What do you think this cartridge fits?

fl_rich · November 5, 2017, 12:34 PM

Found this a gun show awhile back. I've never been able to figure out what it fits. It says 30CAL.

Any clues ?

CarJunkieLS1 · November 5, 2017, 01:40 PM

Looks kinda like a .308 with on of those Remington "accelerator" bullets in them. It's essentially a .22 caliber bullet in a plastic sabot to make it .308 diameter.

Ruga Booga · November 5, 2017, 03:25 PM

Thats not a sabot. That cartridge has double shoulders. Looks like someone was just playin around.

briandg · November 5, 2017, 03:31 PM

Not an accelerator, not a.22, certainly not a .30 caliber, and I don't even believe that it is a .308 win.

That has to be some outrageously nutso wildcat, it is probably a .257 diameter, it may or may not be based on a .270, I don't know of any standard non belted case big enough, off hand, to gain anything like this.

That thing is just nuts. I do seem to remember seeing it before.

Do us a favor. Whatexactly does that headstamp say, and why didn't you post a pic?

put up a pic please.

ThomasT · November 5, 2017, 03:32 PM

Looks like a blank round that had the folds straightened out and a bullet inserted in it.

briandg · November 5, 2017, 03:59 PM

Double shoulder blank.

http://ddsaditetyegoldswa.blogspot.c...nk-rounds.html

I'm not sure how to attribute this.

briandg · November 5, 2017, 04:08 PM

Quote:

looks like a blank round that had the folds straightened out and a bullet inserted in it.

Yes, it does, took me forever to locate a good photo to post. I started right after my previous post.

I don't think that it's an altered blank, probably not, but I'm still unsure what the check it is and why it was made.

A prank, or joke?

There is absolutely no rational reason for using two shoulders. It would probably even interfere with accuracy.

Old Stony · November 5, 2017, 05:05 PM

I would guess it's someone's idea of making a conversation piece. Maybe a double shouldered blank that was cut back and they seated a bullet in it. I can't imagine any other use for it.

briandg · November 5, 2017, 05:09 PM

It created a conversation here. I can imagine a dozen people standing around at a range having this same discussion, while the guy who created this chimera snickers inside of himself.

Really, I wasted well over a half hour contemplating and researching.

std7mag · November 5, 2017, 08:33 PM

Ummm....
A blank doesn't have a 25 caliber ballistic tip...

It's just a showoff piece. Kinda like the Eargunsplittenloudenboomer...

O4L · November 5, 2017, 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by std7mag

Ummm....
A blank doesn't have a 25 caliber ballistic tip...

It's just a showoff piece. Kinda like the Eargunsplittenloudenboomer...

Ah yes. The ol' .22 ESLB.

O4L · November 5, 2017, 08:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by briandg

Really, I wasted well over a half hour contemplating and researching.

I probably spent at least that long trying to find it online.

Triphammer · November 5, 2017, 10:30 PM

Thirty-06, shoulder set back in a 308 Win die then the extra long neck is resized in a 25-06 die.

briandg · November 6, 2017, 08:51 AM

Seven:

Quote:

Ummm....
A blank doesn't have a 25 caliber ballistic tip...

I wasn't saying that the round supplied was a blank, that's absolutely ridiculous. I showed that as an example of a double shouldered round. Nothing else.

Triphammer, that explanation is probably right, the shapes seem correct. Special chamber, custom dies, painfully difficult case forming, all intended to turn a 25-06 into a half baked half crazy .257 Roberts class rifle cartridge.

I once met a guy who put a four barrel carburetor on his four cylinder Vega, it could be done so he bought a case of beer one weekend and did it.

This took a lot more work, but I think that the same principle was involved.

I've come to believe that whoever did this actually had the rifle made to go with it, but it's possible that the guy just sat in his shop and made the rounds.

How many dies, how many steps would it have taken to form those cases?

olddav · November 6, 2017, 09:16 AM

Looks like a conversation piece to me. The front shoulder is too sharp to be formed in a die, looks like it was soldered on to a .308ish case.

tdoyka · November 6, 2017, 03:57 PM

http://www.gunsandammo.com/ga-vault/...-loudenboomer/

Former Guns & Ammo editor Bob Hutton helped design the .22 Eargesplitten Loudenboomer cartridge to set a world record for firing bullets at over 5,000 feet-per-second (fps). Unfortunately, the .50 grain projectile only reached 4,600 fps but its wacky name lives in infamy.

dgludwig · November 6, 2017, 04:58 PM

Years ago, someone gave me the ultimate "overbore" cartridge; what appears to be a .50 caliber case necked down to .17 caliber. It has what looks to be a live primer in it...

Sure Shot Mc Gee · November 7, 2017, 08:48 AM

Haven't a clue?
Speculating_ Such color Tipped bullets I use when reloading for my 25-06. i.e. Ballistic {blue} tip nosler
Brass? of military sort.

briandg · November 7, 2017, 09:13 AM

Bob Hutton was a bit strange. Iirc, he also coined the term "UMAGGBEE" for about twenty grains of 2400 in any non magnum case above .22 diameter.

"Universal, makes any gun go bang." He proposed it as something that didn't really exist in principle at the time, a post-apocalypse asset. A keg of 2400 could load almost any rifle or pistol, and you could even do it by just taping a few labels on the keg that could load just about any round in the planet based on bullet weight, diameter, and case capacity.

The funny thing is that all of the loading data of the time pretty much supported it. The rounds would be terribly inefficient in some cases, but if it's a matter of roasted raccoon or pine bark for dinner, killing the coon will be more important than the powder used.

fl_rich · November 7, 2017, 10:54 AM

It must just be a conversation piece. I thought it was odd, that's why I bought it. It does appear to have a live primer and it. It has some weight to it so it's not empty but it doesn't feel like it would be full either.

I'm going to see my son this weekend, he is a marine veteran so he should have some idea what it is. I'll keep you posted as to what he says

Thank you all for your insightful responses. I apologize if some of you spent time better spent elsewhere looking for a unicorn .

Rich

briandg · November 7, 2017, 11:25 AM

Rich, some people, like me, enjoy looking for unicorns. I could have said "huh" and left it at that, leaving us both ignorant, but that's not me. I am curious. My wife constantly asks me things, knowing that I will inevitably give her a comprehensive essay after an extensive search.

One time she asked me about the "ozark booger dog". That was a good one.

Quote:

Next time the black dog come close to the house, the fellow give it both barrels of his shotgun. And while the dog laid there a-kicking, he run out with the chopping-axe and cut its head right off. ‘Maybe that will settle your hash,’ says he. And then the fellow went to bed, with the door barred and the latchstring pulled in. But away along in the night he heard something outside. The moon was shining bright, and there was the booger dog a-running around lively as ever, carrying its head in his mouth! When the neighbors heard that one the all just laughed like fools, and the fellow got so mad he wouldn’t talk about it no more.

https://ozarkhealingblog.com/2015/04...he-booger-dog/

Unicorns and strange ammo are entertaining.

gunman5646 · November 7, 2017, 11:28 AM

Looks like the old triple neck terror to me!

BillM · November 7, 2017, 12:13 PM

Thought it was a joke--but maybe not. Apparently at one point there was some
interest in the double neck concept. 224 Hansell (or 224 LRVT, same thing).
Parent case 30-06.

Here is a link that appears to be a legit discussion of load data from 2003.

https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbth...44/type/thread

fl_rich · November 14, 2017, 08:14 PM

Well I have a resolution. Turns out a 5.7x28 round fits perfectly in a 308 shell. My son dropped the round and the 5.7 round fell into the 308 and rattled around inside.with little effort it pulled out and was in fact a live bluetip 5.7 round.

So it's not really a unicorn but more of a jackalope...

I'll send pics if anyone is interested, Be well and Happy Thanksgiving to you all!

November 5, 2017, 03:31 PM	#4
briandg Senior Member Join Date: May 4, 2010 Posts: 5,468	Not an accelerator, not a.22, certainly not a .30 caliber, and I don't even believe that it is a .308 win. That has to be some outrageously nutso wildcat, it is probably a .257 diameter, it may or may not be based on a .270, I don't know of any standard non belted case big enough, off hand, to gain anything like this. That thing is just nuts. I do seem to remember seeing it before. Do us a favor. Whatexactly does that headstamp say, and why didn't you post a pic? put up a pic please. __________________ None.

November 5, 2017, 03:59 PM	#6
briandg Senior Member Join Date: May 4, 2010 Posts: 5,468	Double shoulder blank. http://ddsaditetyegoldswa.blogspot.c...nk-rounds.html I'm not sure how to attribute this. __________________ None.

November 5, 2017, 05:09 PM	#9
briandg Senior Member Join Date: May 4, 2010 Posts: 5,468	It created a conversation here. I can imagine a dozen people standing around at a range having this same discussion, while the guy who created this chimera snickers inside of himself. Really, I wasted well over a half hour contemplating and researching. __________________ None.

November 5, 2017, 10:30 PM	#13
Triphammer Junior Member Join Date: September 30, 2017 Posts: 6	25/08/06 Thirty-06, shoulder set back in a 308 Win die then the extra long neck is resized in a 25-06 die.

November 6, 2017, 09:16 AM	#15
olddav Senior Member Join Date: December 21, 2008 Location: Lower Alabama Posts: 727	Looks like a conversation piece to me. The front shoulder is too sharp to be formed in a die, looks like it was soldered on to a .308ish case. __________________ Never beat your head against the wall with out a helmet

November 5, 2017, 01:40 PM	#2
CarJunkieLS1 Senior Member Join Date: October 1, 2013 Posts: 686	Looks kinda like a .308 with on of those Remington "accelerator" bullets in them. It's essentially a .22 caliber bullet in a plastic sabot to make it .308 diameter.

November 5, 2017, 03:25 PM	#3
Ruga Booga Senior Member Join Date: September 2, 2017 Location: SE Kansas Posts: 116	Thats not a sabot. That cartridge has double shoulders. Looks like someone was just playin around.

November 5, 2017, 03:32 PM	#5
ThomasT Senior Member Join Date: January 22, 2009 Location: Texas Posts: 2,753	Looks like a blank round that had the folds straightened out and a bullet inserted in it.

November 5, 2017, 05:05 PM	#8
Old Stony Senior Member Join Date: May 31, 2013 Location: East Texas Posts: 1,705	I would guess it's someone's idea of making a conversation piece. Maybe a double shouldered blank that was cut back and they seated a bullet in it. I can't imagine any other use for it.

November 5, 2017, 08:33 PM	#10
std7mag Senior Member Join Date: June 23, 2013 Location: Central Taxylvania.. Posts: 3,609	Ummm.... A blank doesn't have a 25 caliber ballistic tip... It's just a showoff piece. Kinda like the Eargunsplittenloudenboomer...

November 6, 2017, 03:57 PM	#16
tdoyka Senior Member Join Date: October 3, 2013 Location: windber, pa Posts: 300	http://www.gunsandammo.com/ga-vault/...-loudenboomer/ Former Guns & Ammo editor Bob Hutton helped design the .22 Eargesplitten Loudenboomer cartridge to set a world record for firing bullets at over 5,000 feet-per-second (fps). Unfortunately, the .50 grain projectile only reached 4,600 fps but its wacky name lives in infamy. __________________ The generation now coming out of Western schools is unable to distinguish good from bad. Even those words are unacceptable. This results in impaired thinking ability. Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn Μολών λαβέ !

November 6, 2017, 04:58 PM	#17
dgludwig Senior Member Join Date: February 12, 2005 Location: North central Ohio Posts: 7,486	Years ago, someone gave me the ultimate "overbore" cartridge; what appears to be a .50 caliber case necked down to .17 caliber. It has what looks to be a live primer in it... __________________ ONLY AN ARMED PEOPLE CAN BE TRULY FREE ; ONLY AN UNARMED PEOPLE CAN EVER BE ENSLAVED ...Aristotle NRA Benefactor Life Member

November 7, 2017, 08:48 AM	#18
Sure Shot Mc Gee Senior Member Join Date: January 2, 2012 Location: Minnesota Posts: 3,876	Haven't a clue? Speculating_ Such color Tipped bullets I use when reloading for my 25-06. i.e. Ballistic {blue} tip nosler Brass? of military sort.

November 7, 2017, 09:13 AM	#19
briandg Senior Member Join Date: May 4, 2010 Posts: 5,468	Bob Hutton was a bit strange. Iirc, he also coined the term "UMAGGBEE" for about twenty grains of 2400 in any non magnum case above .22 diameter. "Universal, makes any gun go bang." He proposed it as something that didn't really exist in principle at the time, a post-apocalypse asset. A keg of 2400 could load almost any rifle or pistol, and you could even do it by just taping a few labels on the keg that could load just about any round in the planet based on bullet weight, diameter, and case capacity. The funny thing is that all of the loading data of the time pretty much supported it. The rounds would be terribly inefficient in some cases, but if it's a matter of roasted raccoon or pine bark for dinner, killing the coon will be more important than the powder used. __________________ None.

November 7, 2017, 10:54 AM	#20
fl_rich Senior Member Join Date: October 27, 2015 Posts: 103	It must just be a conversation piece. I thought it was odd, that's why I bought it. It does appear to have a live primer and it. It has some weight to it so it's not empty but it doesn't feel like it would be full either. I'm going to see my son this weekend, he is a marine veteran so he should have some idea what it is. I'll keep you posted as to what he says Thank you all for your insightful responses. I apologize if some of you spent time better spent elsewhere looking for a unicorn . Rich

November 7, 2017, 11:28 AM	#22
gunman5646 Member Join Date: July 26, 2017 Posts: 32	wildest cat Looks like the old triple neck terror to me! __________________ Go ahead, skin that smokewagon and see what happens!

November 7, 2017, 12:13 PM	#23
BillM Senior Member Join Date: January 20, 2009 Location: Amity Oregon Posts: 791	Thought it was a joke--but maybe not. Apparently at one point there was some interest in the double neck concept. 224 Hansell (or 224 LRVT, same thing). Parent case 30-06. Here is a link that appears to be a legit discussion of load data from 2003. https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbth...44/type/thread

November 14, 2017, 08:14 PM	#24
fl_rich Senior Member Join Date: October 27, 2015 Posts: 103	Well I have a resolution. Turns out a 5.7x28 round fits perfectly in a 308 shell. My son dropped the round and the 5.7 round fell into the 308 and rattled around inside.with little effort it pulled out and was in fact a live bluetip 5.7 round. So it's not really a unicorn but more of a jackalope... I'll send pics if anyone is interested, Be well and Happy Thanksgiving to you all!