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Old January 6, 2017, 10:05 AM   #1
HuntingLikeABadHabit
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Lubing advice...

I've been casting and loading for a few years now and have always tumble lubed my bullets in alox. I recently casted some 405gr WW alloy 45/70 and they have grease/lube grooves. I thought no big deal, I'll just mix up some lube and pan lube what little bit of 45/70 I want. I mixed up some felix lube which i thought turned out pretty good, added just a bit of green for color and a small dob of vaseline to soften just a bit as I am a bit colder where I live. the lube feels great and feels sticky. The first time I tried to pan lube with it I could not get a consistent fill of the grooves. I tried again but let the pan cool a lot longer and it still did not fill consistently. I resulted to hand lubing as I will not be loading thousands of these so its not a big deal but I need advice as to how full the grooves need to be. Do these look good or do they need to be more full? Any other tips or tricks? I'm all ears!
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Old January 6, 2017, 04:15 PM   #2
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I think you'll find that even with conventional lube groove bullets, Lee's Liquid Alox tumble lube works anyway. If you are feeling uncertain about your hand lube job, you can always put the tumble lube over top of it for insurance. Other than that, the only way to be sure is to shoot them and see how the bore does.

I'll move your thread to the casting forum for you. That's where it really belongs.
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Old January 7, 2017, 08:53 AM   #3
kxkid
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just do the dry tumble harbor freight red powder coat. Very easy and works with any bullet style.
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Old January 7, 2017, 12:02 PM   #4
HuntingLikeABadHabit
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These are both good suggestions. I may just alox over top just to be certain. Would that also help with temperature effects that plague a lot of grease lubed bullets? Interesting thought nonetheless. I have powder coated .45's before and it turned out alright. I'm on the hunt for a .460 lee sizing die before I do too much more and definitely before I pc any. My .45s went from .451 to around .453ish before sizing. But that was before I really got good with the shake and bake method so I may get a thinner coating now that I've learned the method a bit better.
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Old January 7, 2017, 08:17 PM   #5
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Quote:
just do the dry tumble harbor freight red powder coat. Very easy and works with any bullet style.
There is not enough information in this post. If he is not familiar with Powder Coating, he may take that advice literally and just tumble, load and shoot without realizing that one has to bake the bullets.
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/foru...d-Alternatives
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Old January 9, 2017, 07:18 AM   #6
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I have been reading about powder coating my question is does this eliminate the need for conventional lubing ( alox or beeswax). And how is it in regards to
leading does it reduce the amount you would get with normal lubing.
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Old January 9, 2017, 08:36 AM   #7
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I have been reading about powder coating my question is does this eliminate the need for conventional lubing ( alox or beeswax).
Yes, the cured powder coating acts/replaces the need for conventional lubes.

Quote:
And how is it in regards to leading does it reduce the amount you would get with normal lubing.
At normally accepted cast bullet velocities, it eliminates leading completely. However, if there is still a need to adhere to bullet fit and other conventions (proper alloys) to avoid leading. In the instance of using Powder Coating on handgun bullets at standard velocities, leading is virtually eliminated as a factor.

You will get better answers to Powder Coating/cast lead bullet issues at the link I posted in post #5, than you will here.
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Old January 9, 2017, 10:25 PM   #8
res45
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OS11085 When I used to pan lube before I got my Lubesizer or tumble lubed bullets which I still do for some instances I found that cold bullets usually didn't let the lube flow into the grooves or coat the bullet properly,warming the bullets up in a pan but not hot to the touch allows the lube to flow into the grooves or coat the bullets much more evenly without any clumps of lube.

I've never used Felix's lube so I have no idea what it's like to pan lube with but I do mix my own version of Recluses TL using Alox or Xlox and JPW you can buy it premixed form White Label Lubes if you don't want to mess with making it,but the straight Alox should work fine as well. I generally thin my Alox with a little mineral spirits and warm it up as well as the bullets before applying it. All you need is a light golden sheen on the bullet and I like two light coats one before and one after sizing. You can tumble lube any style of bullet.

As to PCing bullets I do that as well mostly pistol bullets but I have coated and shot some rifle bullets as well and the results were excellent as long as I stayed within the limitations of the velocity/twist/bullets ability to stabilize. As to where you need to lube PC bullets there are two opinions on that for those that have tried it myself being one.

Some say it makes no difference an some say they get better accuracy. With handgun bullets I found no difference. With rifle bullets that have large deep lube grooves I found that running the PC'ed bullet through the lubesizer kept the lube grooves from being compressed under acceleration/pressure. It sore of a support mechanism that keeps the bullet from slumping as it's pushed through the bore at high pressure/velocity and the lube itself probably doesn't hurt either. I would say if you ever get to that point try it and see what works best for you.
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Old January 9, 2017, 11:01 PM   #9
OS11085
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Thanks guys you've answered my questions, I'm going to look into PC gives me
another alternative,HF not to far away might just get some of their powder.
res 45 : that make sense warming the bullets before lubing them, I have been heating my Alox been pan tumbling them I never thought of using the tumbler have to give that a try.
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Old January 10, 2017, 06:57 AM   #10
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With ALOX, you do not have to have "fully-filled" grooves. In fact (when I use it ) I just put some full strength on my thumb/forefinger
and rotate the bullet/grooves between them -- usually 2-4 bullets per finger-full. Coated, with "some" in the grooves.

Throw them into a slightly-warm oven on a plate and when dry -- shoot them.... FAST.
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Old January 10, 2017, 05:45 PM   #11
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With ALOX, you do not have to have...
It may help if you explained what you mean by "Alox". Do you mean straight Alox from the lubricant manufacture as a component to mix your own NRA formula, NRA Alox 50/50, or Lee Tumble Lube Alox. Just the term "Alox" can be taken several ways...especially for a neophyte.
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Old January 10, 2017, 06:58 PM   #12
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There's only one generally-accepted interpretation of "full strength" ALOX, and that's generally Lee's Liquid ALOX or the equivalent.
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Old January 10, 2017, 07:31 PM   #13
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There's only one generally-accepted interpretation of "full strength" ALOX, and that's generally Lee's Liquid ALOX or the equivalent.
Of course you are right...there is no such thing as solid Alox based lubes.
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/785...e-stick-hollow
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Old January 10, 2017, 07:47 PM   #14
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Again..."full strength ALOX" does not mean 50/50 ALOX/Beeswax -- which is what those solid sticks are (for lubrisizers).

The standalone term ALOX should be considered LLA or it's equivalent.
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Old January 10, 2017, 07:51 PM   #15
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Yes, you are correct. What do I know anyway. I have only been casting bullets and lubing them since 1964 (that was before Lee started marketing his Lee Tumble Lube). To those of us who have not been born yesterday, "Alox" has a much richer meaning.

http://www.artfulbullet.com/index.ph...alox-2138f.62/

Last edited by dahermit; January 10, 2017 at 08:07 PM.
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Old January 10, 2017, 08:22 PM   #16
mehavey
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Well, you have me by 4 years.
Just remember... all cakes may be different, but start with basic flour.

And for all you "youngsters," don't confuse "lube with Alox" as meaning pure, simple, full strength ALOX.

Last edited by mehavey; January 10, 2017 at 08:33 PM.
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Old January 14, 2017, 04:44 PM   #17
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How are you removing the bullet from the cake when you pan lube? I tried pushing them out of the cake but I often lost about 1/2 of the lube from the grooves. I went to "cookie cutters" and no more problems. One hint; I put my bullets and lube in my toaster oven to get them the same temperature. Lube sticks to the bullet much, much better...
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Old January 18, 2017, 01:01 PM   #18
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Hmmm. I guess the OP figgered it out...
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