Kel-tec, no longer a joke....

JERRYS. · February 19, 2020, 09:14 PM

yeah, I was one of those guys that use to laugh about KT stuff being cheap crapola…… well, I've come to realize, they make a nifty .32acp, .380acp, a so so but very serviceable compact 9mm, a .223/5.56 handgun/rifle, a 9/40 folding carbine, a couple of different .22 cal guns, a compact super capacity 12ga. shotgun... they are innovative and while not Glocks or S&W et al., they are a no longer a joke in my opinion, not anymore.

just a random thought. what do you think about them?

Forte S+W · February 19, 2020, 09:24 PM

They were never a joke, no matter how much gun snobs tried to make them out to be one. They were always an industry leading firearms manufacturer known for producing innovative firearms, they merely had spotty quality control. You know, like Remington, only less expensive and with less apologists.

Besides, most of the folks who put down Kel-Tec are the sort who would unironically talk about what a junky, poorly designed firearm their P3AT was and how their LCP on the other hand is such a brilliant design.

jonnyc · February 19, 2020, 09:34 PM

I've had a P32 since about when they first came out. No joke to me.

Bill DeShivs · February 19, 2020, 09:36 PM

You're both very correct.

Cheapshooter · February 19, 2020, 09:50 PM

Kel-Tec, as many lower cost guns not on the gun snob approval list, have never been a "joke". A bigger joke may well be the prices paid for some of the "status symbol" guns that are on the approval list.

Kreyzhorse · February 19, 2020, 11:48 PM

I don't own a Kel-Tec, but I've never heard they were a joke. In fact, people that I know that own them swear by them and I'm not aware of any problems they've had with them.

JERRYS. · February 20, 2020, 09:23 AM

joke as in they were laughed at, not taken as serious firearms, not believed to be in the market for the long haul..... many many people thought that about kel-tec, mainly because they felt like "toys", felt "cheap".... maybe you didn't think that, but a whole lotta folks did. they have since been shown to be reliable products when used in their intended roles....

jmr40 · February 20, 2020, 09:46 AM

I've had a P3AT for many years. It has never failed to work and is accurate enough for what it is meant for. But I don't expect this to be the type gun that will hold up for 300,000 rounds like many Glocks have proven they will do. It gets carried a lot and shot a little just to stay in practice. Works for me.

TruthTellers · February 20, 2020, 01:45 PM

The only issue I have with Kel Tec's pistols is their triggers and the .32 and .380's nearly non-existent sights. I would buy a P32... if it was an LCP II. I have thought about the PF9, but the LC9s is better.

The nice thing that Kel Tec is doing tho is they are making really good rimfire pistols with the features I want; better triggers, better sights, mags way over 10 rounds, etc. This is what companies like Ruger and S&W need to start doing to keep people interested in .22 handguns, otherwise they're going to buy the 20 round capacity 9mm's and shoot cheap steel case ammo instead.

aarondhgraham · February 20, 2020, 02:39 PM

I really don't have a dog in this here fight,,,
But as soon as they start shipping,,,
I'm buying one of their P-17's.

It will be my first Kel Tec purchase ever,,,
I'm hoping to not be disappointed.

Aarond

.

Armybrat · February 20, 2020, 02:52 PM

My P32 was a neat, reliable little shooter. I regret trading it off.
My P3AT, not so much.
KT is a lot more innovative than Remington or Kahr, both of which I like and have bought several pistols each.

zukiphile · February 20, 2020, 04:36 PM

Quote:

just a random thought. what do you think about them?

I bought a Keltec bullpup, essentially to see if I like the format. I am not a gun snob. I have real enthusiasm for several Ruger designs.

Keltec takes the Hyundai approach to consumer confidence that was shaken after some market failures in the 1990s. They sold their cars with 10 year warranties back when no one did that. So you might buy a Hyundai that wasn't great, but the price was great, and you could make a warranty claim if it had problems. (I bought a Hyundai 18 years ago, and suffered only a disconnected power steering hose over the course of 60,000 miles).

When I bought an RDB, I joined a Keltec owners forum. I have concluded that Keltec has QC problems, but reportedly has responsive customer service.

Their engineering philosophy makes their product seem disposable. I don't mind polymer parts. I do mind that the RDB stock isn't friction welded like every other company's polymer stock, but is two halves screwed together. Rivets are used internally rather than pins. The hammer is driven by tension springs. I don't expect AR like durability.

That's not a condemnation.

osbornk · February 20, 2020, 06:05 PM

I think I need to get one as I like to buy guns bashed by gun snobs. I bought a Hi-Point to see if they were as bad as the gun snobs said and found they were very wrong and it was a good gun. I then traded it for a Taurus to see if they were as bad as claimed. I found them wrong also and have bought 5 new ones since then. I found the same thing when I bought a Phoenix HP-22A, a RIA 1911, a Rossi rifle and most recently a SCCY CPX-2 9mm handgun. I haven't had a bad gun yet to go along with my S&W, Ruger and Mossbergs.

unclenunzie · February 20, 2020, 07:15 PM

I like my P32. I consider it modern best of breed in 32 acp pocket guns because it is light, small, locked breech, easy to shoot, good capacity, locks on empty, inexpensive and... it works.

Under 10 ounces fully loaded. The ammo it carries is half the weight of the empty pistol, that's cool.

Good pocket guns.

Ricekila · February 20, 2020, 08:01 PM

Bought a gently used P-11 -- ran about 100 rounds through it --- no problems --

Did a fluff & buff -- polished everything inside - shortened the trigger pull - lightened the trigger ( now 4 lbs. ) - mcarbo spring kit - steel guide pin - cleaned up the plastic - buffed out all the slide scratches & Duracoated - replaced two loose pins with the belt clip fasteners - stuck on grippy stuff - super smooth and more reliable -

JERRYS. · February 20, 2020, 08:08 PM

I'm now the owner of a P32, again. I've replaced the recoil spring guide rod with the steel one, I've removed the laserlyte and buggered up one of the plastic frame pins so more have been ordered. might just go with the belt clip for anything beyond pocket carry.

WyMark · February 20, 2020, 08:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TruthTellers

The only issue I have with Kel Tec's pistols is their triggers and the .32 and .380's nearly non-existent sights.

I've shot a few hundred rounds through my P32 and can honestly say I've never once thought about the sights. Why would you need sights on a bad-breath-distance pocket gun?

TruthTellers · February 21, 2020, 01:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WyMark

I've shot a few hundred rounds through my P32 and can honestly say I've never once thought about the sights. Why would you need sights on a bad-breath-distance pocket gun?

Because not all self defense situations occur at bad breath distances.

kenny53 · February 21, 2020, 10:40 PM

The only Kel Tec I own is a 1st gen Sub 2000. This is a great gun and will empty a Glock 32 round mag as fast as you can pull the trigger.

Scorch · February 23, 2020, 03:04 AM

Quote:

they are innovative and while not Glocks or S&W et al., they are a no longer a joke in my opinion

Yes, they are innovative. But so are first graders.
No, they are not Glocks, S&W, etc. Even S&W would be ashamed to sell the kind of stuff KelTec sells.
They are a lot more interesting than they used to be. But still a joke. Plastic guns with plastic slides and plastic triggers that won't last 100 rounds. Customers bring them to me all the time, tell me it's their favorite gun. I feel bad for them.

Bill DeShivs · February 23, 2020, 04:03 AM

I have a P11 with over 5000 rounds through it.
No Keltec has a plastic slide, and they all have metal frames.
Perhaps if you actually tried one, you would understand why they could be someone's favorite gun.

Old Stony · February 23, 2020, 06:29 AM

I recently bought one of their new .22 mag carbines. I have taken it to the range only once so far and it didn't screw up until the second shot. I found if you didn't try to load the mags to full capacity, you were more likely to get it to work reliably. The mags are a bugger to load and that seems to be their biggest problem. I got a mag loader and it helps, but still not an easy thing to get done. When all is said and done, it actually shot pretty good. I was ringing steel rapid fire at 100 yds. with no problem. Neat little carbine and I'd really like it if they would come up with some better design of mag.

ms6852 · February 23, 2020, 09:27 AM

I waited 5 years for the PMR30 as I always wanted a semi auto 22 mag without having to pay for the price of a High Standard. Glad I waited the worked out the kinks it had when it first came out, now I wish I had not bought it as I'm spending a ton of money shooting it. It is so much fun I find myself giggling like a little girl and its a laser and reliable as heck.

Forte S+W · February 23, 2020, 10:39 AM

The only Kel-Tec I've ever really had any significant interest in is sadly long out of production. The P40. Yes, I know that it kicked hard, (it's an ultra-light .40) and I know that the gun had to be held with a death grip in order for it to function reliably, but I would still buy one if they remained in production.

Mike38 · February 23, 2020, 10:47 AM

Quote:

Scorch wrote:
Plastic guns with plastic slides and plastic triggers that won't last 100 rounds

Plastic slides? Is there a pistol made anywhere in the world that has a plastic slide?

February 19, 2020, 09:14 PM	#1
JERRYS. Senior Member Join Date: September 23, 2013 Location: Alabama Posts: 2,969	Kel-tec, no longer a joke.... yeah, I was one of those guys that use to laugh about KT stuff being cheap crapola…… well, I've come to realize, they make a nifty .32acp, .380acp, a so so but very serviceable compact 9mm, a .223/5.56 handgun/rifle, a 9/40 folding carbine, a couple of different .22 cal guns, a compact super capacity 12ga. shotgun... they are innovative and while not Glocks or S&W et al., they are a no longer a joke in my opinion, not anymore. just a random thought. what do you think about them? Last edited by JERRYS.; February 19, 2020 at 09:27 PM.

February 19, 2020, 09:24 PM	#2
Forte S+W Senior Member Join Date: October 12, 2019 Posts: 819	They were never a joke, no matter how much gun snobs tried to make them out to be one. They were always an industry leading firearms manufacturer known for producing innovative firearms, they merely had spotty quality control. You know, like Remington, only less expensive and with less apologists. Besides, most of the folks who put down Kel-Tec are the sort who would unironically talk about what a junky, poorly designed firearm their P3AT was and how their LCP on the other hand is such a brilliant design. __________________ Conspiracy theorists are the greatest political spin-doctors of all time. Only they can make the absolute worst political blunders sound like spectacular feats of ingenuity. Last edited by Forte S+W; February 19, 2020 at 10:38 PM.

February 19, 2020, 09:34 PM	#3
jonnyc Senior Member Join Date: July 20, 2009 Location: PA Posts: 1,731	I've had a P32 since about when they first came out. No joke to me. __________________ 2024 PA Cartridge Collector Show; Aug. 16-17, 2024!!! Buy...Sell...Trade All Types of Ammunition & Ordnance PM or email me for 2024 show details.

February 19, 2020, 09:36 PM	#4
Bill DeShivs Senior Member Join Date: April 7, 2006 Posts: 10,985	You're both very correct. __________________ Bill DeShivs, Master Cutler www.billdeshivs.com

February 19, 2020, 09:50 PM	#5
Cheapshooter Senior Member Join Date: December 2, 2007 Location: Missouri Posts: 8,306	Kel-Tec, as many lower cost guns not on the gun snob approval list, have never been a "joke". A bigger joke may well be the prices paid for some of the "status symbol" guns that are on the approval list. __________________ Cheapshooter's rules of gun ownership #1: NEVER SELL OR TRADE ANYTHING!

February 19, 2020, 11:48 PM	#6
Kreyzhorse Senior Member Join Date: April 12, 2006 Location: NKY Posts: 12,463	I don't own a Kel-Tec, but I've never heard they were a joke. In fact, people that I know that own them swear by them and I'm not aware of any problems they've had with them. __________________ "He who laughs last, laughs dead." Homer Simpson

February 20, 2020, 09:23 AM	#7
JERRYS. Senior Member Join Date: September 23, 2013 Location: Alabama Posts: 2,969	joke as in they were laughed at, not taken as serious firearms, not believed to be in the market for the long haul..... many many people thought that about kel-tec, mainly because they felt like "toys", felt "cheap".... maybe you didn't think that, but a whole lotta folks did. they have since been shown to be reliable products when used in their intended roles....

February 20, 2020, 09:46 AM	#8
jmr40 Senior Member Join Date: June 15, 2008 Location: Georgia Posts: 10,809	I've had a P3AT for many years. It has never failed to work and is accurate enough for what it is meant for. But I don't expect this to be the type gun that will hold up for 300,000 rounds like many Glocks have proven they will do. It gets carried a lot and shot a little just to stay in practice. Works for me. __________________ "If you're still doing things the same way you were doing them 10 years ago, you're doing it wrong" Winston Churchill

February 20, 2020, 01:45 PM	#9
TruthTellers Senior Member Join Date: October 22, 2016 Posts: 3,888	The only issue I have with Kel Tec's pistols is their triggers and the .32 and .380's nearly non-existent sights. I would buy a P32... if it was an LCP II. I have thought about the PF9, but the LC9s is better. The nice thing that Kel Tec is doing tho is they are making really good rimfire pistols with the features I want; better triggers, better sights, mags way over 10 rounds, etc. This is what companies like Ruger and S&W need to start doing to keep people interested in .22 handguns, otherwise they're going to buy the 20 round capacity 9mm's and shoot cheap steel case ammo instead. __________________ "We always think there's gonna be more time... then it runs out."

February 20, 2020, 02:39 PM	#10
aarondhgraham Senior Member Join Date: December 1, 2009 Location: Stillwater, OKlahoma Posts: 8,638	I really don't have a dog in this here fight,,, But as soon as they start shipping,,, I'm buying one of their P-17's. It will be my first Kel Tec purchase ever,,, I'm hoping to not be disappointed. Aarond . __________________ Never ever give an enemy the advantage of a verbal threat. Caje: The coward dies a thousand times, the brave only once. Kirby: That's about all it takes, ain't it? Aarond is good,,, Aarond is wise,,, Always trust Aarond! (most of the time)

February 20, 2020, 02:52 PM	#11
Armybrat Senior Member Join Date: May 10, 2009 Location: Round Rock, Texas Posts: 976	My P32 was a neat, reliable little shooter. I regret trading it off. My P3AT, not so much. KT is a lot more innovative than Remington or Kahr, both of which I like and have bought several pistols each.

February 20, 2020, 06:05 PM	#13
osbornk Senior Member Join Date: August 11, 2012 Location: Mountains of Appalachia Posts: 1,598	I think I need to get one as I like to buy guns bashed by gun snobs. I bought a Hi-Point to see if they were as bad as the gun snobs said and found they were very wrong and it was a good gun. I then traded it for a Taurus to see if they were as bad as claimed. I found them wrong also and have bought 5 new ones since then. I found the same thing when I bought a Phoenix HP-22A, a RIA 1911, a Rossi rifle and most recently a SCCY CPX-2 9mm handgun. I haven't had a bad gun yet to go along with my S&W, Ruger and Mossbergs.

February 20, 2020, 07:15 PM	#14
unclenunzie Senior Member Join Date: July 5, 2016 Location: Texas. Posts: 140	I like my P32. I consider it modern best of breed in 32 acp pocket guns because it is light, small, locked breech, easy to shoot, good capacity, locks on empty, inexpensive and... it works. Under 10 ounces fully loaded. The ammo it carries is half the weight of the empty pistol, that's cool. Good pocket guns. __________________ I reject your reality and substitute my own! this space for rent

February 20, 2020, 08:01 PM	#15
Ricekila Senior Member Join Date: May 25, 2017 Location: Lawnguyland, NY Posts: 169	Bought a gently used P-11 -- ran about 100 rounds through it --- no problems -- Did a fluff & buff -- polished everything inside - shortened the trigger pull - lightened the trigger ( now 4 lbs. ) - mcarbo spring kit - steel guide pin - cleaned up the plastic - buffed out all the slide scratches & Duracoated - replaced two loose pins with the belt clip fasteners - stuck on grippy stuff - super smooth and more reliable - __________________ NRA Instructor / RSO & NRA Life Member / S.A.F.E. Armorer / 03-FFL / Moist Nugget gun nut / Ammosexual / COR of a Venturing Crew / And a right wing Republican Jew with guns Μολών Λaβέ Last edited by Ricekila; February 20, 2020 at 08:37 PM.

February 20, 2020, 08:08 PM	#16
JERRYS. Senior Member Join Date: September 23, 2013 Location: Alabama Posts: 2,969	I'm now the owner of a P32, again. I've replaced the recoil spring guide rod with the steel one, I've removed the laserlyte and buggered up one of the plastic frame pins so more have been ordered. might just go with the belt clip for anything beyond pocket carry.

February 21, 2020, 10:40 PM	#19
kenny53 Senior Member Join Date: December 30, 2015 Location: My back yard Posts: 971	The only Kel Tec I own is a 1st gen Sub 2000. This is a great gun and will empty a Glock 32 round mag as fast as you can pull the trigger.

February 23, 2020, 04:03 AM	#21
Bill DeShivs Senior Member Join Date: April 7, 2006 Posts: 10,985	I have a P11 with over 5000 rounds through it. No Keltec has a plastic slide, and they all have metal frames. Perhaps if you actually tried one, you would understand why they could be someone's favorite gun. __________________ Bill DeShivs, Master Cutler www.billdeshivs.com

February 23, 2020, 06:29 AM	#22
Old Stony Senior Member Join Date: May 31, 2013 Location: East Texas Posts: 1,705	I recently bought one of their new .22 mag carbines. I have taken it to the range only once so far and it didn't screw up until the second shot. I found if you didn't try to load the mags to full capacity, you were more likely to get it to work reliably. The mags are a bugger to load and that seems to be their biggest problem. I got a mag loader and it helps, but still not an easy thing to get done. When all is said and done, it actually shot pretty good. I was ringing steel rapid fire at 100 yds. with no problem. Neat little carbine and I'd really like it if they would come up with some better design of mag.

February 23, 2020, 09:27 AM	#23
ms6852 Senior Member Join Date: April 3, 2010 Location: Texas Posts: 1,394	I waited 5 years for the PMR30 as I always wanted a semi auto 22 mag without having to pay for the price of a High Standard. Glad I waited the worked out the kinks it had when it first came out, now I wish I had not bought it as I'm spending a ton of money shooting it. It is so much fun I find myself giggling like a little girl and its a laser and reliable as heck. __________________ ONLY TWO DEFINING FORCES HAVE GIVEN UP THEIR LIVES FOR YOU. ONE IS JESUS CHRIST FOR YOUR SOUL AND THE OTHER IS THE AMERICAN SOLDIER FOR YOUR FREEDOM.

February 23, 2020, 10:39 AM	#24
Forte S+W Senior Member Join Date: October 12, 2019 Posts: 819	The only Kel-Tec I've ever really had any significant interest in is sadly long out of production. The P40. Yes, I know that it kicked hard, (it's an ultra-light .40) and I know that the gun had to be held with a death grip in order for it to function reliably, but I would still buy one if they remained in production. __________________ Conspiracy theorists are the greatest political spin-doctors of all time. Only they can make the absolute worst political blunders sound like spectacular feats of ingenuity.