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February 20, 2013, 06:07 AM | #1 |
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Gun ownership and the legalization of marijuana
Hello,
I've been shooting and collecting guns for about two years now, and I have a serious question. My state just legalized marijuana, but I'm curious if marijuana use and gun ownership can go hand in hand, if we treat weed like alcohol, i.e. don't shoot under the influence and what not. Thoughts? |
February 20, 2013, 07:29 AM | #2 | |||||
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Welcome to TFL, and it's a good thing you asked the question.
Quote:
This was discussed at length here. Here's the deal with marijuana:
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February 20, 2013, 07:39 AM | #3 |
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^^^^^^^^^^ Yes to all that, And it's like drinking and driving- It is just not a good mixture.
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February 20, 2013, 07:42 AM | #4 |
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You just answered your question. One should not use or carry while under the influence of any drug that can impare your judgement or reaction times, except for the effects of Tex Mex of course.
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February 20, 2013, 07:49 AM | #5 |
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Wow, I didn't expect such an informative answer. I only asked because a friend of mine that I shoot with smoked weed recreationally in high school and now that CO has legalized weed he wants to get back into it and when he asked me about mixing the two I was stumped. It didn't seem like a good idea yet at face value it seemed legal.
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February 20, 2013, 02:06 PM | #6 |
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So, since Mr. Obama has stated that Federal Authorities would not be targeting recreational drug users I wonder how this might apply to gun owners.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/...8BD0Q720121214
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February 20, 2013, 02:37 PM | #7 | |
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Quote:
__________________
"It is long been a principle of ours that one is no more armed because he has possession of a firearm than he is a musician because he owns a piano. There is no point in having a gun if you are not capable of using it skillfully." -- Jeff Cooper |
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February 20, 2013, 03:17 PM | #8 |
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Also, another less formal recommendation. If in Colorado, there is a card, permit, or medical recommendation that one needs or can possibly obtain that would make the procurement of Marijuana easier, avoid it at all costs. It's basically an admission of guilt to a felony according to the ATF.
For instance, if one were to participate in recreational marijuana use and/or have a medical card in California, used a firearm to defend there home in a completely legal manner, they would still be putting themselves at a severe risk of being prosecuted at a federal level for a felony.
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February 20, 2013, 04:45 PM | #9 |
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So basically a no-go unless 100% legal under Federal law, something that will probably never happen.
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February 20, 2013, 05:03 PM | #10 |
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Correct!
My compliments that you asked. Given the climate today,beware of any policy that can make a whole segment of the population "prohibited persons" It would be good if all the pot sellers were required to post a warning sign "Still unlawful under Federal law,this means......'" Hmmm,good suggestion for my sheriff! Last edited by HiBC; February 20, 2013 at 05:16 PM. |
February 20, 2013, 05:13 PM | #11 |
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Are states that issue a marijuana card under any requirement to inform the Feds of such?
Would an antigun state do that on purpose to get those weirdo gun owners?
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February 20, 2013, 05:22 PM | #12 |
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Now consider being the owner of a legal pot shop.I do not know what the prices are these days,but consider you are sitting on an inventory worth what?$200,or300,or $400 an ounce......
And you are cutting into the territory of the illegal drug dealers,some of which have roots in the Mexican Cartels.... Rather seems like your shop would be a gun free zone... Could make for gruesome headlines |
February 21, 2013, 01:04 AM | #13 |
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You get caught target practicing on a National Forest while in possession of pot, you lose your pot and the firearms. Federal land, federal law.
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February 21, 2013, 09:18 AM | #14 |
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Some VERY good responses that understand the law. Also, keep in mind that whether or not you get prosecuted, if you are an illegal drug user the firearm can be seized and you will not get it back.
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February 21, 2013, 10:50 AM | #15 | |
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Quote:
If one is caught anywhere within the jurisdiction of the United States with marijuana and a gun, he is subject to prosecution for the illegal possession of a controlled substance and being a prohibited person in possession of a gun.
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"It is long been a principle of ours that one is no more armed because he has possession of a firearm than he is a musician because he owns a piano. There is no point in having a gun if you are not capable of using it skillfully." -- Jeff Cooper |
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February 21, 2013, 10:53 AM | #16 |
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Basically, you cannot be a medical marijuana patient, or a legal recreational user and a gun owner due to federal law. It seems the belief that marijuana makes you a crazed, addicted killer is still en vogue. The ATF has restated this in the past so people don't forget.
The federal prohibition vs. state legalization will simply continue to prop up the black market and do nothing to end the war on drugs. It'd be nice if this country woke up in this regard, one of these days.
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February 21, 2013, 10:59 AM | #17 |
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What's that question on the form you fill out when you buy any gun?
"Are you a user of narcotics or controlled substances, including marijuana?" Is that the exact wording? I know it says "including marijuana". Not sure if it says "user" or "addicted to" or some other language. In any case, I wouldn't think it helpful to be in court after a critical incident and have the lawyers present that you are a registered user of marijuana, which violates a federal law. Sgt Lumpy - n0eq |
February 21, 2013, 11:04 AM | #18 |
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I'm pretty sure it says "Are you an unlawful user of or addicted to any controlled substance?" or something in that realm.
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February 21, 2013, 11:12 AM | #19 | |||
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Quote:
The prohibiting condition is stated in the actual statute (18 USC 922(g)(3)) as:
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"It is long been a principle of ours that one is no more armed because he has possession of a firearm than he is a musician because he owns a piano. There is no point in having a gun if you are not capable of using it skillfully." -- Jeff Cooper |
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February 21, 2013, 04:35 PM | #20 |
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The way the question is worded makes it where it has no teeth as a screening implement. No one would admit to it even if they were shooting up heroin in the parking lot. It's questions like that that give the anti's fuel to use against us, mainly that we cry foul when existing laws aren't enforced because they're written in such a way as to be unenforceable. The only way to make the drug use question anything other than a waste of printer ink would be to require a drug test to buy a gun.
If marijuana is made legal and sold the same way booze is there can be no way of tracking its use and no way to screen gun owner based on use of it. But smoking a doobie and going shooting is still a terrible idea. |
February 21, 2013, 04:40 PM | #21 |
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Gun ownership and the legalization of marijuana
No question "works" as long as people can lie (and it's not something picked up on NICS). But if you are caught in a lie, that's another federal felony. Sometimes people get caught and prosecuted for that.
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February 21, 2013, 04:54 PM | #22 |
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I'm not arguing for a wiz quiz with each purchase, but I still think that for us to sit back and say "don't blame us, he lied on the form" is pretty much telling the anti's how to fix the law to make lying harder.
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February 21, 2013, 05:03 PM | #23 |
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hardworker
Many of us have been required to submit to drug testing to get or keep a job.It is a pass/fail test.One test is the hair test.If you have smoked pot during growing a hair,it can be detected. If a person were involved in a legitimate self defense shooting it may very well be there would be tests performed to see if the shooter was under the influence of anything.Testing positive for THC would give the prosecutor a strong card to play to the jury regarding whether judgement was impaired when the trigger was pulled. But,that is just problem one. Problem two,this person is now proved a prohibited person in posession of a firearm,felony. Problem three,if this person signed a 4473,false statement.Felony. Consider if a person is hunting,fishing,shooting,there is a reasonable chance of being checked out by an LEO,such as a game warden.The question"Do you have any weapons? May come up.Red eyes,odor,a seed ,etc can lead to a search. The OP had a great idea! Find out what the law is,where do I stand,how can I make good choices. To take a position"Thats all BS" well,a person can do that.It might be difficult to get a judge to agree. |
February 21, 2013, 07:41 PM | #24 |
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At least one state disagrees with the idea that medical marijuana and concealed handgun licenses are mutually exclusive:
Concealed handgun owners with Oregon medical marijuana authorizations will be allowed to keep their gun licenses after a U.S. Supreme Court decision not to hear a sheriff's legal challenge which claimed U.S. federal law trumps Oregon state law. |
February 21, 2013, 08:27 PM | #25 | ||
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Quote:
The Oregon Supreme Court, in Willis v. Winters, 253 P.3d 1058 (Or., 2011), ruled that Michael Winters, as Sheriff of Jackson County, was required under Oregon law to issue a concealed handgun license to Cynthia Willis even though she was a medical marijuana user. The case did not substantively address the federal law issue. In fact, the Oregon Supreme Court specifically noted (at pp. 1065 - 1066, emphasis added): In other words: Ms. Willis would not be arrested by Oregon LEOs or prosecuted under Oregon law for carrying a concealed handgun; but she can still be arrested by federal LEOs, prosecuted under federal law and sent to federal prison for being a prohibited person in possession of a gun in violation of 18 USC 922(g)(3).
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"It is long been a principle of ours that one is no more armed because he has possession of a firearm than he is a musician because he owns a piano. There is no point in having a gun if you are not capable of using it skillfully." -- Jeff Cooper |
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