Why My Flintlock Fires Every Time

[kwhi43]

Here is one of the pistols with the lock mounted on the right side. The same
Lock is used on both pistols. The first one I had was with the lock on the right
Side. The fellow who makes these will put the lock on either side. Depends on
What the customer wants.

[Bill Akins]

Kwhi, couldn't the builder have used a left handed lock on the right side, so that the cock fell towards the rear rather than towards the front? Why does the builder only use a right handed lock for both sides instead of also offering a left handed lock so you could mount the left handed lock with the cock falling to the rear,....like he did on the left side of your gun, but also do the same on the right side? Wouldn't that also stop your front sight from "bobbling" around by the cock falling rearward but on the right side using a left handed lock?




.

[kwhi43]

They don't make a lefthanded Beckey lock. Also when I had my other flint with the lock on the right side, it was lot harder to cock it back with my left
hand and prime it. I would have to go over the top of the pistol. It is a lot
easer to cock and knap the flint when you need to, and prime with it on the
left side . It is auckward for me to do all of this with the lock on the right side. I guess it's just what you get used to. At my age of 70, I want things
as easier as I can get them. I think Siler makes a small left handed lock.Not
sure tho, didn't look . Don't think Rob would make one with a Siler tho. Just
too big of a lock. Yazel does make a flint pistol with a small right handed
Siler lock mounted on the right side. Had one in my hand.Problem is with me
I have a "Ruger" Mark 11 " hand and the Yazel pistol is a S&W model 41 angle
just dosen't fit the wife's and my hands.

[Captchee]

while its true that Davis doesnt make a left hand Becky i wonder why it is that he chooses to use that lock to start with .
yes its smaller then the small siler , but factually he changes the lock so much that its really a non issue .
i would think the siler could be cut down the same way or simply make his own lock plate based off of the Becky but use the small siler frizzen and cock.
Ironically , I have an apprentice currently working in my shop who wants to place the lock on his flintlock rifle , on the left side vs. the right even though he is right handed and is building the gun to be shot right handed .
For the life of me I cant give him a good answer as to why he shouldn’t , past it just wasn’t done .

I myself have shot many left handed rifles even though im right handed . I have never had an issue with the flash . I also know many left handed folks who shoot right handed guns , left handed and don’t have a problem .
So really possibly the real answer is that it all boils down to ( because that’s they way I wanted it )

[kwhi43]

Yep, If you have enough money, anything can be done. Rob, makes a living
At this. He has no other job. So he has to make money. You ought to see some
Of his shotguns. I think he gets a good deal on the Beckey. Now if you call
Him and told him you wanted say a Chambers Siler cut down to the same size
As the Beckey, he could do it. Probably cost you 1500.00. But he could do it.
His work is pretty top notch . After the wife had won the Nationals a couple times, back about 1994, With a Cimmoron Lightning, Rob came to us and told
Me that I ought to think about buying her a good competition pistol. I looked
At him and said, I will, if I can find anybody good enough to make her one.
He didn't know if he was going to get mad or laugh. His jaw dropped and we
All just laughed. We have two of his pistols. My Flint cost 600.00 That was
Around 2002. He told me he made it too cheap, and he never would make
Another for that. I think the last price was 800.00. I told him to look at it this
Way, the wife is making you famous. Ha! We all have a good time.

[greyhawk]

Captchee,

In reading yours and others post on this thread I noted that you are very knowledgeable about the process of hardening frizzens. I need help with, not one, but two L&R locks. Both are RPL's, which is why I had to go with them, and neither one will throw sparks worth a damn. I'm talking little bitty red sparks when you get any at all. I've tried everything that I know: many different types and sizes of flint, bevel up and down, polishing the face of the frizzen etc to no avail. Following advise from other forums I attempted to reharden one of them with no results. I heated it to cherry red, quenched in oil and then put in in a small oven for 1 hour at 350 degrees. The face still seams a little soft to me, my flint still leaves scratches but regardless - still no real sparks. It will produce a very small spark that clings to the end of the flint and glows for a fraction of a second. That's all.

In your post you mentioned that L&R frizzens are cast, I believe ,and required a different treatment but I wasn't sure which treatment and the method.

Would you mind giving me a run down on the proper steps to make those things throw sparks. I'm a builder, of sorts, and have been messing with rock locks for years but these have me stumped.

Many thanks and as a newbie to the forum I want to say I'm impressed by the depth of knowledge of you and the many other members.

Greyhawk.

[kwhi43]

If it was me, I would call Davis locks and have Larry Zorn do it. Cost you about
20.00 but it will be done right. He is one of the best.

[Captchee]

good morning sorry to hear your having issues with your locks . its going to be rather hard at this point for me to recommend what to do as I don't know to what degree you have effected the frizzen . IE did the 350 bring the face up to straw color ?
did you heat the whole frizzen to a good cherry color or was it just the face ?????.........

but ill do my best here .

yes the frizzens are from castings . so are the ones from Davis and Chambers . most everyone uses castings these days .
1095 is used which is a carbon steel . IE the whole part is carbon steel not just the face .sounds to me as if your frizzens have been drawn back to far.
the spark tells the tail . red is low in hardness . orange/ yellow is medium and white is on the hard side.

normally because cast frizzens are made from high carbon steel , they will be to hard . this is where folks often suggest drawing them back a little in an oven .
but before one does that , they need to know if indeed the frizzen is to hard . to check that , run a file across the frizzen face . it should skate across and not dig in .
if it digs in and you can file the face , then its to soft and the frizzen must be re hardened . if it skates , then we can draw it back in an oven .

350 deg IMO is about as low as one wants to go heat wise . you said you placed them in an oven. did you have a secondary temperature source so as to insure that you were actually at 350 or better ? what often happens is that the temperature setting on the home ovens is not very accurate . it in fact can be way lower. Add into that , lets say you used a gas oven. the heat generated by gas differs depending on altitude. IE lets say your cooking a pizza at 3500 ft . the cook time will be longer then it is at say sea level as it takes longer for gas to bring the cook temperature up.
so how do we get around that . well we don't trust the temperature reading that we set the oven to . instead we must trust the color of the metal we are working with as it will tell us what temperature its really at .

so lets try that process first as it's the easiest .
if there are very deep gouges in your frizzen face then we need to address that . when I say deep , I do mean deep . having the face chattered or wash boarded isnt really all that much of an issue unless its so bad that the flint bounces across the face . I actually have frizzens on a couple of my personal rifles at are very wash boarded. the spark wonderfully and I still get 75-100 fall per flint on a regular base .
what you do need to do is clean up the face so that its bright . don't polish it . just run some sand paper on it until its clean and bright .

now place the frizzen in the oven at 350-400 deg. don't take it out until you see the face has started become a nice straw brown color.
that color is what we want . if it doesn't show up , turn you oven up because its not producing the heat you think it is . trust the color . it will start to turn when the part comes into that 350-400 range , hold it there for at least 1 hour. then turn the oven off and let the frizzen cool slowly .
now lets say the file digs in and your frizzen is to soft . drawing it back will do nothing but make the issue worse as the carbon molecules in the Frizzen have not or are no longer aligned. so we must re harden it so as to have a base to start from .

KNOW UP FRONT THAT THERE IS ALWAYS A CHANCE THAT A FRIZZEN CAN BREAK DURING THE HARDENING PROCESS

so , when you heated the frizzen to cherry red , did you heat the whole frizzen or just the face ?
if it was just the face then we shouldn't need to re harden the whole frizzen . if that's the case then I would start by taking the face of the frizzen back up to a good sherry red . hold that heat just to the point you start to see the back of the frizzen start to turn color .
now quench it in Oil . Oil is a must for 1095 . it reduces the chances of the frizzen shattering . for oil I use just standard motor oil . leave it in the oil tell its completely cool . once cool , try the file on the face again . the file should now skate across the face .
if it does then we are good . if it doesn't then you can try again by going higher with the heat to a bright red color . but be carful as the more color that's produce on the lid and back of the frizzen the greater chance you will have to draw those areas back .
ok so lets say the face now is hard and the file simply skates across.
now take your sand paper and clean up the face so that its once again bright in color . now place it into your oven at 350-400 . I use 400 myself but you can try 350 first . again leave it in there tell the face turns a straw color .. then maintain that heat for 1 hour . turn off the heat and let the part cool in the oven .

you should now have good spark . if not then IMo the frizzen is probably dead and a new one is in order
or you can try and re carbonize it .
which is often done with cheep inported locks but really should not be needed with 1095 IMO