New rifle trouble - Page 2

Hawg · December 30, 2012, 02:34 AM

You can always figure out how much front sight to have showing above the rear and paint it accordingly if you don't want to file but that front sight is plenty tall enough to file down without sacrificing anything. It wont take much.

Doc Hoy · December 30, 2012, 03:37 AM

I got away from this discussion for a coupla hours and now I see you are getting advice from guys who have good experience with rifles.

My thoughts were just based upon logic and a rather oversimplified (in my mind) understanding of the situation.

I agree with Articap that you should stick with it and when you get this rifle shooting the way you want it, you will have another one of those good BP stories to tell.

Lets say you decide the rifle has to go back.

I don't know what Cabela's policy is, but if you have a problem with the finish on the rifle, that is a defect that they should stand behind. I think that is especially true if you are considering a different rifle purchase from them.

If you clean it up like new, stick it back in the box with all of the documentation, they might be more likely to accept it. But if you start to filing to that front sight, I am pretty sure, Cabela's is going to wash their hands of it.

So before you get out the cutting torch, you might want to carefully consider all of your options.

I am still with Articap. Continue to follow the advice of the smart ones on this forum and get the rifle shooting right.

deerslayer303 · December 30, 2012, 01:14 PM

Yeah great advice, DEFINITELY try some round ball in it for sure. I forgot that you were shooting conicals. I have a Lyman Great Plains Rifle that will put balls in the same hole on the target, so thats what she is a round ball slinger and I wouldn't even think of trying anything else in it. And a round ball will put a deer down no problem, with anything else its all about shot placement, which goes back to finding out what that rifle likes. I commend you for wanting to hunt with a traditional weapon, and is what I'm into also. I think it will be a GREAT feeling when I take an animal with these traditional style rifles. Heck I've taken a great many deer in my time, so going to the woods with an inline or centerfire rifle is not that much of a challenge any more. Just my .02

Sure Shot Mc Gee · December 30, 2012, 01:50 PM

Just a suggestion you might want to consider. Before you start altering your rifle sights. By (filing.) There are a couple easy to do things first. To see if your can change this rifles point of impact at different distances.

After a return trip to your earlier thread chickenmcnasty. I took a look at your Pix Links. I thought I could see on one link what appeared to be a non-adjustable rear sight on your rifle. Having that type of sight kind of limits to some degree your rifles ability to shoot different bullet weights accurately. Many times usage of a non-adjustable rear sight requires the shooter to compensate for height, drop, left, right, at a known distances. If your willing to try different bullet weights and again changing your powder charges up or down some as needed. You still should be able to get this rifle shooting pretty close to acceptable with a little experimentation on your part.

First off. As anyone would say here. A 350 gr anything is allot of lead to push down that barrel. Unless your into elk, moose, or BIG bears. I think you could afford to drop down some on bullet weight. Someplace around 250-275 should be a sufficient bullet weight in your 50 cal 1-48 twist. Consider trying a Sabot Bullet or perhaps a Power Belt Bullet. In that weight range of (250-275) they should offer you a little better accuracy out to the 25 yard mark (first) and then out to the 100 yard mark for comparison.
Next item on the agenda. Powder. I never said you couldn't use Triple 777 chickenmcnasty. What I said is: I don't use it. Nor do I know of any shortcomings that may exist when 777 is used in a Traditional application. (So we have that settled for that other guy who purposely critiques others.) Back to the powder issue:
Consider dropping your charge rate or perhaps increasing your charge rate 5-Grs at a time. (But stay within the manufactures limits set for that rifle) Keeping in mind the reduction factor of 15% and trying not to bare down hard on your bullet or Sabo as to pack the 777 powder charge excessively. But keep in mind it does still require some compression. Just lightly done compression is all that's required. (777 apparently does have its quirks.) Now back to the sight filing advise. Under certain circumstances that indeed pays off. But keep in mind once its done. You cant undue. (other than buying a new sight)

If you just hang in there and do what I've suggested here. Keep in mind you might have a long string of changes in powder charges. And perhaps different projectiles. But most rifles do indeed have a Sweet Spot. No doubt it won't be easy to find that sweet spot. But it is there. In the end you'll gain some valuable knowledge and come to understand your rifles workings. And more than likely a fine shooting weapon will develop out of all that experimenting.

Another suggestion: When changing powder charges or bullet weights. Always keep notes of your findings and actions preformed. Write it all down on a scratch pad. Doing that will save you time and effort. Also.
Were all here for yaw. Just a little update every now and then would be appreciated.

S/S

chickenmcnasty · December 30, 2012, 02:12 PM

thank you all for the helpful info. I would be completely lost without you guys.
I've decided I want to keep the rifle and take the time to get it right. I can live with some blueing blemishes. We can just chalk it off to "character".
I need to purchase some roundballs. Midway has 490 and 495 diameter but I'm not sure which I need to order. I have the .010 patch material already.

Hawg · December 30, 2012, 02:54 PM

I'd go with the .490 but the patches you have might work better with the .495. Either way you're probably going to end up trying both sizes and different patch thicknesses til you hit the magic combo.

Sure Shot Mc Gee · December 30, 2012, 03:33 PM

Chickenmcnasty >Are you registered at a web site call CastBoolits.gunloads.com?

If you are or not? (above) Hold off for a bit on the ordering. I'm trying to hook you up with a seller. One who has a business making cast lead balls for muzzle loaders. Get a little better deal here I'm sure.

chickenmcnasty · December 30, 2012, 04:14 PM

I am not a member there. But i can hold off on the purchase in the meantime

Sent from my LS670 using Tapatalk 2

Sure Shot Mc Gee · December 30, 2012, 04:36 PM

Good. (not purchasing yet)
Friend 1500 miles from me can help you out on the ball purchase latter tonight. My friend has a friend that has a store front business casting balls for resale. Should get a better deal than at Midway. I've bought from this caster myself. Product and packaging are excellent. Quick to ship too.

Pahoo · December 30, 2012, 04:45 PM

Let's be practical. You will do just fine going with the standard-issue .490, as a starting point. During your progression you may choose to go to the .495. I know I did and now pretty much settled on the .490. You will find that availability will not be a problem as well as pricing. I just sold my .495 double cavity mould as I had enough run to last me awhile. ...

Keep it simple and;
Be Safe !!!

Sure Shot Mc Gee · December 30, 2012, 04:47 PM

Ok I got the info you need. I'm PMing a link directly to you. Nice thing about this site. His prices are posted. A nice menu to look over.

arcticap · January 1, 2013, 01:39 AM

The Pedersoli manual recommends using a .010 patch, a .490 round ball and 50 - 100 grains of powder with their .50 Kentucky.

December 30, 2012, 03:37 AM	#27
Doc Hoy Senior Member Join Date: October 24, 2008 Location: Naples, Fl Posts: 5,440	CM et al. I got away from this discussion for a coupla hours and now I see you are getting advice from guys who have good experience with rifles. My thoughts were just based upon logic and a rather oversimplified (in my mind) understanding of the situation. I agree with Articap that you should stick with it and when you get this rifle shooting the way you want it, you will have another one of those good BP stories to tell. Lets say you decide the rifle has to go back. I don't know what Cabela's policy is, but if you have a problem with the finish on the rifle, that is a defect that they should stand behind. I think that is especially true if you are considering a different rifle purchase from them. If you clean it up like new, stick it back in the box with all of the documentation, they might be more likely to accept it. But if you start to filing to that front sight, I am pretty sure, Cabela's is going to wash their hands of it. So before you get out the cutting torch, you might want to carefully consider all of your options. I am still with Articap. Continue to follow the advice of the smart ones on this forum and get the rifle shooting right. __________________ Seek truth. Relax. Take a breath.

December 30, 2012, 01:14 PM	#28
deerslayer303 Senior Member Join Date: January 10, 2011 Location: Leesville SC Posts: 2,652	Yeah great advice, DEFINITELY try some round ball in it for sure. I forgot that you were shooting conicals. I have a Lyman Great Plains Rifle that will put balls in the same hole on the target, so thats what she is a round ball slinger and I wouldn't even think of trying anything else in it. And a round ball will put a deer down no problem, with anything else its all about shot placement, which goes back to finding out what that rifle likes. I commend you for wanting to hunt with a traditional weapon, and is what I'm into also. I think it will be a GREAT feeling when I take an animal with these traditional style rifles. Heck I've taken a great many deer in my time, so going to the woods with an inline or centerfire rifle is not that much of a challenge any more. Just my .02 __________________ "I prefer dangerous freedom over peaceful slavery." - Thomas Jefferson

December 30, 2012, 03:33 PM	#32
Sure Shot Mc Gee Senior Member Join Date: January 2, 2012 Location: Minnesota Posts: 3,876	Chickenmcnasty >Are you registered at a web site call CastBoolits.gunloads.com? If you are or not? (above) Hold off for a bit on the ordering. I'm trying to hook you up with a seller. One who has a business making cast lead balls for muzzle loaders. Get a little better deal here I'm sure. Last edited by Sure Shot Mc Gee; December 30, 2012 at 03:44 PM.

December 30, 2012, 04:45 PM	#35
Pahoo Senior Member Join Date: February 16, 2006 Location: IOWA Posts: 8,783	.490 Let's be practical. You will do just fine going with the standard-issue .490, as a starting point. During your progression you may choose to go to the .495. I know I did and now pretty much settled on the .490. You will find that availability will not be a problem as well as pricing. I just sold my .495 double cavity mould as I had enough run to last me awhile. ... Keep it simple and; Be Safe !!! __________________ 'Fundamental truths' are easy to recognize because they are verified daily through simple observation and thus, require no testing.

December 30, 2012, 04:47 PM	#36
Sure Shot Mc Gee Senior Member Join Date: January 2, 2012 Location: Minnesota Posts: 3,876	Ok I got the info you need. I'm PMing a link directly to you. Nice thing about this site. His prices are posted. A nice menu to look over. Last edited by Sure Shot Mc Gee; December 30, 2012 at 05:03 PM.

December 30, 2012, 02:34 AM	#26
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 16,188	You can always figure out how much front sight to have showing above the rear and paint it accordingly if you don't want to file but that front sight is plenty tall enough to file down without sacrificing anything. It wont take much.

December 30, 2012, 01:50 PM	#29
Sure Shot Mc Gee Senior Member Join Date: January 2, 2012 Location: Minnesota Posts: 3,876	Just a suggestion you might want to consider. Before you start altering your rifle sights. By (filing.) There are a couple easy to do things first. To see if your can change this rifles point of impact at different distances. After a return trip to your earlier thread chickenmcnasty. I took a look at your Pix Links. I thought I could see on one link what appeared to be a non-adjustable rear sight on your rifle. Having that type of sight kind of limits to some degree your rifles ability to shoot different bullet weights accurately. Many times usage of a non-adjustable rear sight requires the shooter to compensate for height, drop, left, right, at a known distances. If your willing to try different bullet weights and again changing your powder charges up or down some as needed. You still should be able to get this rifle shooting pretty close to acceptable with a little experimentation on your part. First off. As anyone would say here. A 350 gr anything is allot of lead to push down that barrel. Unless your into elk, moose, or BIG bears. I think you could afford to drop down some on bullet weight. Someplace around 250-275 should be a sufficient bullet weight in your 50 cal 1-48 twist. Consider trying a Sabot Bullet or perhaps a Power Belt Bullet. In that weight range of (250-275) they should offer you a little better accuracy out to the 25 yard mark (first) and then out to the 100 yard mark for comparison. Next item on the agenda. Powder. I never said you couldn't use Triple 777 chickenmcnasty. What I said is: I don't use it. Nor do I know of any shortcomings that may exist when 777 is used in a Traditional application. (So we have that settled for that other guy who purposely critiques others.) Back to the powder issue: Consider dropping your charge rate or perhaps increasing your charge rate 5-Grs at a time. (But stay within the manufactures limits set for that rifle) Keeping in mind the reduction factor of 15% and trying not to bare down hard on your bullet or Sabo as to pack the 777 powder charge excessively. But keep in mind it does still require some compression. Just lightly done compression is all that's required. (777 apparently does have its quirks.) Now back to the sight filing advise. Under certain circumstances that indeed pays off. But keep in mind once its done. You cant undue. (other than buying a new sight) If you just hang in there and do what I've suggested here. Keep in mind you might have a long string of changes in powder charges. And perhaps different projectiles. But most rifles do indeed have a Sweet Spot. No doubt it won't be easy to find that sweet spot. But it is there. In the end you'll gain some valuable knowledge and come to understand your rifles workings. And more than likely a fine shooting weapon will develop out of all that experimenting. Another suggestion: When changing powder charges or bullet weights. Always keep notes of your findings and actions preformed. Write it all down on a scratch pad. Doing that will save you time and effort. Also. Were all here for yaw. Just a little update every now and then would be appreciated. S/S

December 30, 2012, 02:12 PM	#30
chickenmcnasty Senior Member Join Date: December 10, 2012 Location: Wichita, KS Posts: 158	thank you all for the helpful info. I would be completely lost without you guys. I've decided I want to keep the rifle and take the time to get it right. I can live with some blueing blemishes. We can just chalk it off to "character". I need to purchase some roundballs. Midway has 490 and 495 diameter but I'm not sure which I need to order. I have the .010 patch material already.

December 30, 2012, 02:54 PM	#31
Hawg Senior Member Join Date: September 8, 2007 Location: Mississippi Posts: 16,188	I'd go with the .490 but the patches you have might work better with the .495. Either way you're probably going to end up trying both sizes and different patch thicknesses til you hit the magic combo.

December 30, 2012, 04:14 PM	#33
chickenmcnasty Senior Member Join Date: December 10, 2012 Location: Wichita, KS Posts: 158	I am not a member there. But i can hold off on the purchase in the meantime Sent from my LS670 using Tapatalk 2

December 30, 2012, 04:36 PM	#34
Sure Shot Mc Gee Senior Member Join Date: January 2, 2012 Location: Minnesota Posts: 3,876	Good. (not purchasing yet) Friend 1500 miles from me can help you out on the ball purchase latter tonight. My friend has a friend that has a store front business casting balls for resale. Should get a better deal than at Midway. I've bought from this caster myself. Product and packaging are excellent. Quick to ship too.

January 1, 2013, 01:39 AM	#37
arcticap Senior Member Join Date: March 15, 2005 Location: Central Connecticut Posts: 3,166	The Pedersoli manual recommends using a .010 patch, a .490 round ball and 50 - 100 grains of powder with their .50 Kentucky.