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November 19, 2018, 08:13 PM | #51 |
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My choice for best is the 327 Federal.
It's the only round introduced in this century. Takes advantage of modern metallurgy. Can fit 6 rounds in small frame revolvers. It can have, depending on factory load, less recoil than 357, but more effective than 38+P (eg, Federal Hydra shok). Or full power with 400+ FPE and 1300 fps from a 2" snub with full power loads (eg, 100 or 115 gr Gold Dots). And, if you want a light load, there is 32 H&R magnum. 327 Federal is the best caliber for snub revolvers going. |
November 19, 2018, 09:33 PM | #52 |
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double post
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November 19, 2018, 09:35 PM | #53 | |
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The only thing that .327 has going for it is six rounds in the small revolvers, but now with the likes of Kimber K6, even that is no longer a huge advantage.
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November 19, 2018, 09:48 PM | #54 |
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I use staggered loads in my Charter Alumium framed revolver .. Of Federal 130gr HST and Winchester 147gr LWC
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November 20, 2018, 11:52 AM | #55 | |
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The closest one I can find is the Buffalo Bore Outdoorsman which is a less. And it's a hardcast flat nose -- not really a good SD round. |
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November 20, 2018, 12:46 PM | #56 |
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The Buffalo Bore product 20A/20 is the same velocity and weight as the outdoorsman, but a LSWCHP (Lead semiwadcutter hollow point). I just shot some yesterday, and it has the same energy as the outdoorsman. Shown in may YT videos to mushroom out of a 2" barrel.
Feels like a magnum load in my 3" LCRX. I had to switch to rubber grips to enjoy shooting this load! And according to my own chrono tests, this load was hotter or equal to Armscor and Magtech .357 158 grain ammo.
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From the sweet grass to the slaughter house; From birth until death; We travel between these two eternities........from 'Broken Trail" Last edited by HighValleyRanch; November 20, 2018 at 12:51 PM. |
November 21, 2018, 12:41 AM | #57 |
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the ultimate revolver round for.....
38sp wadcutters because i consistently make hits from the first shot and a snubbie conceal carries nicely.
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November 25, 2018, 10:12 AM | #58 |
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I carry a 135gr Speer GD loaded over hs-6 in my 2.12inch barreled j-frame 357lite is what I call the load because I downloaded to reduce muzzleflash. Out of this gun I suspect the energy of this load is approximately equivalent to 9mm+p+. Not a real 357.
I’ll also carry a speed reloaded with a similar 357 lite load with the 140gr xtps. On my property I don’t have as much of a need for the hollow points so I’ll carry 190gr rnfp at a near max to 357 load. I live in town but coyotes have been known to get into chicken coops around here I’m considering replacing my carry gun with a 6 or 7 shot 357mag with a 3-4 inch barrel. All the loads I mentioned would get a preformance boost with a larger frame longer barreled S&W. |
November 25, 2018, 10:31 AM | #59 |
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I don't have much of a stake in the discussion as my revolver is not my EDC. It does ride in my glove compartment though.
It is an older Taurus 66 4" .357 Magnum. I don't have anything super fancy in it, just some 125gr JSP from Walmart. It is mainly a range gun. That being said, I would not carry a short barreled .357 or .38 for self defense. Plenty of tests have shown that out of a short barrel, even 9mm out of a semi automatic pistol will have similar performance to a .357 magnum. I believe this is for 2" guns. 9mm has a lot less blast and is easy to shoot. Revolvers are harder to conceal and have limited capacity. If I had to carry my .357 I would, and wouldn't really feel underfunded. But for the same size and weight I could carry a full-size all steel 9mm like my CZ-85b and have over 2x as many rounds on hand. I don't know anything about the other cartridges being discussed. I would like to own a .44 Magnum some day though. Sent from my SM-G930R4 using Tapatalk |
November 25, 2018, 01:32 PM | #60 | |
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Show me a 9mm that will produce over 600 FPE and I will be a believer.
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November 25, 2018, 03:29 PM | #61 | |
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And its certainly true what is said about 2" revolvers regarding muzzle flash. revolvers are preferred, by me, in the role of conceal carry, Pocket, BUG/get off me gun. Scenarios involving entanglement and/or drawing from concealment under stress (I have no combat training or experience) are exactly why i will always have my 357 revolver (6shot 327mag is a good candidate) easily accessible, regardless of if I also carry something full size. For this role, I want something that hits harder than a 9mm despite recoil and flash. Ultimate, .357Mag has the flexibility to be the best for me (id really like a 3-4"barrel) . Im also very curious about .44spl/mag, I could probably be sold on that. Last edited by NorthIDIndependent; November 25, 2018 at 03:34 PM. Reason: rephrasing |
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November 25, 2018, 05:10 PM | #62 | |
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November 25, 2018, 06:16 PM | #63 |
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By "revovler round" I'll assume you mean with a rim. I want to say while rimless, it's only used in revolvers currently and that would be 10mm Magnum with a properly made bullet and roll crimped, but since the likely focus is on rimmed, I'll stay within the limits of rimmed cartridges.
I can tell you that .44 and .45 calibers are not it because while they're still good choices, the size of the revolvers is what holds them back; the Charter Arms is the only exception here, but I don't think it's better than .357. Does that mean I think .357 is? It's sure got the track record, tho I still think .327 is a good choice, but is held back due to lack of ammo, and if someone made a properly sized .41 caliber revolver and a 180 grain JHP load that gets 1000 fps from a 3 inch barrel, it would be an excellent choice. Those things being what they are, .357 is currently the ultimate self defense revolver round. If there were more options in .327, say that 115 grain Speer Gold Dot ammo came back, it'd be a tough choice.
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November 25, 2018, 07:24 PM | #64 |
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There is no such thing. There is no ultimate round. All there is an assortment of needs, and assortment that can fill those needs.
For a snub, the ultimate may be either 9mm, .38, .327, .357, you can easily use any of those cartridges as a good combat round in a snub. they work and mostly work well. It all depends on what loads you want to use and what gun you want to use. For a conventional size it's hard to call the .38 the ultimate, and equally hard to call the .357 the ultimate. You can use .38 in the J frame, and use heavy rounds, and have great capacity to kill, or you can get a K frame in .357, also with great power but with tradeoffs. You could get a big old hogleg and use the .44 or .45 rounds, or use a more compact one with fewer available rounds, and you're still at an impasse, will the bigger rounds work better? Sure, they might, but what are all of the tradeoffs? You could even go to the N frame smith with the .45 acp moon clips and have a truly effective round that is better than the .44 in almost every possible way. You can pick one and call it the ultimate, but in the very simplest terms, calling anything "the best" is almost just talking nonsense. What is the most appropriate, works most effectively, etc... Pepsi or coke, mcdonalds or burger king, jack daniels or wild turkey? I used to hear the kids in high school arguing over winston, marlboro, camel, or cools. They never resolved which one was best.
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November 25, 2018, 07:25 PM | #65 |
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You must take into account how well you can fire that gun and round. You can't stop a fight if you can't shoot the darned thing.
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November 25, 2018, 08:34 PM | #66 | |
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According to Shooters Calulator, 180 grain at 1246 fps equals 621 fpe. YEP, it was out of my own .357 LCR as posted on youtube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C8gDwX4nwuQ
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November 26, 2018, 08:12 PM | #67 |
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So to recap, it's unlikely that any one particular caliber will be the absolute best for every person in every possible situation. If you want more power per round then you've either got to haul around a bigger revolver all day or you've got to accept a higher potential for hearing damage should you need it in a defensive situation. If you want higher capacity (and don't want to carry a semi-auto) then you've either got to haul around a bigger revolver all day or you've got to accept a smaller caliber.
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November 27, 2018, 08:55 PM | #68 |
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Cosmodragoon, the criteria I set out with was narrow in scope, basically a self defense round against a human attacker that the average shooter could handle reasonably well.
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November 28, 2018, 12:27 AM | #69 |
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Humans? 357 Magnum! 44 Special is no joke either.
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November 28, 2018, 08:23 AM | #70 |
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I got it, JERRYS. I'm sure you can see from the debate that there is no single best. However, there are lots of good choices and the right one depends on a bunch of particular details. Did I miss a victory on big and slow versus small and fast within your narrow scope?
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November 28, 2018, 08:38 AM | #71 |
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I prefer low pressure, sub sonic ammo for revolvers like .38 Spl, .44 spl, .45 colt, etc.
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November 28, 2018, 01:55 PM | #72 | |
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Why do I say that? For ten years I ran my own firearms training business, qualifying people for concealed carry permits and running self-defense classes. I trained well over 1000 people during those years, and I can count on one hand the number of men who could handle a full power 357 Magnum in realistic training drills. Sure they can manage slow fire, but put the pressure on and accuracy (the point of the exercise) falls apart. And the smaller and lighter the gun the worse it gets. A full power Magnum in a duty size steel revolver can be controlled by someone who practices with full power ammunition. The problem is the OP's average shooter doesn't practice nearly enough and they don't practice the right way, doing the right things. I'll wait for the arguments but you can't change 10 years of observation and experience. Dave
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November 28, 2018, 02:27 PM | #73 | |
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Agree with Dave T. In that a .38 Spl (standard P) 158 gr. lead hollowpoint such as Buffalo Bore 38 Spl, 158 gr. LSWHP fills the bill imo. It is controllable by more people of average skill level and:
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Last edited by riverdog; November 28, 2018 at 02:56 PM. |
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November 29, 2018, 12:37 AM | #74 | |
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