pipe shotgun question

glocknineguy · July 14, 2006, 06:37 PM

im only asking for info purposes i do not plan on building this gun. if someone was to make a pipe shotgun or slam fired shotgun out of two pipes and a couple other parts and made the barrel long enough so the gun was the legal length would it still be leagal?

GlocksRfun · July 14, 2006, 10:41 PM

I don't know.. barrel at 18 inches, overall at 26 inches,... something like that... I'd just buy a normal shotgun. I'm not sure what the make it yourself laws are.

Maser · July 17, 2006, 02:18 AM

It is perfectly legal to build your own "conventional" type of firearm. I'm not sure if the barrel and overall length rule still applies though. The only type of pipe gun I ever made was powered by blackpowder. Wasn't very powerful and was very dirty. The barrel was well over 18" though.

Was probly like 32".

Johnny Guest · July 17, 2006, 08:44 AM

This topic surfaces from time to time, usually to indicate the futility of outlawing firearms. It is relatively easy to come up with a working firearm if fixed ammunition is at all avilable. Even if not, there is little difficulty in cobbling up some pretty decent black powder for use in muzzle loaders.

News accounts of guerilla and insurrectionist activity in the Philippines and Indonesia especially contain mention of such munitions. Run a Google search for "Improvised firearms Philippines" and you'll get over 30,000 references to check out.

Many "helpful hints" for home made arms center on the shotgun for several reasons. Shotguns are so useful in foraging for food and for short range defense that they may often remain available to oppressed people long after handguns and rifles are outlawed. Even once these are confiscated, individual rounds of ammunition remain in hiding or in circulation for years thereafter.

Most, if not all, standard sporting-type shotshells have straight-sided cases with rims. This makes it easy to scrounge up the proper size pipe or metal tubing to become the barrel, and which will hold the shell in position for firing. A shorter and slightly larger diameter length of pipe can be located which will slide over the rear of the barrel and form the breech. A firing pin is affixed inside a threaded cap which closes the back of the barrel.

With a shell "chambered" in the barrel, the assembly may be slid into the other pipe with sufficient impact so that the pin impinges the shotshell primer and the shell is thereby fired. All else is refinement. Usually the first is to form a butt stock for the breech end and a handle for the barrel, to provide a measure of control and stability. Next would be a mechanism to prevent the barrel sliding the shell head into contact with the firing pin. This could be a hole drilled through the two pieces and a transverse metal pin fitted to prevent movement of either component.

It should be noted that not all metal pipe is suitable for such uses. There have undoubtedly been many serious accidents caused by flawed or thin-walled pipe giving way when the shell fired. While it is easy, and arguably legal to home-make such arms, bearing in mind certain restrictions, it is far from safe unless sufficient precautions are taken.

While black powder muzzle loading arms are relatively free from many restrictions, using fixed ammunition requires consideration of barrel length (18" for smoothbores) and overall length (26") minimums.

Best
Johnny

James K · July 18, 2006, 11:18 AM

Sometime in the late 1940's, there was a shotgun marketed in this country that copied the "Philippine" shotgun, though it was made of better materials. It worked the same way, by pulling a barrel back against a fixed firing pin inside an outer tube. Not a Purdey, but it fired. (I forget the name, but I am sure someone will recall it.) It had a conventional shoulder stock, even though it was just a piece of board without a buttplate.

AFAIK, there is no law dictating the design of a single shot shotgun, so it was sold legally and presumably could be made legally either for individual use or as a commercial venture. Making it without a shoulder stock or with a pistol grip would be illegal, though.

Jim

silicon wolverine · July 18, 2006, 12:53 PM

As long as it doesnt violate NFA laws anything goes in homemade guns. Jim K, as long as it has a 18" barrel and overall of 26" a pistol grip is fine as far as i know.

SW

kozak6 · July 18, 2006, 01:40 PM

Actually, local laws are extremely important as well.

California, for example. Need I say more?

glocknineguy · July 18, 2006, 03:44 PM

im pretty sure that thair are no laws hire in ohio if their are let me know and i will take certain precaution as to make the barrel 18" or over and the overall length 26" or more and i will be testing it at a safe distance to make sure its safe and i will be using seamles steel piping and ill try to find it with thick walls im just making it for the fun of it just to try it you know i might just make it a 22lr or 12 gauge or make both but i know that either way i go it will be smooth bore and it will be the legal lengths

July 14, 2006, 06:37 PM	#1
glocknineguy Member Join Date: March 20, 2006 Posts: 47	pipe shotgun question im only asking for info purposes i do not plan on building this gun. if someone was to make a pipe shotgun or slam fired shotgun out of two pipes and a couple other parts and made the barrel long enough so the gun was the legal length would it still be leagal?

July 17, 2006, 08:44 AM	#4
Johnny Guest Moderator in Memoriam Join Date: August 28, 1999 Location: North Texas Posts: 4,123	Improvised and home made firearms This topic surfaces from time to time, usually to indicate the futility of outlawing firearms. It is relatively easy to come up with a working firearm if fixed ammunition is at all avilable. Even if not, there is little difficulty in cobbling up some pretty decent black powder for use in muzzle loaders. News accounts of guerilla and insurrectionist activity in the Philippines and Indonesia especially contain mention of such munitions. Run a Google search for "Improvised firearms Philippines" and you'll get over 30,000 references to check out. Many "helpful hints" for home made arms center on the shotgun for several reasons. Shotguns are so useful in foraging for food and for short range defense that they may often remain available to oppressed people long after handguns and rifles are outlawed. Even once these are confiscated, individual rounds of ammunition remain in hiding or in circulation for years thereafter. Most, if not all, standard sporting-type shotshells have straight-sided cases with rims. This makes it easy to scrounge up the proper size pipe or metal tubing to become the barrel, and which will hold the shell in position for firing. A shorter and slightly larger diameter length of pipe can be located which will slide over the rear of the barrel and form the breech. A firing pin is affixed inside a threaded cap which closes the back of the barrel. With a shell "chambered" in the barrel, the assembly may be slid into the other pipe with sufficient impact so that the pin impinges the shotshell primer and the shell is thereby fired. All else is refinement. Usually the first is to form a butt stock for the breech end and a handle for the barrel, to provide a measure of control and stability. Next would be a mechanism to prevent the barrel sliding the shell head into contact with the firing pin. This could be a hole drilled through the two pieces and a transverse metal pin fitted to prevent movement of either component. It should be noted that not all metal pipe is suitable for such uses. There have undoubtedly been many serious accidents caused by flawed or thin-walled pipe giving way when the shell fired. While it is easy, and arguably legal to home-make such arms, bearing in mind certain restrictions, it is far from safe unless sufficient precautions are taken. While black powder muzzle loading arms are relatively free from many restrictions, using fixed ammunition requires consideration of barrel length (18" for smoothbores) and overall length (26") minimums. Best Johnny

July 14, 2006, 10:41 PM	#2
GlocksRfun Senior Member Join Date: January 30, 2006 Location: Wisconsin Posts: 423	I don't know.. barrel at 18 inches, overall at 26 inches,... something like that... I'd just buy a normal shotgun. I'm not sure what the make it yourself laws are.

July 17, 2006, 02:18 AM	#3
Maser Senior Member Join Date: May 21, 2006 Location: Mysterious Cities of Gold Posts: 920	It is perfectly legal to build your own "conventional" type of firearm. I'm not sure if the barrel and overall length rule still applies though. The only type of pipe gun I ever made was powered by blackpowder. Wasn't very powerful and was very dirty. The barrel was well over 18" though. Was probly like 32".

July 18, 2006, 11:18 AM	#5
James K Member In Memoriam Join Date: March 17, 1999 Posts: 24,383	Sometime in the late 1940's, there was a shotgun marketed in this country that copied the "Philippine" shotgun, though it was made of better materials. It worked the same way, by pulling a barrel back against a fixed firing pin inside an outer tube. Not a Purdey, but it fired. (I forget the name, but I am sure someone will recall it.) It had a conventional shoulder stock, even though it was just a piece of board without a buttplate. AFAIK, there is no law dictating the design of a single shot shotgun, so it was sold legally and presumably could be made legally either for individual use or as a commercial venture. Making it without a shoulder stock or with a pistol grip would be illegal, though. Jim

July 18, 2006, 12:53 PM	#6
silicon wolverine Senior Member Join Date: April 28, 2006 Location: South dakota Posts: 674	As long as it doesnt violate NFA laws anything goes in homemade guns. Jim K, as long as it has a 18" barrel and overall of 26" a pistol grip is fine as far as i know. SW

July 18, 2006, 01:40 PM	#7
kozak6 Senior Member Join Date: June 16, 2005 Location: AZ Posts: 3,113	Actually, local laws are extremely important as well. California, for example. Need I say more?

July 18, 2006, 03:44 PM	#8
glocknineguy Member Join Date: March 20, 2006 Posts: 47	im pretty sure that thair are no laws hire in ohio if their are let me know and i will take certain precaution as to make the barrel 18" or over and the overall length 26" or more and i will be testing it at a safe distance to make sure its safe and i will be using seamles steel piping and ill try to find it with thick walls im just making it for the fun of it just to try it you know i might just make it a 22lr or 12 gauge or make both but i know that either way i go it will be smooth bore and it will be the legal lengths