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Old July 23, 2018, 07:24 AM   #1
wild cat mccane
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SBR steps...

Hello there,

There are a lot of write ups on creating an SBR...but none seem to be in order. Could I get a few things cleared up for creating an SBR for a lower I already own?

-Most rookie question: you can SBR a lower you already own? You might laugh, but I swear most How to SBR articles talk about your dealer doing almost everything.

-I don't see the benefit of the trust vs the individual. How wrong am I?

-From Utah, it looks like I only have to notify the CLEO. Okay. Is that notify the CLEO at the time I submit the form to the ATF (without even knowing if it will be approved) or after? Seems a bit weird not knowing if you are approved or not.

-At what stage does the lower get engraved? Do you wait for the approval and have it engraved? Seems obvious, but a lot of these How to SBR articles never actually state if that is part of complete the SBR form or done after you know you are approved.

Thank you.
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Old July 23, 2018, 08:18 AM   #2
marine6680
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Yes you can SBR something you already own. You just can't assemble bit into the SBR until after approval.with ARs, many make it a pistol, then put on the stock once the approval comes in.

The trust... It's more of a hasle now than it used to be.

The benefits of a trust is that you do not have to accompany the SBR when someone on the trust is using it. As you can't simply just loan out an SBR to anyone. But they can use it in your presence.

It also becomes a benefit for when you pass away... It's easier to transfer the SBR to a member of the trust.

As far as when to notify the CLEO... At the beginning of the process seems the way to go... But I guess how your state handles such things is important. Needing CLEO permission or sign off to possess an SBR means getting that done before plopping down $200 for the tax stamp seems a good move.

The lower should get engraved after approval... I believe. No need to engraved anything without approval, and I think you have to put your stamp number on it. You can't make it an SBR until approval, you can engrave during the conversion process.
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Old July 23, 2018, 08:18 AM   #3
Destructo6
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Quote:
you can SBR a lower you already own?
Yep. You can do everything without a NFA dealer. For a suppressor, he does the paperwork, for the most part.
Quote:
I don't see the benefit of the trust vs the individual. How wrong am I?
If you would like other folks, family/friends say, possess the item, a trust is probably the way to go. If you don't anticipate anyone else using it, there isn't really an advantage. In days past, a trust was a way around the CLEO sign off, but with the 41f change 2 years ago, that advantage is gone (change to notification to CLEO, but not approval by CLEO)
Quote:
Okay. Is that notify the CLEO at the time I submit the form to the ATF
It's at the time of submission. It's merely a notification of intent to manufacture/purchase. You can just drop the form at the CLEO office. If they choose to round file it, it really doesn't matter as you've done your required part.
Quote:
At what stage does the lower get engraved? Do you wait for the approval and have it engraved? Seems obvious, but a lot of these How to SBR articles never actually state if that is part of complete the SBR form or done after you know you are approved.
You should have it engraved prior to configuring it as a SBR. I suppose you could do it even before you file the paperwork.
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Old July 23, 2018, 08:00 PM   #4
raimius
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Yes, you can SBR (Form 1) a firearm you already own, or you can buy one, or you could make the whole thing yourself.

Decide what you are going to do, then fill out the form, paying attention to the specific details it asks for. Then, send the form, finger prints, pictures, and check to the ATF, as well as sending the notification form to your local CLEO. Then wait...
Once you get the form back, approved, you can make (Form 1) or transfer (Form 4), the SBR.
Personally, I would wait to do the engraving until you have the form back, but nothing says you can't engrave firearms that aren't yet NFA items
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Old July 25, 2018, 12:04 AM   #5
Theohazard
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Destructo6 View Post
You can do everything without a NFA dealer. For a suppressor, he does the paperwork, for the most part.
No, it has nothing to do with whether it's an SBR or a silencer, it has to do with whether you're making the NFA item yourself or whether you're buying an existing one.

If you're making it yourself (for example, you're buying an AR lower and building it into an SBR, or you're making a silencer out of steel tubing and freeze plugs) you have to submit and receive back an approved ATF Form 1 and also have your item engraved with your name and location before you assemble it.

If you're buying an existing NFA item (for example, a factory-made SBR or silencer purchased from an individual or a dealer) then you can't take possession of the item before submitting and receiving back an approved ATF Form 4. No engraving is required by you since the item will already be engraved with the required information.

When you're buying an existing NFA item from a dealer on a Form 4, most dealers will help you with the paperwork or even do it entirely themselves and simply have you sign it. If you're making and registering your own NFA item with a Form 1 then you're on your own with the paperwork, and if you're buying an existing NFA item from a private individual on a Form 4 either the seller or the buyer needs to complete and submit the paperwork, but both have to sign it.

As far as the details of how to fill out a Form 1 or Form 4, there are many step-by-step "how to" sources online.
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Old July 25, 2018, 03:16 PM   #6
FrankenMauser
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Assuming you have a lower receiver in mind, already in your possession:

Get finger print cards and passport photos.

Fill out the Form 1. Attach photos, finger print cards, and check as directed in the instructions. (My dealer likes tape on the back of the photos and paper clips for the cards and check. I did the same for my Form 1.)

Mail the ATF Copy and ATF Copy 2 together, and drop the CLEO copy at the Sheriff's office. (Some people mail them. I hand-deliver.)

Wait. (Get it engraved in the mean time, if you'd like.)

Once the stamp comes back in 7-13 monhts, get it engraved if you haven't already done so.

Only after the stamp is approved and the receiver is engraved, can you assemble the SBR. It can be configured as a rifle or pistol (whatever it may be), until then. But don't configure it as an SBR until approved and engraved.
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