Full-Auto

AnthonyR · December 12, 1999, 07:49 PM

How could I convert a 10-.22 to fully-automatic? This is really the only gun for me where it would be economically feasible for me to do this. I think it would be legal because this is a pre-'30s gun, if anyone asks. ;-)

**4V50 Gary** · December 12, 1999, 09:05 PM

Converting a gun to full auto entails 2 things: technical expertise and second, legal paperwork.

The technical expertise generally consists of designing and building a trip lever which is activated by the bolt upon closure. The lever then "trips" the full auto sear or disconnector to release the hammer - thereby allowing safe discharge after lockup. (This is for a closed bolt weapon).

The Legal paperwork is a different matter altogether. It is not a matter of when your gun was built prior to conversion. Heck, John M. Browning could have hand made it back in 1880. Thanks to (ex) President Bush, no more machineguns may be made for civilian use. Anything made today must either be for military, law enforcement, or export. Simply put, it's a no-no today unless your anticipated conversion is done for any of the three and with paperwork granted as a Class II mfg from ATF.

Better to save your ducats for a legal class III firearm. The other route is a quick way to Club Fed and Bubba.

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Vigilantibus et non dormientibus jura subveniunt

SIG · December 12, 1999, 10:14 PM

Go see Butokukai.com

"GET RID OF THAT NICKEL PLATED SISSY PISTOL AND GET YOURSELF A GLOCK" Tommy Lee Jones

Byron Quick · December 13, 1999, 06:52 AM

Wasn't Bush, it was that Republican icon Reagan that signed the bill prohibiting the manufacture of new machineguns or the conversion of existing weapons to selective fire in 1986. Strange what we get from our "friends" isn't it?

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Byron Quick

**4V50 Gary** · December 13, 1999, 12:03 PM

Yep Spartacus, you're right about our dear Republican buddy fellow NRA chum George Bush. He signed that dastardly law which proscribed future manufacturing of MG for civilians.

I could have had a German MP40 (dewat circa 1945) restored to operating condition, but passed on it since it wasn't registered. Naturally, I'd have to have it out of Kali if it were restored, but thanks George! Maybe we should have let the Japanese captured you and have you for dinner (back in WWII, the Japanese were starving as a result of our successful submarine warfare campaign. Resultingly, they resorted to cannibalism to survive, including eating their own dead.)

------------------
Vigilantibus et non dormientibus jura subveniunt

Art Eatman · December 13, 1999, 01:05 PM

I vaguely recall that it was "No new machine guns made after September 1, 1985" for civilian purchase. If I'm right on the date, it was during Reagan's tenure.

Bush was Prez from Jan, 1989-Jan, 1993.

AnthonyR · December 13, 1999, 04:51 PM

What about the SKS? Legal paperwork doesn't bother me, and I promise if anyone asks I won't tell them where I got the information. I was just wondering how, I don't even have an SKS yet...

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Daren Thompson · December 13, 1999, 05:46 PM

Dang Anthony kinda gutsy to send out all over the web that you want to illeagally convert a semi to full. One would wonder at your occupation?

I really do not know how to convert the SKS. However I do know what it takes to convert an AK or an AR. It takes more than files, paperclips and buble gum. It really is not worth the cost of getting caught -10 years, fellony, no more guns EVER!!! Bad news. By a fully transferable auto weapon. Expensive -Yes Less than your criminal defence team by far.

The Firearms Owners Protection Act that outlawed the manufacture of machine guns for civilians was signed by Reagan. The law took effect May 19 1986.

Anthony I really think you are in the wrong forum if you what anyone to give you illeagal advice. My expierence with TFLer's is they are gun law abiding citizens. No matter how stupid the gun law. It will supprise me if any of the many on here that know the answer to your question give it to you.

Just my $.02 worth if that

Later
Daren

[This message has been edited by Daren Thompson (edited December 13, 1999).]

**4V50 Gary** · December 13, 1999, 06:38 PM

My apologies to George Bush. Curses on that second string actor.

Concerning the SKS, they were never full-auto firearms. You can buy them right now and the Romanian versions are hitting the market right about now. Remember, can't convert anything to full auto anymore. It's a quick ticket to Club Fed, Bubba and future disqualification of all firearm ownership/possession.

------------------
Vigilantibus et non dormientibus jura subveniunt

AnthonyR · December 13, 1999, 10:58 PM

I hadn't planned on doing it, just wondered if it was possible. The government bothers me... oh yeah, what do you think of those things like "Hellfire" and "Tac-Trigger"? Iv'e heard of them bbut never seen one on a gun.

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"Those that give up essential liberties for a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."

point308 · December 14, 1999, 06:04 AM

A couple of quick questions (from a non-American) to throw into the middle of this thread: Does the ban on new MGs ever expire?

And what happens to all the old MGs that police departments wish to dispose of? Can they be sold to civilians?

Point308.

Coinneach · December 14, 1999, 04:36 PM

Unlike Brady, there's no sunset date for the full-auto ban.

As for retired LE rock-and-rollers... good question. I think they're probably destroyed instead of being released into the evil terrible uncontrolled civilian assault weapons market.

------------------
"The evils of tyranny are rarely seen but by him who resists it."
-- John Hay, 1872

Daren Thompson · December 14, 1999, 08:10 PM

Anthony I have a weakness as a gadget man. I have bought the TAC trigger and HELL fire. They are JUNK!!!!!!!!! Neither one worked at all, big bummer. However next time you go to the range try this. It works with my AK and M14. I reallt do not know if it will work on an SKS but you can try it. Charge the weapon. Hold the weapon away from your body in your left hand. Making sure the weapon is pionted down range stick you trigger finger strait into the trigger gaurd. Move the weapon into your finger. Do not pull the trigger!! It takes practise so buy lots of ammo! The recoil of the rifle and the enertia of the bolt will do the rest. It works good I have had plenty of people come over to see my "machine gun"

Yes Coinneach I am A "gun nut" the guy who likes to turn money into noise with my tricked AK

Gary Bush- still banned the semi imports in 89 I really don't think he deserves anything

Later
DAren

[This message has been edited by Daren Thompson (edited December 14, 1999).]

**4V50 Gary** · December 14, 1999, 10:32 PM

Thanks Daren. Apology to Bush withdrawn. Serve 'em up!

------------------
Vigilantibus et non dormientibus jura subveniunt

kraMrD · December 15, 1999, 08:51 AM

Daren,

Your trigger bounce method works with my AR15 and I've done it on an SKS too... the Ruger 10/22 however does not have enough recoil to utilize this method.

Mark

danbrew · December 15, 1999, 09:37 AM

Ok, I'll tell you how to illegally convert your gun into a machinegun. It's pretty simple, really.

Step 1: Load up a 30 round magazine.
Step 2: Insert magazine, chamber round.
Step 3: This is the difficult part, turn the thing around from the way that you normally shoot it. Look down the bbl.
Step 4: Pull the trigger.

Ok, said in jest, (kind of...) but that's what you're looking to do if you illegally convert a your semi into a machinegun.

As this is the World Wide Web, there is a chance you're not in the states, so I'll mention that there are plenty of books (and internet resources) out there that will tell you how to make most guns go bangity bangity bangity. But... be warned, if your gun wasn't originally designed to be a full auto, it may be lacking required parts and/or structural integrity to be made into a machinegun. Don't blow yourself up.

Having said all of that, if you're here in the states, it is easy enough for you to purchase a fully legal, registered machinegun. You can pick up an AK47 for about $6500. You can pick up an M16 for about the same. MP5 goes for $7500 or so.

Check out the subguns.com board for pricing and such.

danbrew :->

James K · December 15, 1999, 10:42 AM

Just a thought.

A legal MG can be bought for under $10,000.

The bail on an illegal MG arrest is at least $100,000. The bail bondsman takes ten percent, or $10,000, as his non-refundable fee.

Would you rather spend $10k on a legal gun or on a bondsman's fee?

Not to mention legal fees, possible jail time, fines, etc.

Jim

AnthonyR · December 15, 1999, 05:52 PM

Maybe I shouldn't have said anything.....

------------------
"Those that give up essential liberties for a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."

Daren Thompson · December 15, 1999, 08:45 PM

Glad you said something Anthony that is how you learn. Now go try the bounce method !! Power is in knowledge. Heck I think I saw on a post were you are only 15. At 15 I did not even know it was possible for a civilian to own a full-auto. Ask more questions, when you turn 21 you will have all the knowledge it takes to buy a machine gun.

Later
Daren

December 12, 1999, 07:49 PM	#1
AnthonyR Member Join Date: December 12, 1999 Location: USA Posts: 67	How could I convert a 10-.22 to fully-automatic? This is really the only gun for me where it would be economically feasible for me to do this. I think it would be legal because this is a pre-'30s gun, if anyone asks. ;-)

December 12, 1999, 09:05 PM	#2
4V50 Gary Staff Join Date: November 2, 1998 Location: Colorado Posts: 21,832	Converting a gun to full auto entails 2 things: technical expertise and second, legal paperwork. The technical expertise generally consists of designing and building a trip lever which is activated by the bolt upon closure. The lever then "trips" the full auto sear or disconnector to release the hammer - thereby allowing safe discharge after lockup. (This is for a closed bolt weapon). The Legal paperwork is a different matter altogether. It is not a matter of when your gun was built prior to conversion. Heck, John M. Browning could have hand made it back in 1880. Thanks to (ex) President Bush, no more machineguns may be made for civilian use. Anything made today must either be for military, law enforcement, or export. Simply put, it's a no-no today unless your anticipated conversion is done for any of the three and with paperwork granted as a Class II mfg from ATF. Better to save your ducats for a legal class III firearm. The other route is a quick way to Club Fed and Bubba. ------------------ Vigilantibus et non dormientibus jura subveniunt

December 12, 1999, 10:14 PM	#3
SIG Junior member Join Date: December 5, 1999 Location: MA, USA Posts: 94	Go see Butokukai.com *"GET RID OF THAT NICKEL PLATED SISSY PISTOL AND GET YOURSELF A GLOCK"* Tommy Lee Jones

December 13, 1999, 06:52 AM	#4
Byron Quick Staff In Memoriam Join Date: November 13, 1998 Location: Waynesboro, Georgia, USA Posts: 2,361	Wasn't Bush, it was that Republican icon Reagan that signed the bill prohibiting the manufacture of new machineguns or the conversion of existing weapons to selective fire in 1986. Strange what we get from our "friends" isn't it? ------------------ Byron Quick

December 13, 1999, 12:03 PM	#5
4V50 Gary Staff Join Date: November 2, 1998 Location: Colorado Posts: 21,832	Yep Spartacus, you're right about our dear Republican buddy fellow NRA chum George Bush. He signed that dastardly law which proscribed future manufacturing of MG for civilians. I could have had a German MP40 (dewat circa 1945) restored to operating condition, but passed on it since it wasn't registered. Naturally, I'd have to have it out of Kali if it were restored, but thanks George! Maybe we should have let the Japanese captured you and have you for dinner (back in WWII, the Japanese were starving as a result of our successful submarine warfare campaign. Resultingly, they resorted to cannibalism to survive, including eating their own dead.) ------------------ Vigilantibus et non dormientibus jura subveniunt

December 13, 1999, 01:05 PM	#6
Art Eatman Staff in Memoriam Join Date: November 13, 1998 Location: Terlingua, TX; Thomasville, GA Posts: 24,798	I vaguely recall that it was "No new machine guns made after September 1, 1985" for civilian purchase. If I'm right on the date, it was during Reagan's tenure. Bush was Prez from Jan, 1989-Jan, 1993.

December 13, 1999, 04:51 PM	#7
AnthonyR Member Join Date: December 12, 1999 Location: USA Posts: 67	What about the SKS? Legal paperwork doesn't bother me, and I promise if anyone asks I won't tell them where I got the information. I was just wondering how, I don't even have an SKS yet... ------------------

December 13, 1999, 05:46 PM	#8
Daren Thompson Senior Member Join Date: December 6, 1998 Location: Elizabethtown,KY,USA Posts: 459	Dang Anthony kinda gutsy to send out all over the web that you want to illeagally convert a semi to full. One would wonder at your occupation? I really do not know how to convert the SKS. However I do know what it takes to convert an AK or an AR. It takes more than files, paperclips and buble gum. It really is not worth the cost of getting caught -10 years, fellony, no more guns EVER!!! Bad news. By a fully transferable auto weapon. Expensive -Yes Less than your criminal defence team by far. The Firearms Owners Protection Act that outlawed the manufacture of machine guns for civilians was signed by Reagan. The law took effect May 19 1986. Anthony I really think you are in the wrong forum if you what anyone to give you illeagal advice. My expierence with TFLer's is they are gun law abiding citizens. No matter how stupid the gun law. It will supprise me if any of the many on here that know the answer to your question give it to you. Just my $.02 worth if that Later Daren [This message has been edited by Daren Thompson (edited December 13, 1999).]

December 13, 1999, 06:38 PM	#9
4V50 Gary Staff Join Date: November 2, 1998 Location: Colorado Posts: 21,832	My apologies to George Bush. Curses on that second string actor. Concerning the SKS, they were never full-auto firearms. You can buy them right now and the Romanian versions are hitting the market right about now. Remember, can't convert anything to full auto anymore. It's a quick ticket to Club Fed, Bubba and future disqualification of all firearm ownership/possession. ------------------ Vigilantibus et non dormientibus jura subveniunt

December 13, 1999, 10:58 PM	#10
AnthonyR Member Join Date: December 12, 1999 Location: USA Posts: 67	I hadn't planned on doing it, just wondered if it was possible. The government bothers me... oh yeah, what do you think of those things like "Hellfire" and "Tac-Trigger"? Iv'e heard of them bbut never seen one on a gun. ------------------ "Those that give up essential liberties for a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."

December 14, 1999, 06:04 AM	#11
point308 Member Join Date: November 1, 1999 Posts: 37	A couple of quick questions (from a non-American) to throw into the middle of this thread: Does the ban on new MGs ever expire? And what happens to all the old MGs that police departments wish to dispose of? Can they be sold to civilians? Point308.

December 14, 1999, 04:36 PM	#12
Coinneach Staff Alumnus Join Date: February 23, 1999 Location: Denver, CO Posts: 4,272	Unlike Brady, there's no sunset date for the full-auto ban. As for retired LE rock-and-rollers... good question. I think they're probably destroyed instead of being released into the evil terrible uncontrolled civilian assault weapons market. ------------------ "The evils of tyranny are rarely seen but by him who resists it." -- John Hay, 1872

December 14, 1999, 08:10 PM	#13
Daren Thompson Senior Member Join Date: December 6, 1998 Location: Elizabethtown,KY,USA Posts: 459	Anthony I have a weakness as a gadget man. I have bought the TAC trigger and HELL fire. They are JUNK!!!!!!!!! Neither one worked at all, big bummer. However next time you go to the range try this. It works with my AK and M14. I reallt do not know if it will work on an SKS but you can try it. Charge the weapon. Hold the weapon away from your body in your left hand. Making sure the weapon is pionted down range stick you trigger finger strait into the trigger gaurd. Move the weapon into your finger. Do not pull the trigger!! It takes practise so buy lots of ammo! The recoil of the rifle and the enertia of the bolt will do the rest. It works good I have had plenty of people come over to see my "machine gun" Yes Coinneach I am A "gun nut" the guy who likes to turn money into noise with my tricked AK Gary Bush- still banned the semi imports in 89 I really don't think he deserves anything Later DAren [This message has been edited by Daren Thompson (edited December 14, 1999).]

December 14, 1999, 10:32 PM	#14
4V50 Gary Staff Join Date: November 2, 1998 Location: Colorado Posts: 21,832	Thanks Daren. Apology to Bush withdrawn. Serve 'em up! ------------------ Vigilantibus et non dormientibus jura subveniunt

December 15, 1999, 08:51 AM	#15
kraMrD Member Join Date: July 1, 1999 Posts: 55	Daren, Your trigger bounce method works with my AR15 and I've done it on an SKS too... the Ruger 10/22 however does not have enough recoil to utilize this method. Mark

December 15, 1999, 09:37 AM	#16
danbrew Member Join Date: October 27, 1998 Location: Chicago Posts: 72	Ok, I'll tell you how to illegally convert your gun into a machinegun. It's pretty simple, really. Step 1: Load up a 30 round magazine. Step 2: Insert magazine, chamber round. Step 3: This is the difficult part, turn the thing around from the way that you normally shoot it. Look down the bbl. Step 4: Pull the trigger. Ok, said in jest, (kind of...) but that's what you're looking to do if you illegally convert a your semi into a machinegun. As this is the World Wide Web, there is a chance you're not in the states, so I'll mention that there are plenty of books (and internet resources) out there that will tell you how to make most guns go bangity bangity bangity. But... be warned, if your gun wasn't originally designed to be a full auto, it may be lacking required parts and/or structural integrity to be made into a machinegun. Don't blow yourself up. Having said all of that, if you're here in the states, it is easy enough for you to purchase a fully legal, registered machinegun. You can pick up an AK47 for about $6500. You can pick up an M16 for about the same. MP5 goes for $7500 or so. Check out the subguns.com board for pricing and such. danbrew :->

December 15, 1999, 10:42 AM	#17
James K Member In Memoriam Join Date: March 17, 1999 Posts: 24,383	Just a thought. A legal MG can be bought for under $10,000. The bail on an illegal MG arrest is at least $100,000. The bail bondsman takes ten percent, or $10,000, as his non-refundable fee. Would you rather spend $10k on a legal gun or on a bondsman's fee? Not to mention legal fees, possible jail time, fines, etc. Jim

December 15, 1999, 05:52 PM	#18
AnthonyR Member Join Date: December 12, 1999 Location: USA Posts: 67	Maybe I shouldn't have said anything..... ------------------ "Those that give up essential liberties for a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."

December 15, 1999, 08:45 PM	#19
Daren Thompson Senior Member Join Date: December 6, 1998 Location: Elizabethtown,KY,USA Posts: 459	Glad you said something Anthony that is how you learn. Now go try the bounce method !! Power is in knowledge. Heck I think I saw on a post were you are only 15. At 15 I did not even know it was possible for a civilian to own a full-auto. Ask more questions, when you turn 21 you will have all the knowledge it takes to buy a machine gun. Later Daren