Need Help to identify shot gun

canbe shawnee · November 21, 2011, 03:11 PM

I have an black powder 1840 - 1850 12ga percussion 30 inch barrell looking for more info and value

briandg · November 21, 2011, 05:14 PM

wow, that's a pretty piece.

Jim Watson · November 21, 2011, 05:39 PM

It IS pretty with a very strong Damascus pattern to the barrel and nice stock wood.

It is Belgian - the ELG proofmark has been used there for a LONG time.
It is kind of hard to say more besides what you see is what you get but there is not much to know when the maker does not put his name on his product.
Maybe the J I N signifies something, but nothing I have seen.
It is likely a "guild gun" assembled from parts made by small independent shops and therefore with no real brand name.

canbe shawnee · November 21, 2011, 07:58 PM

We thought it was a wire twist barrel is there a diff? Is there any other sites that would be able to shed more light? Any Idea of value?

Jim Watson · November 21, 2011, 08:15 PM

You might poke around over at
http://www.littlegun.be/arme%20belge...belge%20gb.htm
which is a Belgian site about Belgian and other European guns.

Damascus, wire twist, stub twist, laminated steel, etc., might have different detailed meanings to the real collector but the manner of construction is the same; hammer welded strips of iron and steel formed around a mandrel, then reamed and ground into final shape for a gun barrel.

mapsjanhere · November 21, 2011, 08:19 PM

It's in decent shape, but it's Belgian with no marker mark - value is whatever you get as a decorative item, $250 - 400 would be my guess.

canbe shawnee · November 21, 2011, 08:28 PM

This gun does shoot

briandg · November 21, 2011, 11:19 PM

In my opinion, you should NOT be firing that weapon. the welded steel barrels of that age have had plenty of opportunities for little weak spots to form, little pockets of corrosion and so forth, and wind up with places that can rupture even with black powder loads.

If you want to shoot a black powder shotgun you can buy them new. You can buy antiques that aren't pattern welded.

Retire that thing so you don't risk damaging it.

natman · November 22, 2011, 05:11 AM

I wouldn't shoot a 150+ year old damascas barreled shotgun, especially one from an unknown maker. It's a nice looking gun, hang it over the fireplace and look at it.

November 21, 2011, 03:11 PM	#1
canbe shawnee Junior Member Join Date: November 21, 2011 Posts: 3	Need Help to identify shot gun I have an black powder 1840 - 1850 12ga percussion 30 inch barrell looking for more info and valuegun1.jpg gun2.jpg gun3.jpg

November 21, 2011, 08:19 PM	#6
mapsjanhere Senior Member Join Date: August 6, 2009 Location: Albuquerque Posts: 2,832	It's in decent shape, but it's Belgian with no marker mark - value is whatever you get as a decorative item, $250 - 400 would be my guess. __________________ I used to love being able to hit hard at 1000 yards. As I get older I find hitting a mini ram at 200 yards with the 22 oddly more satisfying.

November 21, 2011, 05:14 PM	#2
briandg Senior Member Join Date: May 4, 2010 Posts: 5,468	wow, that's a pretty piece.

November 21, 2011, 05:39 PM	#3
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 18,539	It IS pretty with a very strong Damascus pattern to the barrel and nice stock wood. It is Belgian - the ELG proofmark has been used there for a LONG time. It is kind of hard to say more besides what you see is what you get but there is not much to know when the maker does not put his name on his product. Maybe the J I N signifies something, but nothing I have seen. It is likely a "guild gun" assembled from parts made by small independent shops and therefore with no real brand name.

November 21, 2011, 07:58 PM	#4
canbe shawnee Junior Member Join Date: November 21, 2011 Posts: 3	We thought it was a wire twist barrel is there a diff? Is there any other sites that would be able to shed more light? Any Idea of value?

November 21, 2011, 08:15 PM	#5
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 18,539	You might poke around over at http://www.littlegun.be/arme%20belge...belge%20gb.htm which is a Belgian site about Belgian and other European guns. Damascus, wire twist, stub twist, laminated steel, etc., might have different detailed meanings to the real collector but the manner of construction is the same; hammer welded strips of iron and steel formed around a mandrel, then reamed and ground into final shape for a gun barrel.

November 21, 2011, 08:28 PM	#7
canbe shawnee Junior Member Join Date: November 21, 2011 Posts: 3	This gun does shoot

November 21, 2011, 11:19 PM	#8
briandg Senior Member Join Date: May 4, 2010 Posts: 5,468	In my opinion, you should NOT be firing that weapon. the welded steel barrels of that age have had plenty of opportunities for little weak spots to form, little pockets of corrosion and so forth, and wind up with places that can rupture even with black powder loads. If you want to shoot a black powder shotgun you can buy them new. You can buy antiques that aren't pattern welded. Retire that thing so you don't risk damaging it.

November 22, 2011, 05:11 AM	#9
natman Senior Member Join Date: June 24, 2008 Posts: 2,606	I wouldn't shoot a 150+ year old damascas barreled shotgun, especially one from an unknown maker. It's a nice looking gun, hang it over the fireplace and look at it.