Is this true?

dahermit · May 24, 2021, 08:06 AM

In reference to a previous and expired thread:

Is it true that "A modern 1911 will feed properly assembled semi-wadcutters from any magazine."?

The only magazines that I have that have intermittent jams are the type on the right of the picture I posted. The others have wadcutter lips and seem to feed my RCBS 45-201-kt wadcutters just fine.

Note: I have three mags that have been identified here as being "hybrids"... I have order three replacements (with wadcutter lips) for them that should arrive by tomorrow. When they arrive I will take the three offending magazines out of use and save them for if and when I ever need them to shoot hardball. The three are the same as the magazine on the right... the other two I know have "wadcutter" feed lips.

I only shoot this type of bullet:

totaldla · May 24, 2021, 08:15 AM

Need about 1/16" shoulder exposed. Why? Because some magazines will release early causing the cartridge to bounce off the hood as it turns the corner to chamber. A little exposed lead is slippery and helps with the turn. A little extra taper crimp helps as well.

This a trick that allows the use of lswc with every mag type I've fiddled with.

lee n. field · May 24, 2021, 08:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by totaldla

Need about 1/16" shoulder exposed. Why? Because some magazines will release early causing the cartridge to bounce off the hood as it turns the corner to chamber. A little exposed lead is slippery and helps with the turn. A little extra taper crimp helps as well.

This a trick that allows the use of lswc with every mag type I've fiddled with.

I concur.

I ran into that problem with my handloads, and, working through it, concluded the same. .45 ACP is, in one sense, easy to handload. The case is a big wide cup for powder. But, there are subtleties.

dahermit · May 24, 2021, 08:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by totaldla

This a trick that allows the use of lswc with every mag type I've fiddled with.

Even wadcutters (as above), with G.I. hardball feed lips?

Then you are saying that there is not need for wadcutter feed lips on 1911 magazines?

totaldla · May 24, 2021, 08:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dahermit

Even wadcutters (as above), with G.I. hardball feed lips?

Then you are saying that there is not need for wadcutter feed lips on 1911 magazines?

It hard to buy a magazine that doesn't use wadcutter feed lips - the Wilsons, MCCORMICK, Mecgar that I have lying around use wadcutter feedlips. But they don't use the wadcutter follower. Strangely, I have two Mecgar 10rounders that use the GI hardball lips and follower.

I'm no expert on magazines but I have been happily shooting lswc out of my 1911s for the last 25years.. Maybe one of the forum experts will add to this thread.

dahermit · May 24, 2021, 09:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by totaldla

Need about 1/16" shoulder exposed. Why? Because some magazines will release early causing the cartridge to bounce off the hood as it turns the corner to chamber. A little exposed lead is slippery and helps with the turn. A little extra taper crimp helps as well.

This a trick that allows the use of lswc with every mag type I've fiddled with.

My cartridges pass the plunk test... they are very close to being flush (visually, but a dial caliper indicates they are flush (.000)) with the hood that seating the bullets any further out (1/16") will make them proud of the barrel hood. The photo of my rounds may be misleading... the bullet shoulder is about 1/32 above the case mouth, where as the photo looks like they are flush.

FITASC · May 24, 2021, 09:16 AM

Quote:

Need about 1/16" shoulder exposed. Why? Because some magazines will release early causing the cartridge to bounce off the hood as it turns the corner to chamber. A little exposed lead is slippery and helps with the turn. A little extra taper crimp helps as well.

I took that advice and had nothing BUT failure to go into battery without a major push from me or I had to pull the slide back to clear. When seated flush like the OP's, they ran just fine

gwpercle · May 24, 2021, 06:15 PM

On you pictured handload if you seat the bullet out just a little farther , get about 1/16" or 1/32" of the shoulder showing ... it might help feeding in that balky magazine .
My wadcutter magazines are all like the one on the far right ...but ... I load my bullets out to where a " thumbnail thickness" of shoulder is exposed ( instuctions I was given in 1967) .
There is something to having a small amount of shoulder exposed ... they feed much better and balky magazines sometimes ( sometimes !) start feeding correctly .

One thing you can say about magazines ... they are like a box of chocolates ...you don't know what your gonna get . By and Large MecGar Magazines can usually be counted on to work ... and if they don't ...return it .
Avoid cheapo cheapo no name magazines ( like the ones sold by Sarco ) like the covid , usually waste of money and if they work at first ...they never last .
Spend money on MecGar mags.
Gary

Jim Watson · May 26, 2021, 08:16 AM

This may be the first time I have seen 1/16" of SWC shoulder recommended.
Usually .020", .030", "a thumbnail". Some seating recommendations on the head-to-shoulder measurement, 0.936" being on the long side.

But the chamber governs, if it doesn't plunk, if the rim is out past the hood with the round headspace on the shoulder, you are loaded too long.

If the gun and bullet require wadcutter lip magazines, GET wadcutter lips, don't try to force it to go by some internet pronouncement "Any gun..."

Oh, yeah, bullet. The usual commercial .45 semiwadcutter is a copy of the Hensley and Gibbs No. 68, designed by a Mr Crawford.
The OP is not loading that bullet, his RCBS mold is somewhat different, with a thicker nose and broader meplat. That affects feeding.

JustJake · May 26, 2021, 09:35 AM

A good test to see if a 1911 mag is a "true feeder" is to load it up with the old H&G 230gn ball-type bullet - FMJ or hardcast. If it feeds that one consistently, the mag is GTG.

**Aguila Blanca** · May 26, 2021, 12:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FITASC

Quote:

Need about 1/16" shoulder exposed. Why? Because some magazines will release early causing the cartridge to bounce off the hood as it turns the corner to chamber. A little exposed lead is slippery and helps with the turn. A little extra taper crimp helps as well.

I took that advice and had nothing BUT failure to go into battery without a major push from me or I had to pull the slide back to clear. When seated flush like the OP's, they ran just fine

Your barrel has a short chamber.

I once tested a new pistol like that. It absolutely refused to go into battery with factory semi-wadcutters. I returned the gun to the manufacturer, they replaced the barrel, and after that it ran like a top.

Semi-wadcutters should have just about a thumbnail's thickness of shoulder exposed above the mouth of the case.

Jim Watson · May 26, 2021, 01:20 PM

I had one like that. It was brilliantly accurate but a poor feeder.
FLG ran in a sharp reamer to increase radial clearance, headspace, and throat.
Got out an amazing amount of metal and it became functionally reliable. Best accuracy with a different load, though.

HiBC · May 26, 2021, 03:03 PM

The problem COULD be the thickness of the powder coat.

What is the front band diameter over the paint?

gwpercle · May 26, 2021, 07:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aguila Blanca

Your barrel has a short chamber.

I once tested a new pistol like that. It absolutely refused to go into battery with factory semi-wadcutters. I returned the gun to the manufacturer, they replaced the barrel, and after that it ran like a top.

Semi-wadcutters should have just about a thumbnail's thickness of shoulder exposed above the mouth of the case.

About a brazillion years ago I was told " about a Thumbnail's Thickness" of shoulder should be exposed ... we only had rulers, yardsticks , zig-zag carpenters measure and a 20'- 50' steel tape measures to measure stuff with . No one owned calipers ... so , just out of curosity ... how thick ...in inches would that be ... I honestly don't have long enough thumbnails to measure ... I do have a dial caliper now ...just no nails ...
I have worked my whole life in house construction and every dimension is feet and inches with a few 1/2 inch . 1/4 inch , 1/8 inch , 1/16 and 1/32 inch dimensions thrown in for the fine work ... but this ain't measuring lumber and building houses .
So how thick is a thumbnail on the dial caliper ?
Gary

jetinteriorguy · May 27, 2021, 05:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gwpercle

About a brazillion years ago I was told " about a Thumbnail's Thickness" of shoulder should be exposed ... we only had rulers, yardsticks , zig-zag carpenters measure and a 20'- 50' steel tape measures to measure stuff with . No one owned calipers ... so , just out of curosity ... how thick ...in inches would that be ... I honestly don't have long enough thumbnails to measure ... I do have a dial caliper now ...just no nails ...
I have worked my whole life in house construction and every dimension is feet and inches with a few 1/2 inch . 1/4 inch , 1/8 inch , 1/16 and 1/32 inch dimensions thrown in for the fine work ... but this ain't measuring lumber and building houses .
So how thick is a thumbnail on the dial caliper ?
Gary

.028”

May 24, 2021, 08:06 AM	#1
dahermit Senior Member Join Date: October 28, 2006 Location: South Central Michigan...near Posts: 6,501	Is this true? In reference to a previous and expired thread: Is it true that "A modern 1911 will feed properly assembled semi-wadcutters from any magazine."? The only magazines that I have that have intermittent jams are the type on the right of the picture I posted. The others have wadcutter lips and seem to feed my RCBS 45-201-kt wadcutters just fine. Note: I have three mags that have been identified here as being "hybrids"... I have order three replacements (with wadcutter lips) for them that should arrive by tomorrow. When they arrive I will take the three offending magazines out of use and save them for if and when I ever need them to shoot hardball. The three are the same as the magazine on the right... the other two I know have "wadcutter" feed lips. I only shoot this type of bullet: Last edited by dahermit; May 24, 2021 at 08:12 AM.

May 24, 2021, 08:15 AM	#2
totaldla Senior Member Join Date: August 10, 2009 Location: SW Idaho Posts: 1,294	Need about 1/16" shoulder exposed. Why? Because some magazines will release early causing the cartridge to bounce off the hood as it turns the corner to chamber. A little exposed lead is slippery and helps with the turn. A little extra taper crimp helps as well. This a trick that allows the use of lswc with every mag type I've fiddled with. __________________ Lee Auto Bench Prime Castor Oil Case Lube

May 26, 2021, 09:35 AM	#10
JustJake Senior Member Join Date: August 12, 2020 Posts: 497	A good test to see if a 1911 mag is a "true feeder" is to load it up with the old H&G 230gn ball-type bullet - FMJ or hardcast. If it feeds that one consistently, the mag is GTG. __________________ I use the Jake Brake every chance I get. Don't care if it annoys you. Hear me now?!

May 24, 2021, 06:15 PM	#8
gwpercle Senior Member Join Date: November 30, 2012 Location: Baton Rouge, Louisiana Posts: 1,752	On you pictured handload if you seat the bullet out just a little farther , get about 1/16" or 1/32" of the shoulder showing ... it might help feeding in that balky magazine . My wadcutter magazines are all like the one on the far right ...but ... I load my bullets out to where a " thumbnail thickness" of shoulder is exposed ( instuctions I was given in 1967) . There is something to having a small amount of shoulder exposed ... they feed much better and balky magazines sometimes ( sometimes !) start feeding correctly . One thing you can say about magazines ... they are like a box of chocolates ...you don't know what your gonna get . By and Large MecGar Magazines can usually be counted on to work ... and if they don't ...return it . Avoid cheapo cheapo no name magazines ( like the ones sold by Sarco ) like the covid , usually waste of money and if they work at first ...they never last . Spend money on MecGar mags. Gary

May 26, 2021, 08:16 AM	#9
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 18,541	This may be the first time I have seen 1/16" of SWC shoulder recommended. Usually .020", .030", "a thumbnail". Some seating recommendations on the head-to-shoulder measurement, 0.936" being on the long side. But the chamber governs, if it doesn't plunk, if the rim is out past the hood with the round headspace on the shoulder, you are loaded too long. If the gun and bullet require wadcutter lip magazines, GET wadcutter lips, don't try to force it to go by some internet pronouncement "Any gun..." Oh, yeah, bullet. The usual commercial .45 semiwadcutter is a copy of the Hensley and Gibbs No. 68, designed by a Mr Crawford. The OP is not loading that bullet, his RCBS mold is somewhat different, with a thicker nose and broader meplat. That affects feeding.

May 26, 2021, 01:20 PM	#12
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 18,541	I had one like that. It was brilliantly accurate but a poor feeder. FLG ran in a sharp reamer to increase radial clearance, headspace, and throat. Got out an amazing amount of metal and it became functionally reliable. Best accuracy with a different load, though.

May 26, 2021, 03:03 PM	#13
HiBC Senior Member Join Date: November 13, 2006 Posts: 8,286	The problem COULD be the thickness of the powder coat. What is the front band diameter over the paint?