I want to reload, where to start?

[Smoke & Recoil]

Hey SARuger, have you started the purchase process yet ?

[jimbob86]

The salesperson there said that I needed to be shooting 15,000 rounds a year or it wasnt cost effective to reload. I cant see me ever shooting past 3000 rounds a year.

The "salesperson" is not only ill informed, he's incompetent, since his job is to help you buy stuff from Sportsman's Warehouse.

If you are shooting 44Mag, you should be able to get a Lee Turret kit and dies paid for in savings over factory ammo in pretty short order......

The Lee Turret kits are only like $125 at Midway, and a set of carbide dies are under 30 bucks.....

With Sportsman's Warehouse charging between 75 cents to a buck a pop for 44mag, and ...

4 cents for a primer, 10 cents worth of H110, 28 cents for a 240gr Hornady JHP, 34 cents ea. for new, unprimed brass you can use over and over and may not even need if you saved the brass from the factory ammo you shot, so we'll call it 4 cents ..... 4+4+10+28= 46 cents a shot for all premium components without buying in bulk ...... save 40 cents a shot- you'd have to shoot just over 300 rounds of .44Mag to pay for your press with the savings ....... less if you buy any of the stuff in bulk, or don't buy top name brand stuff at pricey places like Cabela's which was where I got the above prices......

44Mag is a large, straightwalled pistol case, and would be just about ideal for a new reloader to start on. Go for it!

[Fatal Wound]

Asking questions, research on web, reading is the best places to start. Have fun.

[sixgunluv]

Get you a
(1. RCBS Single Stage press/powder measure
(2. RCBS hand priming tool/w small primer rod
(3. RCBS 3 die carbide/taper crimp 9mm set
(4. Scale
(5. Digital Micrometer
(6. 9mm shell holder
9mm brass, bullets and small pistol primers. At least a lb of HS-6.

Oh yea...and some reloading manuals.

Once you get that come back here and we'll get you started.

[TRDFurgesson]

I would start off with a reloading manual or two. The Hornady Reloading Handbook is very good and so is the Lyman Handbook. They will cover everything you need for equipment and knowledge.

[SARuger]

Hey SARuger, have you started the purchase process yet ?

Not yet but I might very soon. I'm shooting more than I thought I would and I have a nice collection of brass.

Plus I just bought an old Savage 340 30-30 bolt gun and it would be nice to load some pointy stuff for it.

Calibers that I will reload and in order;

.223
30-30
.44mag
9mm
.38spcl
.357
.243
30-06

If I could be all-in for less than $500 I would do it and I think I could save that much in short order

[Road_Clam]

The hotly debated subject of "saving money by handloading" has been beat to living death here and on every other forum. Some argue you save money, some argue you don't save money but you simply can shoot more quantities than if you did not reload. My take is the later. IMO you will NOT save money by embarking into handloading. Handloading is a substantial initial investment. You looking at a minimum of $700 by the time you get a kit and buy all the necessary components. That being said, you are already $700 "in the red". Over time of loading rounds you incrementally diminish this red number but it takes shooting a LOT of rounds to completely absorb the initial purchase cost. Some argue this logic and I don't understand why but they do. I got into handloading for two reasons, first was to gain precision as I wanted to get into mid range precision rifle. Second was to become more independent of stupid internet false gun panics. Saving money is not a concern, and now that I have over $8K invested into handloading and components I can happily say i'm having fun, learning a deep skillset , and am independant of stupid gun panics !

[849ACSO]

If you're still talking a couple hundred rounds per year per caliber besides shotgun, I would look at a Lee Hand Press. The kit is about $60 and then a set of dies for each caliber.

Should you decide later you want to spring for a turret or bench mounted press, the dies can still be used there. I started with the hand press several years ago, and loaded many (thousands) rounds with it. I still use it for 45-70, as I'm usually only loading 20 or so at a sitting. I will also use it for new load development for rifles, as I can put what I need to reload a caliber in a small toolbox and take it to the range.

I now use the Lee classic turret that self indexes for all handgun rounds. I can do 150 or so per hour. I use the turret in manual index for rifle.

[Road_Clam]

+1 for the LEE classic turret. I got one used for short money and it's proved to be a big time saver when banging out larger lots of bulk type ammo. I've got mine tooled up for 40 s&w pistol, 223 AR bulk and 460 s&w mag.

[ripnbst]

At your given usage rates I don't think you are into reloading territory yet. At least I wouldn't be. When you are buying ammo by the case of 1000 rounds in any caliber and having to order more than twice a year then you are there. It doesn't sound like you are even close to that, no offense.

I agree with previous posts on shotgun reloading. I don't care what the round count is, not worth it.

If you want to reload just to reload then heck yeah, by all means go for it. But in terms of "I reload because it is cheaper" I wouldn't say you are there.

[Lost Sheep]

Originally Posted by Nick_C_S

You were right to disagree. I've said this before, and I'll say it again: The decision to handload should not be about ammunition cost savings.

Here's one man's take on it:

The fish I catch might cost more than the fish I buy;
The veggies I grow might cost more than the those I buy;
The ammunition I shoot might cost more than retail;
Why do I fish, garden and handload?
If you have to ask why, you probably won't understand; these activities enrich my life.

Actually, to tell the truth, I do calculate the cost of my ammunition, fish and zuccini. I even include the dollar value of my time.

Here is an essay I wrote enumerating some of the reasons:

Why reload?

Let me count the ways:

Economy: Depending on what cartridges you are reloading (and whether or not you want to count your time and the up-front equipment costs) you can save anywhere from just a little to 80% or more of your ammo costs. (9mm is very close to no savings. 500 S&W, my friend's ammo costs are $0.75 per round, factory loaded ammo is $3.00 each for comparable ammo. More exotic calibers (especially rifle calibers) can save even more. Some rounds are not even available on a regular basis at any price.

Quality: Ammo you craft yourself can be tuned to your firearms particular characteristics. Handloaders for rifles quite often find some individual guns have quite striking differences in group size when shooting tuned ammunition.

Knowledge: As you study reloading, you will, perforce, also study internal ballistics. The study of internal ballistics leads into the study of how your firearms work. That cannot be a bad thing.

Customization: Ammo you load yourself can be tuned to your particular needs. My friend with the 500 S&W loads full power loads and "powder puff" loads that clock 350 grain slugs a little under 800 feet per second. I know that's more than a G.I. 45 ACP's power and momentum, but they shoot like 22 rimfire in that big, heavy gun. Great for fun, familiarization, training and letting the curious bystander go for a "test drive" with a super-light load, a medium load, a heavy load and, if they are still game one of the big boomers. This tends to avoid the "rear sight in the forehead" mark.

Satisfaction: Punching small bunches of small, medium or large holes in paper or bringing down a game or food animal with ammunition you crafted yourself has a good deal of satisfaction. Same reason I prefer to make my own biscuits instead of store-bought.

Smug satisfaction: When the ammo shelves are bare during a market or political scare, loaders are demonstrably less affected by the shortages. A couple of pounds of powder, a thousand primers and bullets (or few pounds of lead) and a hundred cartridge cases wouldn't fill a small book carton, but lets the loader know he can shoot while price-gougers take advantage of non-loaders.

Self-satisfaction: The repetitive, calm, attentive concentration of the reloading activities is often found to be so much fun as to bring to the shooter's mind the question, "Do I reload so I can shoot shoot or do I shoot so I can reload?". Some find loading to be as satisfying a hobby as shooting or fly-tying or many other hobbies.

The more fanatical among us combine a couple of the features I have mentioned and, instead of shooting for bullseye accuracy at the range, reload in a search for the "magic load" that achieves perfection in a given rifle. Then, they move on to the next target, which is another rifle and another tuned load. But you do have to be at least a little fanatical to even get it. It is the hunt they seek, for they enjoy the quest more than the goal.

Lost Sheep

[SARuger]

I was at Sportsmans Warehouse yesterday. I spent an hour in the reload isles. Even had a starter kit in the buggy. But I put it back.....

I ended up spending $120 on ammo that will be shot up and gone in an hour at the range.

I'm spending at least $100 a week on ammo. I need to get my champagne for beer prices. I'm not a wealthy person, I'm a hard working diesel mechanic that loves to shoot.....a little too much

[dahermit]

Here is what you should start off with...they produce hand loaded ammo and you will begin to understand the process of hand loading. And, if you decide that hand loading is not for you, you will not have poured too much money down a rat hole. I started this way in 1961 or so with a shot shell loader before there was anything except paper hulled shot shells. Then in about 1963 got one for 9mm and then .44 Magnum. A year or two later I got my first press...a Herter's "C" press. With those basic loaders, you learn as you go, not distracted by a copious volume of "expert" advice centering on equipment choices.


http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from...der&_sacat=888

[Lost Sheep]

SARuger, you are halfway there. Your post suggests this approach to analyzing the question of whether to reload or rely on factory ammo.

Originally Posted by SARuger

I was at Sportsmans Warehouse yesterday. I spent an hour in the reload isles. Even had a starter kit in the buggy. But I put it back.....

I ended up spending $120 on ammo that will be shot up and gone in an hour at the range.

I'm spending at least $100 a week on ammo. I need to get my champagne for beer prices. I'm not a wealthy person, I'm a hard working diesel mechanic that loves to shoot.....a little too much

Consider the cost of getting into handloading by comparing the cost of retail boxes of ammo to the cost of that same amount of ammunition bought as components and including the cost of the reloading gear.

For comparison purposes, I will stipulate that a typical box of (50 count) handgun ammunition costs about the same as a typical box of (20 count) rifle ammunition.

If you take enough money to buy 12 boxes of ammunition and apply it to the purchase of;

A) 2 boxes of store-bought ammunition (so you have the brass which you will re-use) and apply the remaining money to the purchase of

B) A decent press, dies, scale and the few additional small tools necessary to loading

C) enough powder, primers and bullets to make 10 more boxes of ammunition, (500 handgun or 200 rifle)

you will have spent the same amount of money for the same amount of shooting (12 boxes worth - 600 handgun or 240 rifle) and you may well have some powder left over.

After that, all your ammunition is a fraction of the cost of store-bought. The bonuses of satisfaction, better quality ammo and the independence from retailers are not even addressed here).

This rough estimate applies equally well to bottlenecked rifle cartridges as to handgun cartridges.

The exact figures will depend on local prices, but I expect counting by boxes will be more universal than counting by currency, even in different countries.

Thanks for reading.

Lost Sheep

[walnut1704]

Knowing what i know now....

Start with just one caliber. I suggest the .38 spl because it's an easy one to learn on. Once you get that down you can add the equipment for the other calibers.

You can spend $100 or $1,000 getting set up for one caliber depending on what press you decide on. The quality of ammo produced is the same, only the speed is different.

The single stage is good. It's simple and lower cost. Even if you move on to a progressive you'll find you still have a use for the single stage. Caliber conversions cost more for the progressives. Sometimes it's not worth all the change over work and cost for calibers you don't shoot much of.

I have a Dillon but I find I still use the single stage for a lot of things.

The Lee turret is a popular in-between choice. It probably has the best balance of cost / versatility / speed. I've decided it's not for me but I can understand why people choose it.

Some of the decision has to do with how much time you have and your own mechanical aptitude.

[Magnum Mike]

Posted by walnut1704
The single stage is good. It's simple and lower cost. Even if you move on to a progressive you'll find you still have a use for the single stage.

+1 I agree!
I JUST DON"T GET IT?
The title says, "I want to reload, where do I start".
90% of the time someone ask something about reloading, somebody got to jump in and beat the subject up AGAIN! Not if it's worth it, do you save money, blah,blah?
Lot's of good advise here.

posted by jimbob86"Quote:
I have concentrated on buying quality equipment but not necessarily top of the line on all items and so far I'm well over $2,000.00 with more to get."

2 Grand and you don't have everthing yet?

You either bought commercial grade automated stuff, or got hosed severely ......

That's kind of uncalled for. I have more than that tied up in my room. Didn't say how much or what he had other than quality equipment. I'm notknocking Lee at all but alot of my stuff cost at least twice as much as LEE. 8lbs of powder, 5000 primers, a manual, and bullets cost more than your $300.
There I'm happy now!!!

[Metal god]

Here's my thought on the cost of reloading .

Reloading is the "only" thing I've ever heard the argument you don't save money you just do it more and some how people think it makes sense . Would you ever say , I pay less for milk now but I don't save money I only drink more ? I used to pay $20 dollars a shirt but now I only pay $10 a shirt . The thing is I don't save any money I just wear more shirts and do laundry less ? If you acquire something for less , you saved money regardless to how much you bought . I have to assume when you buy in bulk at costco . You're not saving money .

I could go on and on with those types of examples . Now if you actually add the true cost of your time you will never save money but again most people don't add there cost of time involved in other parts of there lives . If you truly value your time and put a quality price on that time . There are few things worth spending/wasting your time on in life . Would it not be cheaper to pay someone to do your shopping , read the paper to you or cook all your meals . I don't know about you but at $80 an hour ( my worth ) It would be cheaper to go out to eat then spend the $40 of my time it takes to cook my food . Now think of those that are worth ( time wise ) more then that . How is doing anything your self worth it ?

Again I'm sure there are many examples as to how none of us actually calculate the time spent in doing something into the cost of doing it . Yet some how reloading is something you "must" calculate your time or you're fooling your self .

[Magnum Mike]

^^^^^ See what I mean!!
metal god Is another one of the anti-reloaders spewing out his thoughts on "is it worth it?", and failing to answer the OP's question. Just like stated in the posting above his!!

[Nitescout]

don`t forget to buy a good bullet puller!!!

I learned how to pay attention to the powder scale settings, and load data for the wrong bullet weight.

I`ve had to pull a lot of bullets over the last 40 or so years.

I still enjoy my quiet time in the garage...reloading!

[Metal god]

Metal God Is another one of the anti-reloaders spewing out his thoughts on "is it worth it?"

I'm not sure what you mean by "anti reloader" I reload and feel I save a bunch of money . I believe if you load anything other then the most garbage of loads , you will save money and thought that's what I said in my post above . My point was don't believe the " you won't save any money crowed " because you will , especially if you load quality ammo like JHP hand gun or match rifle loads . I load those for half the cost or better then factory ammo . And I don't consider my time in the cost of reloading because I don't consider my time in the cost of anything else I do on my "FREE" time . So why would reloading be any different . When I read the paper , After I don't think "man that just cost me $40 to do that" I don't see why reload should be any different .

Mag Mike :

This is the 4th page of the thread and working on a year old . The OP has gotten all he needs as to where to start . This thread as many do , morph into more then just the title . But for you Mike I'll post the proper link that goes directly to the title http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=230171

and THE OP'S LAST POST

I was at Sportsmans Warehouse yesterday. I spent an hour in the reload isles. Even had a starter kit in the buggy. But I put it back.....

I ended up spending $120 on ammo that will be shot up and gone in an hour at the range.

I'm spending at least $100 a week on ammo. I need to get my champagne for beer prices. I'm not a wealthy person, I'm a hard working diesel mechanic that loves to shoot.....a little too much

CLEARLY went into the cost of reloading or buying ammo . Maybe MAG MIKE should follow the threads a little closer .

To the OP ;

If you are going to be spending $120 an hour at the range on ammo . I recommend you start reloading .

[SARuger]

Shopping today

[chimo]

I agree with the advice given to start with a Lee Classic turret press for your handgun and rifle loads. If at some point you decide you need to be able to produce larger quantities per session, you can always upgrade a more expensive progressive press like a Dillon 650.

I disagree with those who say reloading shotgun isn't worth it. You can get into it fairly cheap:
- a Lee shotgun press for 20ga will cost you under 60 bucks.
- 1000 primers will cost you about 35 bucks
- 1 pound of powder will cost you 20-40 bucks and in many cases is the same powder you use for loading your pistol rounds. (Universal, HS-6, Tightgroup for example)
- 500 wads will cost you about 10 bucks - I recommend Downrange wads.
- Once-fired hulls will cost you about 10 cents each (and of course you will have some of your own as well and may be able to get some from local clubs/ranges as well)
- Shot will cost you about 25 bucks for a 10 pound bag, but you can cast your own lead shot and slugs (and bullets too) if you invest in the molds, get lead tire weights from local tire shops and find some cast iron pots, muffin molds and a propane camp stove at your local flea markets.

I actually enjoy loading shotgun more than I do loading pistol/rifle. One caution though...there is not a lot of room for experimenting with shotgun loads...best to stick to the recipes of hull/wad/primer/powder/load that are published by the powder and wad makers. I have a couple of recipes I like for buckshot, a couple for slugs, a couple for lead shot and a couple for steel shot, all use either Remington STS or Winchester AA hulls, Winchester primers and about 5 different wads.

IMO, you don't have to be a high-volume shooter to reload. Reloading can be a fun hobby...and keeping a decent stock of components can somewhat insulate you from the price increases and shortages caused by the next panic du jor.

[SARuger]

I keep waffling between a single stage and the turret press.......

I see shotgun reloaders cheap around here all the time but they are always 12g and of course I shoot clays with a 20g

[chimo]

The advantage of the turret is that you can use it like a single stage for batch processing...but faster since you don't have to R&R dies for each step...or you can use the auto indexing to take each round from start to finish in a quasi-progressive manner. The turret gives you more flexibility and potential to increase your output rate.

[SARuger]

The advantage of the turret is that you can use it like a single stage for batch processing...but faster since you don't have to R&R dies for each step...or you can use the auto indexing to take each round from start to finish in a quasi-progressive manner. The turret gives you more flexibility and potential to increase your output rate.

I want to get a LEE but I hear their turret press can have some issues when auto indexing. I like the price of the LEE dies.