Working down a load (.45 ACP for wife)

[Gerry]

My wife loves the 1911 format so much she stole my project gun. But she finds the loads I use a bit heavy for her since she's about 4'11" and weights 92 pounds soaking wet. I've also been introduced to using Unique powder in .45 ACP since a few months back thanks to a nice gift from a family member.

The minimum for 230 grain cast LRN in Unique is about 5 grains - found by cross referencing every manual I own and internet sources. Because of the alloy and the lee mold, mine come closer to 237 grains (give or take one or two in variation). They alloy is wheel weights - air cooled, sized .001 larger than the bore.

So I tried 4.9 grains, and the gun shoots accurately enough for plinking, or at least as accurate as I am at about 15 yards. Yesterday, we tried out a batch of 4.2 grains. The weather wasn't good for bringing the chrony, but I swear there was no discernible difference in accuracy or recoil between my 4.9 and 4.2 loads. And the 1911 with factory recoil and mainspring cycled without any issues.

I'm a bit amazing at the results, considering I'm so far below and outside the range of all the reloading data already. Although I have no plans on experimenting any lower, I find it all pretty weird. These powder companies wouldn't be publishing minimum data to make us use more powder... would they?

[Miata Mike]

I am shooting 6.2 grains of Unique with CCI primers and Berry's Plated 230 grain RN bullets. I find it plenty mild in my Ruger P345. Haven't tried it with a 1911 yet, but plan to soon.

I myself wouldn't go much less than published low load data and certainly not close to 18% lower. One of the powder manufacturers warns about loading certain powders too low (but for the life of me I can't find the source.)

If the action still cycles right, I would consider doing a chronograph on it when the weather gets better to see what you are actually doing for speed.

[kraigwy]

Years ago the NRA published a mild bullseye load for the 230 grn LRN bullet. It was 3.8 grns of bullseye, I works great even at 50 yards. I've been shooting it for years. Extremely mild and accurate. I shoot it in both my Series 70 Cold Cup and USGI 1911A1.

I think the misses will like it.

[m&p45acp10+1]

Trail Boss tends to to work well for me if velocity is not the thing I am going for. I tried some in .45 ACP a while back. the milder loads still worked the slide on my M&P full sized well. POA and POI mathced to 25 yards also.

[zippy13]

Even lighter than Kraigwy's pet load, 3.5 grns of Bullseye under a 190 to 200 gr LSWC is an accurate and easy shooting load.

With respect to minimum loads, many consider the loading manuals' "suggested starting load" as a minimum load. This isn't necessarily a valid assumption. Just like you work up to a maximum load, you can work down to a minimum load (unless cautioned otherwise by the powder maker). In both cases be alert to the signs that you're approaching the reasonable limit.

You may wonder why the reloading guides and on-line recipes don't list minimum loads -- just remember, many guides are written by folks who want to sell you powder.

[Gerry]

I should also add that I examined my brass, and non of it has burn stains on the sides that would indicate insufficent expansion. The gun didn't seem any dirtier than usual (I'm using tumbled Alox bullets), or dirty in parts where it usually isn't such as the mag well.

Another thing that is strange is that I noticed an obvious reduction in felt recoil when I went from 5.5 grains of Unique down to 4.9 grains, but not much difference between 4.9 grains and 4.2 grains. Perhaps there are diminishing "returns" over a lower load range in much the same way there are diminishing returns when working up a load? There doesn't seem to be a linear relationship between the load and recoil which makes me wonder how the speed differs between these 3 different loads. Hopefully the weather guy is right about next weekend being chrony-friendly and I can update with some velocity figures.

Meanwhile I'm making just enough of the 4.2 grainers to chrony and check the accuracy at slightly greater distances between the two lowest loads. I'm not fond of pulling bullets. And no, I'm still not taking this experiment further by going lower

By the way, the 4.2 grain loads are STILL one hole size larger than Lee recommends for Unique powder in their Pro Auto-disk powder measure. Anyone using the Lee directions without weighing and thinking they are using more than 5 grains of Unique are actually loading way under 4 grains!

[zippy13]

Gerry,
Your observations serve to reinforce the comments by others that the Pro Auto-disk drops light and should be use in conjunction with a scale.

[Casimer]

Pro Auto-disk drops light and should be use in conjunction with a scale.

+1

I've moved away from using such light loads w/ the auto disk because of this.

[floydster]

Gerry,
Try Trail Boss, one of my favorite loads with a 230 gr. cast RN is 4 gr. TB, what a fun powder puff load.
Floydster

[Nevmavrick]

I've had to work toward a lighter load, as I want to shoot steel, and the lighter it's loaded, the faster I can reaquire. If I have to knock down a target, I use a 230gr LRN, that's been loaded some lighter than usual.
My gun is an unmodified, full-frame 1911.
The best way to cut down on recoil, is to lower bullet-weight. As you're a caster, you might do the same as I...pick up a Lee 160 LRN.
It's a strange-looking little bullet, as it's very short in the ogive, so the OAL will be quite short, but you can seat it so the shank is even with the case-mouth. I've used it in competition, and it feeds fine in MY gun. My recoil-spring is the standard (16#?) that came with the gun.
The powder I use is Bullseye, but I've used WW231, and AA#2, and I've gotten velocities as low as 850-900fps, and still work the action.
My advice would be to cast them pretty hard. I usually use WW+2%tin, but WWWD, should be hard enough, too. The hard part would be so they'll go up the feed-ramp easier. The next step would be to go to a lighter spring.
Have fun,
Gene

[Gerry]

Lowering bullet-weight is a great idea for reducing the recoil for her while maintaining some accuracty, and then she'll have her own tailored bullets AND loads. I suppose I just need to experiment to see what feeds properly in this particular gun. Even if it doesn't work out, a new 2-banger mold is only $20 or so, cheaper than the cost of a single box of .45 factory ammo. Plus I can always sell the mold.

Now if only I could figure out how to convince my wife to cast her own bullets!

[zippy13]

Now if only I could figure out how to convince my wife to cast her own bullets!

That's the easy part if you approach it correctly: Do your first trial casting over her kitchen stove and leave a little puddle of lead behind. When she complains, tell her that you did the best you could -- the casting is in her best interest. You're sorry you spilled -- you'll clean it up, perhaps she could do a better job next time.

[mikejonestkd]

All of the above suggestions are great and will help lower the recoil to a certain point. The lower bound is the ability of the load to cycle the action, so i highly suggest going to a 8-10 pound recoil spring and sticking with 165-185 grain lead bullets. I love 231, bullseye and trail boss for powder puff loads in the .45 acp. IMO trail boss has the most gentle recoil impulse and should do well for your wife.

I personally use 3.1 grain of bullseye and 185 grain SCW bullets for ' new shooter ' loads when I take a friend to the range and it is very mild with an 8 pound spring.

Note - you will have blowback around the cases with the lightest loads, but it will not cause concern

hope this helps

[chris in va]

Can't remember the actual load, but I have a recipe with Universal and my air dropped 230's that piles brass at my feet in my Glock 21SF. Cycles the slide fine and I use it with our IDPA matches.