How much abuse can a S&W Model 66 take?

BJung · October 6, 2020, 12:18 AM

How much abuse can a Model 66 frame take? I've read that you can crack or damage a frame for having too hot of a load.

Years ago, my pet load used AA9 and my revolver had a hell of a recoil with flames that would come out of the barrel. The primers were fine though. At worse, maybe a small sign of flattening ( it's been awhile). Because of the loud blast and recoil I never followed up on shooting more with AA9 for fear of damaging the frame. I actually don't shoot that much and probably have 500-800 rounds through the handgun.

How strong is the Model 66 frame?

I'm using Blue Dot now and like it. In the future I might try 2400

shurshot · October 6, 2020, 04:46 AM

Stay away from hot 110 and 125 grain magnums. On the older 19's and 66's, the forcing cone was the weak spot if lots of full house Magnums were used. Bill Jordan / S&W designed the 19 / 66 to be carried by LEO's, shot primarily with .38's, and moderately with .357 magnums. Practice with .38's, and only occasionally shoot magnums (self defense carry and hunting), and your gun should last a lifetime.
S&W designed the L frame 586 / 686 to alleviate any concern about heavy Magnum use and wear and tear. The new K frames have been upgraded as well, beefed up a bit in critical areas.

105kw · October 6, 2020, 05:22 AM

The later unpinned and non recessed guns are stronger than the early guns.
They beefed up the forcing cone, and other vitals.
In the late 80s, I got a no dash model 66, and 5000rds of Federal 125gr magnum.
I had to get the gun retimed at about 3800 rounds.
So stick with heavier bullet weights, in moderation, a 66 should last a long time.
For heavy magnum use, go to a L or N frame.

UncleEd · October 6, 2020, 06:06 AM

Burbank Jung,

Follow the loading manuals such
Speer's and do as recommended
by keeping loads around 10 percent
or slightly more under full charges.

You and your 66 will be quite happy.

If you must have more power, use
a rifle or go to the larger framed
revolvers.

Personally, I think Magnumitis is
a terrible disease. Bad for your
gun, bad for your ears, bad for
the nerves and small bones in
your hand and wrist.

BJung · October 6, 2020, 10:09 AM

Wow, good advice. I was planning to load some 125's just to have on hand. I only have 158gr right now and reload to where the most accurate groups are. Would 135 and 140 gr be considered light bullets like the 125s even though they are in between?

T. O'Heir · October 6, 2020, 01:27 PM

"...having too hot of a load..." It's more about extended, continuous, use of hot loads that might damage it. There's no actually data that says "this much of that" will for sure.
It'd be forcing cones and cranes that get damaged too.

rock185 · October 6, 2020, 04:12 PM

We were issued the .357 125 JHP, and I did see a python and S&W model 19 or two with damaged forcing cones. Was it just due to the the 357 125 ammo? I honestly don't know. I did carry my 66 for years, and shot mostly Magnum ammo in it. It did not crack the forcing cone, but did have end shake and timing issues. My local gunsmith corrected it a couple times, but the third time, he told me he could do no more and it needed to go back to S&W. S&W replaced about everything but the frame and side plate. I still have the old 1972 production 66, but it lead an easy life after overhaul because I soon started carrying a S&W L-frame.

I don't know about the 135 grain, but I did shoot factory and hand loaded 140 grain ammo thorough my 66 without issue. I would consider the 140 to be a mid weight bullet in the .357. I consider the 19s/66s, etc. to be rugged little guns, but would go with an L-frame or Ruger GP100 if I intended to again shoot copious quantities of .357 as I used to......ymmv

ChasHam · October 6, 2020, 06:01 PM

[QUOTE=burbank_jung;6823972]Years ago, my pet load used AA9 and my revolver had a hell of a recoil with flames that would come out of the barrel. The primers were fine though. At worse, maybe a small sign of flattening (/QUOTE]

A few years back, I hired a contractor to do a major tear-out and remodel of our kitchen. It included taking down several walls and closets in the process.

He said his favorite part of the job was the initial tear-out using a 20" chain saw and an 8-pound sledge hammer because it made him feel like his favorite comic book character-- one Dr. Destructo.

I bet you guys could easily become drinkin' buddies ;-)

SIGSHR · October 6, 2020, 06:38 PM

I have seen the Combat Magnum described as a 38 that can fire 357s, it came about at the urging of Bill Jordan who felt LEOs needed something more powerful than a 38 and lighter than an N frame.

GeauxTide · October 6, 2020, 08:05 PM

Yeah, I ditto 125 hot loads. Got a 19 in 1970 and was trying to duplicate the SuperVel loads. 158 SWC @ 1000 shot much better and not hard on the piece.

AustinTX · October 6, 2020, 10:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by burbank_jung

I'm using Blue Dot now and like it. In the future I might try 2400

I'm not a handloader, so I'm only going by what I've heard others say, but I've heard more than once that Blue Dot and other slower-burning ball powders in tandem with light bullets will cut forcing cones like an oxyacetylene torch.

105kw · October 7, 2020, 08:54 AM

The first K frame I saw with a split forcing cone was a non pinned 19 that an idiot friend of mine bought.
He was leading it with 170 Sierras, and a lot of H110.
My best guess was his round count was 500 plus rounds, before the forcing cone split.
He was getting about 1150fps out of a 4 inch barrel, empties had to be ejected using a wood dowel. With flat primers.
I quit shooting with him.

October 6, 2020, 12:18 AM	#1
BJung Senior Member Join Date: December 5, 2019 Posts: 773	How much abuse can a S&W Model 66 take? How much abuse can a Model 66 frame take? I've read that you can crack or damage a frame for having too hot of a load. Years ago, my pet load used AA9 and my revolver had a hell of a recoil with flames that would come out of the barrel. The primers were fine though. At worse, maybe a small sign of flattening ( it's been awhile). Because of the loud blast and recoil I never followed up on shooting more with AA9 for fear of damaging the frame. I actually don't shoot that much and probably have 500-800 rounds through the handgun. How strong is the Model 66 frame? I'm using Blue Dot now and like it. In the future I might try 2400

October 6, 2020, 01:27 PM	#6
T. O'Heir Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2002 Location: Canada Posts: 12,453	"...having too hot of a load..." It's more about extended, continuous, use of hot loads that might damage it. There's no actually data that says "this much of that" will for sure. It'd be forcing cones and cranes that get damaged too. __________________ Spelling and grammar count!

October 6, 2020, 04:12 PM	#7
rock185 Senior Member Join Date: September 2, 2001 Location: Out West in Rim Country Posts: 1,093	We were issued the .357 125 JHP, and I did see a python and S&W model 19 or two with damaged forcing cones. Was it just due to the the 357 125 ammo? I honestly don't know. I did carry my 66 for years, and shot mostly Magnum ammo in it. It did not crack the forcing cone, but did have end shake and timing issues. My local gunsmith corrected it a couple times, but the third time, he told me he could do no more and it needed to go back to S&W. S&W replaced about everything but the frame and side plate. I still have the old 1972 production 66, but it lead an easy life after overhaul because I soon started carrying a S&W L-frame. I don't know about the 135 grain, but I did shoot factory and hand loaded 140 grain ammo thorough my 66 without issue. I would consider the 140 to be a mid weight bullet in the .357. I consider the 19s/66s, etc. to be rugged little guns, but would go with an L-frame or Ruger GP100 if I intended to again shoot copious quantities of .357 as I used to......ymmv __________________ COTEP 640, NRA Life

October 6, 2020, 06:01 PM	#8
ChasHam Senior Member Join Date: August 27, 2018 Location: Deep South Posts: 130	[QUOTE=burbank_jung;6823972]Years ago, my pet load used AA9 and my revolver had a hell of a recoil with flames that would come out of the barrel. The primers were fine though. At worse, maybe a small sign of flattening (/QUOTE] A few years back, I hired a contractor to do a major tear-out and remodel of our kitchen. It included taking down several walls and closets in the process. He said his favorite part of the job was the initial tear-out using a 20" chain saw and an 8-pound sledge hammer because it made him feel like his favorite comic book character-- one Dr. Destructo. I bet you guys could easily become drinkin' buddies ;-) Last edited by ChasHam; October 7, 2020 at 06:47 AM.

October 6, 2020, 08:05 PM	#10
GeauxTide Senior Member Join Date: April 20, 2009 Location: Helena, AL Posts: 4,424	Yeah, I ditto 125 hot loads. Got a 19 in 1970 and was trying to duplicate the SuperVel loads. 158 SWC @ 1000 shot much better and not hard on the piece. __________________ Reloading For: 223R, 243W, 6.5 GR, 6.5 CM, 260R, 6.5-06, 280R, 7mmRM, 300HAM'R, 308W, 30-06, 338-06, 9mm, 357M, 41M, 44SPL, 44M, 45 ACP, 45 Colt, 450BM.

October 6, 2020, 04:46 AM	#2
shurshot Senior Member Join Date: August 25, 2006 Posts: 1,819	Stay away from hot 110 and 125 grain magnums. On the older 19's and 66's, the forcing cone was the weak spot if lots of full house Magnums were used. Bill Jordan / S&W designed the 19 / 66 to be carried by LEO's, shot primarily with .38's, and moderately with .357 magnums. Practice with .38's, and only occasionally shoot magnums (self defense carry and hunting), and your gun should last a lifetime. S&W designed the L frame 586 / 686 to alleviate any concern about heavy Magnum use and wear and tear. The new K frames have been upgraded as well, beefed up a bit in critical areas.

October 6, 2020, 05:22 AM	#3
105kw Senior Member Join Date: June 30, 2017 Location: Columbia Basin Washington Posts: 415	The later unpinned and non recessed guns are stronger than the early guns. They beefed up the forcing cone, and other vitals. In the late 80s, I got a no dash model 66, and 5000rds of Federal 125gr magnum. I had to get the gun retimed at about 3800 rounds. So stick with heavier bullet weights, in moderation, a 66 should last a long time. For heavy magnum use, go to a L or N frame.

October 6, 2020, 06:06 AM	#4
UncleEd Senior Member Join Date: April 13, 2013 Location: N. Georgia Posts: 1,150	Burbank Jung, Follow the loading manuals such Speer's and do as recommended by keeping loads around 10 percent or slightly more under full charges. You and your 66 will be quite happy. If you must have more power, use a rifle or go to the larger framed revolvers. Personally, I think Magnumitis is a terrible disease. Bad for your gun, bad for your ears, bad for the nerves and small bones in your hand and wrist.

October 6, 2020, 10:09 AM	#5
BJung Senior Member Join Date: December 5, 2019 Posts: 773	Wow, good advice. I was planning to load some 125's just to have on hand. I only have 158gr right now and reload to where the most accurate groups are. Would 135 and 140 gr be considered light bullets like the 125s even though they are in between?

October 6, 2020, 06:38 PM	#9
SIGSHR Senior Member Join Date: September 13, 2005 Posts: 4,700	I have seen the Combat Magnum described as a 38 that can fire 357s, it came about at the urging of Bill Jordan who felt LEOs needed something more powerful than a 38 and lighter than an N frame.

October 7, 2020, 08:54 AM	#12
105kw Senior Member Join Date: June 30, 2017 Location: Columbia Basin Washington Posts: 415	The first K frame I saw with a split forcing cone was a non pinned 19 that an idiot friend of mine bought. He was leading it with 170 Sierras, and a lot of H110. My best guess was his round count was 500 plus rounds, before the forcing cone split. He was getting about 1150fps out of a 4 inch barrel, empties had to be ejected using a wood dowel. With flat primers. I quit shooting with him.