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July 23, 2009, 12:56 PM | #1 |
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Poice raid wrong house. What do you do?
This has happened in my area and I have always wondered, what to do?
This may not belong here, because I would sure not want to start shooting. But, How can you tell if the guys busting down our front door are real police or not. And what is the best way to convey your innocence? What happened here was a mistake in the intel. The team got the wrong address and busted in a house of someone totally innocent. Lawsuits, trials, and jury awards proceeded, but I can't help but think there is some really good way do quickly explain your innocence and prevent your whole family from being drug out of bed and handcuffed.
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July 23, 2009, 01:32 PM | #2 |
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First rule when dealing with LEO's - COOPERATE!
They aren't busting in the door to have a friendly chat over tea and cookies! The slightest bit of resistance will likely end in a very bad, and permanent result for you. If you are innocent, it will be found out when they take you "downtown for questioning". At that point, you have every right to take legal action against the department and the city or county (whoever employes the agency). Scott
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July 23, 2009, 01:35 PM | #3 |
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Not too long ago, I read about a case where someone had seen that in a town near them, a home invasion was covered up as a police raid... only after the BGs shot innocents did the homeowners realize they weren't really cops. Flash forward to a few weeks later, cops raided the wrong house, innocent homeowner (assuming it was the same BGs) opened firing, killing the real, good guy cops...
Bad, bad deal. |
July 23, 2009, 01:37 PM | #4 |
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I would think in my situation... If a well trained SWAT team decided to raid my house in the middle of the night, I probably wouldn't have time to take up arms or even make it out of bed.
We're not talking small time crooks here, who might trip over a sprinkler or knock over a yard knome. Unless you have a dog or two, I'd say there is a good chance you wouldn't hear them coming until you were already face down on the floor. I dont know... just a thought.
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July 23, 2009, 01:41 PM | #5 |
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first and foremost, if I haven't commited a crime worthy of a no knock warrant being served, I can safely guess that any one entering with force is a home invading intruder and will be dealt with as such. I ain't believing anyone claiming LEO status if I am not involved in criminal activity.
If I submit and they are real LEO's and making an error, I bet I get little more than a "Sorry 'bout that..." from the dept... Little recourse for a real "mental anguish and suffering" suit. Had to add... I do have several dogs and one will be shot dead as she will engage the threat as I roll from my bed grabbing the shot gun and bringing it to bear. Brent Last edited by hogdogs; July 23, 2009 at 01:43 PM. Reason: Had to add.... |
July 23, 2009, 01:43 PM | #6 |
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If you're not sure that they are real cops, then retreat to a safe room and call the local police to either verify who they are or to report the unlawful invasion.
They should properly identify themselves at some point during the raid, especially if there's a mistake. |
July 23, 2009, 01:53 PM | #7 |
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Articap, I am not wasting precious seconds during a home invasion to call 911, My wife will be reporting the home invasion as I go try to keep my family safe. Like I said, since I and my family members are upstanding law abiding folks, we have no reason to fear a LEO assault on my abode.
All I know is I have cherished 8 year old dog that needed no training nor encouragement to become quite a threat to the uninvited. If I hear a gun shot, I will send 5 rounds down range nearly instantly and retreat for the rifle. As a law abiding citizen NO ONE should fear a home invasion by anyone wearing any attire... ESPECIALLY A BADGED UNIFORM!!! Brent |
July 23, 2009, 02:16 PM | #8 |
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Exactly.
This is why no-knock raids get innocent people killed. An informant lies to get out of trouble, an address is misread, or filed wrong. Someone dies, either a cop or an innocent homeowner. In Ohio a couple years ago a man heard someone breaking into his house, so he grabbed his rifle. His daughter got to watch as cops shot him to death. The police were there searching for a marijuana grow-op. They didn't find one. Sad, sad, sad. |
July 23, 2009, 02:17 PM | #9 |
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Some of you guys are real entertaining, that's what you are!
If this is the "real deal" and they believe they are at the right address, you aren't going to have time to "retreat to a safe room" and if by chance you do get to your gun before they make it to your room, when they see you with your shotgun "bringing it to bear", you will be dead before you get a single shot off! You may think you have enough training for that eventual day when you might have to deal with a BG, but these guys train for it because it is their job to take out BG's. Of course you are a law abiding citizen who should not fear a visit from the SWAT team, but that doesn't mean they don't make mistakes. Obviously they do! I promise you that you are not smarter than them, you are not faster than them and you do not have more firepower than they have. Don't be stupid! As my fellow Missourian Sixer said, "...there is a good chance you wouldn't hear them coming until you were already face down on the floor. " Scott
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"I don't like repeat offenders, I like dead offenders!" Ted Nugent Last edited by scottaschultz; July 23, 2009 at 02:33 PM. |
July 23, 2009, 02:33 PM | #10 |
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...maybe. Unless you slow down their entry. It's not that hard to fortify entry points to give you some reaction time.
Be they bonifide LEO or not. |
July 23, 2009, 02:33 PM | #11 | ||||
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And if I get shot for defending my home, my wife has the number to the best lawyers in florida to take care of the law suits for my loss of life due to negligent police work. Brent |
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July 23, 2009, 02:35 PM | #12 | |||
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Especially if someone knows that they're the cops, then shooting isn't an option for the law abiding citizen no matter how outraged they may feel about their dog being shot. Quote:
Last edited by arcticap; July 23, 2009 at 02:52 PM. |
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July 23, 2009, 02:44 PM | #13 |
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How do you verify if they're real LEO before it's too late to defend against them if they are not? Hmm?
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July 23, 2009, 02:46 PM | #14 | |
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July 23, 2009, 02:58 PM | #15 |
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I saw a regional SWAT team in action in my neighborhood against a would be "sniper" who took a random shot out of his window into a neighboring window and then shot up his own apartment.
The ordeal lasted 6-8 hours, the law tossed in grenades, had the place surrounded, had snipers with .308's, they all had bulletproof vests [most w/helmets] and they brought in a heavily armored vehicle. The kook eventually came out with his hands up. End of story. Last edited by arcticap; July 23, 2009 at 03:08 PM. |
July 23, 2009, 03:03 PM | #16 |
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There are lots of us that go to work knowing that there is some hazard waiting that could cost us or lives. All it takes is one mistake and *POW* you are dead. The mistake could be getting a boom into power lines, the mistake could be letting the people in the crack house know that you are coming.
We take precautions to not get killed, like marking where the buried gas lines are or double checking the address of that crack house. If someone is storming into your house shouting "Police!" you have few options. How you tell if those folks are the police, I don't know. I do know that the cops in my town did a no-knock on a guy's house when they were looking for his neighbor from down the road. The neighbor wasn't home so they thought they would check around... But that is a story for another day.
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July 23, 2009, 03:10 PM | #17 |
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Sometimes you are just plain jacked.
Wish I had something more encouraging to say but that's life.
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July 23, 2009, 04:40 PM | #18 |
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If you are the victim of a wrong address police raid, you can choose 'Give Me Liberty or Give Me Death', or you can choose to be a serf like the rest of us, begging permission to request our rights. If you hurt a cop at all, you'll be the next Ronnie White (search Ronnie White, Maryland, suicide if you don't know his story).
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July 23, 2009, 05:03 PM | #19 | |
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I'm not saying someone couldn't get into my house if they tried. I'm just saying it would take them signifigantly longer than they thought it was going to.
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July 23, 2009, 05:08 PM | #20 | |
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July 23, 2009, 05:24 PM | #21 | |
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Just trust me on this, there'll be NO TIME to do anything but maybe sit up in bed if it's a trained entry team. I promise I'm not trying to sound like a know it all or brag or anything like that. But I've been a full time officer since 1981. I was on our county Drug Task Force entry team for 10 years. There is so much planning and rehearsing that goes into a raid. Before a house was hit, we knew which way the doors opened, inward or outward. Knew if there were dogs inside or not. Children or visitors. Location of bedrooms. Most of this came from informants who bought there or frequented the house, some came from officers who had handled calls there before. Every man on the entry team had a purpose. Some were dedicated to the stairwell and second floor. Some flooded the basement. If there were kids in the house and there were vicious dogs, one man was going in with a fire extinguisher for the dog. We had rifleman posted outside covering the upstairs or outside while the entry team approached. The breacher either broke thru or tore off the door and instantly, the house flooded with men who were trained to assault structures. Over in a flash. Usually between 0300 and 0500. And even in the rare instances where there was somebody awake or walking around inside, the sheer surprise and speed so disoriented them that they mostly just screamed and froze in place before being instantly taken under control. IF, and I never seen it happen, but IF someone ran for another room, there WOULD be men on him just as fast. IF he was able to slam a door, they are coming right thru it. They won't set up and stage unless it's a safe room with a steel door that somehow gets slammed before they get there. Am I saying that no person can still get off a shot or shots at officers? No. Plenty of lawmen have been killed by all kinds of people with all kinds of weapons. But I am saying that the odds are really in favor of the speed and surprise in which the police do these things. And ours was a small time outfit. The big city fellas are even faster and better trained. Professionals who do this regularly are not to be trifled with. Mistakes do happen for sure, but they're so rare that that is why you hear about them when they happen. ***And for the brethren here who think they have really fortified their homes against break ins, well, we've had houses where there were cameras on all 4 sides of the house and the doors were steel, windows fortified, etc. And all that was nothing compared to a tow truck that just rips the whole contraption off and while their door frame and door is clattering down the street...SURPRISE! The police WILL get inside and it WILL be fast.
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July 23, 2009, 05:34 PM | #22 | |
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July 23, 2009, 05:39 PM | #23 |
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if people storm my house and I know I did nothing wrong, but I defend my home from them, can I get in trouble? If they thought my house was the right one but it wasn't, and they blatantly got it wrong, am I screwed anyway? just curious
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July 23, 2009, 05:39 PM | #24 | |
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As for my place... There is zero chance that any of the four corners will be covered before numerous dogs alert. No one will be within 15 feet of my front door before i am awake with gun in hand. You see, I have numerous house dogs in all quadrants of the home and a yard full of hunting dogs outdoors. House is 100 yards from the roadway and the drive way isn't smooth. My dogs alert on any sound that creeps in and the windows are never closed! But this is nothing for worry since you told us that the wrong house won't be hit as all sorts of previous surveillance has ruled out those sorts of mistakes. Brent |
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July 23, 2009, 05:42 PM | #25 | |
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