of the War that you'll NEVER forget. [Siegfried Sassoon,"Aftermath,"1919] |
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November 30, 2011, 03:32 PM | #269 |
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U.S. Rep. Tim Johnson's argument that H.R. 822 doesn't violate state'e rights
U.S. Rep. Tim Johnson from IL, tried to get an amendment to H.R. 822 that would state that Illinois citizens could carry.
http://www.pantagraph.com/news/local...cc4c03286.html Only the first 1/3 of the article is about H.R. 822 the remainder is just other politics... |
December 9, 2011, 08:14 PM | #270 |
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And here cometh H.R. 3543
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/1...n_1138835.html
This would over-ride Illinois state law and would honor non-residents's carry permits and allow them to carry in Illinois. But Illinois citizens still would not be allowed to carry. I just can't take it. It's bad enough that the cheeseheads won the Superbowl, and knocked us out of the playoffs in the process. But now they're going to be able to come to Illinois armed when we're not even allowed to be armed? It's too much Last edited by C0untZer0; December 9, 2011 at 09:00 PM. |
December 10, 2011, 06:45 AM | #271 | |
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Sounds like a bad precedent altogether having DC vote on my state's policy regarding Cheeseheads with guns.
That aside...is he trying to let Illinois citizens get non resident permits from another state, and then use that to carry in Illinois? Are there states that will issue Illinois citizens a non resident permit, currently?
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December 10, 2011, 10:18 AM | #272 |
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Yes there are a lot of states that issue non-res permits. In fact in some cases it's easier for me to get a non-res permit in PA than it is for someone who lives in a state that issues.
The PA statute reads: (e)(1) A license to carry a firearm shall be for the purpose of carrying a firearm concealed on or about one's person or in a vehicle and shall be issued if, after an investigation not to exceed 45 days, it appears that the applicant is an individual concerning whom no good cause exists to deny the license. A license shall not be issued to any of the following: ... (ix) A resident of another state who does not possess a current license or permit or similar document to carry a firearm issued by that state if a license is provided for by the laws of that state, as published annually in the Federal Register by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms of the Department of the Treasury under 18 U.S.C. 921(a)(19) (relating to definitions). So if you live in a state that issues, you have to have a CCW permit from that state. The state that doesn't issue CCW permits of any kind to anyone, no way no how: ILLINOIS If you live in a state that issues without too much hassle then there is no advantage, but in some cases it is easier for me to get a PA CCW than it would be, for instance for someone who lives in CA and is being hassled and denied their CCW by their local anti-gun constabulary. I think NJ might be another example of how it would be easier for me to get a PA permit than someone in NJ. |
December 31, 2011, 01:43 PM | #273 |
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just a matter of time
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January 14, 2012, 10:58 AM | #274 |
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Works both ways
If there is a reciprocity law passed, could not New York Calif and Ilannoy require all other states adhere to THEIR policy of no guns unless you are a criminaL?
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