ID 7x57 Mauser

[mgulino]

I need help identifying a 7x57 Mauser, but first let me tell you how I acquired it.
My dad gave me this rifle a few days ago. I had always seen it in the gun rack at home when I was growing up. When he gave it to me, he told me where he bought it. He was 19 (this would be about 1954) and he bought it at a local hardware store. The owner had about 15 rifles in a barrel, and my dad thought this one was in the best condition. He paid $20 dollars for it. He replaced the military stock with a sport version, had it drilled/tapped for a scope, and bent the bolt handle. It’s a fine looking rifle. My dad claims it is a M98, but I know better.
On the receiver ridge, there is a crest stamped, encircled with the words “Fabriche des Armes” and the word “Oviedo” stamped underneath. There is also a number underneath Oviedo, but I can only make out “1X22”. One of the scope mount holes was drilled through the second number. The 21” barrel, receiver, and trigger plate are all stamped with the number 6053; I‘m guessing a serial number. I pulled the bolt, and the front, bottom of the bolt is square. There is also a gas port on the left side of the receiver wall.
I'm thinking this is a M1916. Any help is appreciated.

[tahoe2]

Yep, not a 98
but a 93 (1893/1916)
Spanish small ring Mauser, mfg'd Oveido arsenal 1922,They are great little guns and can be very accurate.
Mine is a 1921 long rifle that was converted to a 20" sporter and prints 1-1/2" groups @ 100 with just about everything.

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[hooligan1]

What Im reading is that it is a 1916 Spanish Model short rifle First Pattern.
Barrel length is 21.75", caliber 7x57, 4 groove right hand rifling.
1893 style action.
Also some were converted to 7.92x57 in order to conform more closely to the Model 1943 rifle introduced during 1943.

[FrankenMauser]

1916 Spanish Mauser.

If you intend to shoot it, make sure it's still a 7x57mm, rather than an unmarked .308 conversion. (And if it does have a .308 chamber, hang it on the way and forget about shooting it.)

[Mobuck]

While I was in the business, I sold probably a couple dozen of the "1916" Mausers(both 7.62 and 7x57). Some were pretty nice and I kept 2 (a 7x57 and a like new 7.62) for my personal use.The flat bottom bolt indicates the basis rifle was an 1893.
The 7x57 should be safe with domestic commercial ammo(not superformance or litemag). I shoot the 7.62 using starting load .308 handloads(45K).

[mgulino]

Apparently, there is one other modification. The rear sight has been replaced with a peep sight. According to information I've read online, there should be either a leaf sight or a vizier sight.
She is a 7x57. I also received a half box of ammo. The empty cartridges chamber easily. She will need a good cleaning before I take her out for a shoot. Will post pics and a range report later. Thanks for the information.

[FrankenMauser]

I recently picked up half a bushel of 1916s. (Two of which turned out to be re-arsenaled and upgraded 1893s.)

After going through all of them, and combining enough parts to get two "good" rifles from the pile, and ensuring all safety 'systems' were functioning as intended, I found them to be very pleasant shooters.

As long the rifle's safe, I think you'll be very happy with it - especially since it has (I'm assuming) some sentimental value.

[mgulino]

I fired about 10 commercial rounds through the old lady last weekend. She is pleasant to shoot but very inaccurate. When I returned home, I deprimed the spent cases and cleaned them. That's when I noticed a small ring around the case just ahead of the case head. Measuring the cases, I noticed they had stretched a bit (about 3 thou) but are still with the min/max case lengths for reloading. I have ordered a field gauge (thinking headspace issue). If she passes with the field gauge, do you think she'll be safe to reload?

[tangolima]

Headspace shouldn't be a concern if you handload. You simply size the brass to fit the chamber.

-TL

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[tobnpr]

Headspace shouldn't be a concern if you handload. You simply size the brass to fit the chamber.

So long as it falls within specs. Headspace in excess of Field gauge can/will cause a potentially dangerous case head separation if the case cannot stretch enough without failing.

Under sizing brass that's already been stretched by fireforming is effective within limitations. To say "headspace shouldn't be a concern if you handload" is incorrect.

OP;
Field gauge will tell you whether the rifle is safe to shoot. You can also get a "no go", and failing that, add a piece of .003 cellophane tape (trimmed to fit) to the rear of the case and re-check for resistance to the bolt closing.

[tangolima]

Originally Posted by tobnpr

Under sizing brass that's already been stretched by fireforming is effective within limitations. To say "headspace shouldn't be a concern if you handload" is incorrect.

Don't use full load to fire form. Push out the shoulder to fit the chamber, instead of stretching the body.

Casings that have already been stretched, toss them. The goose is cooked for them.

In fact, if you only load with cast bullets, stretching due to headspace is never a concern. The brass never clinks onto the chamber to stretch. Misfire due to excessive headspace is a concern though. There is way to work around that to get the fire forming started.

I did all that on an arisaka t38. I got all hyped up when I realized it had long and big chamber. A buddy straightened me out.

-TL

[mgulino]

TL,
I understand I should toss the cases I've already fired because they have stretched above the case head.
How do I fire form new brass? A light load to just push the bullet out of the barrel? I can't then full-length size the once-fired case because it will push the shoulder back to 7x57 specs. Do I just neck size those cases?

[J.G. Terry]

We had a lesson in 7x57 cartridges when I was a kid. There were many Remington Rolling block rifle in 7x57. Many of these were in decent condition with good bores. Despite this there were reports of excessive head space and inaccuracy. The explanation was the rifles were right but US commercial ammo was not. The military 7x57 had a longer head to cone measurement and the bullet was larger diameter. This would account for the excessive head space and the small bullet bouncing down a worn bore. European and American specs are different. Pull a 7x57 military bullet and measure.

[James K]

Most of those Spanish rifles were not fired enough to create excess headspace even though the steel is not that hard. I wouldn't worry about it as long as you stick to factory pressures (35-40 or so) in the 7x57 ammo.

Some Chilean 7x57 rifles had the barrel rebored and reamed, then a new chamber inserted and reamed to take .308 (which is shorter than 7x57). The result works, but IMHO I would avoid that conversion. However, all of those I have seen have been Chilean, not Spanish.

Edited to add. Three thousandths is not a lot of stretch, in fact it is pretty normal. Double check that case; it is likely that the ring is not a sign of stretching but a normal mark from the chamber wall. If in doubt, section a case and see if there are signs of the thinning that results from case stretch.

Jim

[tangolima]

Originally Posted by mgulino

TL,
I understand I should toss the cases I've already fired because they have stretched above the case head.
How do I fire form new brass? A light load to just push the bullet out of the barrel? I can't then full-length size the once-fired case because it will push the shoulder back to 7x57 specs. Do I just neck size those cases?

Case forming is beyond entry level handloading. So you want to do your own research and decide whether to proceed.

The key is find a load that has low enough pressure that the brass doesn't clink to the chamber to stretch the body, and has yet enough pressure to push the shoulder forward. You can try the published minimum load. People can get quite creative in this regard.

The whole idea is to size the brass to fit one particular rifle. If that rifle has excessive headspace, the sized brass will be out of saami specs, and it probably won't chamber in other rifles. The sizing die will need to be set accordingly.

-TL

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[J.G. Terry]

Many people find these Spanish rifles to be in poor shape. This aggravates the problem of the different cartridge specs. Also, you may find it educational to slug the bore.