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Old April 16, 2017, 04:19 AM   #26
G.barnes
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On the robski video with the DD. It starts having problems, but as soon as ge opens it up everything is fine inside and the rifle starts working again with no problem. Any manufacturer of an ar can have a poped primer or piece of junk get into the fcg.
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Old April 16, 2017, 04:36 AM   #27
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Quote:
I'm not saying the OP will run the rifle like Robski, and I know it's a sample of one. If we judged every brand by a sample of one, there wouldn't be any rifles worth buying.

But you also said Rifle tip: don't drop the rifle. Stuff happens at times, and rugged gear is preferred. I'd trust a DD, but for a usual lower price, other rifles perform just as well.
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Old April 16, 2017, 05:09 AM   #28
marine6680
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There is also the odd fluke as well.

A entry level PSA Freedom line rifle performed very well in his testing... While not a bad rifle, I don't think anyone would say it is better than aDD even if it faired better in that example of one.


Many companies make a fine AR now... Colt is not the only game in town making good quality rifles. If you research, you can find many brands that receive high praise. For example, FN makes rifles for the military now too...


Ultimately you have to look at your buying budget, and then factor in the rifle, several spare mags, sights, maybe an optic... and ammo to run it with.

Once you know your budjet, you have to figure out how much each category gets spent on it.

Spending less on a rifle means a bigger initial ammo supply, or a better optic...

Most agree that having a lower cost but well made simple rifle... plus training and trigger time with proper practice, is better than a fancy rifle that sits in the safe.
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Old April 18, 2017, 03:35 PM   #29
ilmonster
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I would feel well protected by a Colt or BCM. I actually spent my money on a BCM a few years ago and couldn't be happier. Only have a few thousand rounds through it so far. Both it and Colt are "mil-spec" and adhere to the TDP. Pat Rogers who ran EAG Tactical (he recently passed away) has one BCM carbine with over 40K rounds through it and it still functions (google "Filthy 14"). Good luck!
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Old April 20, 2017, 11:41 PM   #30
CodeSection
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Disillusioned.....confused

I have been exchanging emails with BCM since they are not accepting phone calls. They have been helpful in answering my questions and educating.

However, their latest answer to my latest email questioning why there were various models of the same gun (BCM RECCE-16 KMR-A 750-790 vs BCM RECCE-16 KMR-A BFH GOVT 5.56 750-790) took me by surprise. Their response was...

"Placing one of our upper receiver groups onto one of our lower receiver groups is completely acceptable. This gives our dealers and distributors the ability to offer different complete rifle configurations that we do not currently ship out as complete rifles. They can order a complete upper receiver group configuration and use it in conjunction with a lower receiver group to offer as a complete weapon system to a customer that may not want to purchase the upper and lower individually."

So, is this a regular practice in the industry that a rifle ordered could be assembled by the dealer you ordered from or be assembled by the distributor and not from the company itself? It just doesn't sound right and maybe a little misleading for the consumer.

I realize there are other industries (beer, soda, ec.) that have distributions centers that "make" the end product. But rifles, really?

At this point, I am disillusioned or maybe I was just ignorant to the industry and their standards.

Can anyone confirm this is normal with all companies?

Last edited by CodeSection; April 20, 2017 at 11:48 PM.
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Old April 21, 2017, 12:40 AM   #31
marine6680
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BCM offers a very wide selection of barrel types, handguard types, charging handles, colors, and other bits and parts.

Offering a complete rifle model for every combination and upper they offer would get out of hand for their tracking and logistics, especially when they already offer the uppers and parts for sale piecemeal.

So they make a few dedicated models of complete rifles with the more popular features... Kind of like a car manufacturer... They make a certain model car, and have different basic trim levels and popular options, that cover most buyers wants/needs. If you want a special setup, you have the dealer order the exact set of options you want. "I want the premium radio, sunroof, and keyless entry... but I don't want the leather seats that come with the luxury and convenience package trim levels" Well special order it without...

A gun dealer can do the same thing with BCM... Order the uppers and lowers separate, and put them together when they arrive, and sell them as a complete rifle. As at that point, they are.

Its an easy way for local shops and distributors to get a wider variety of rifle styles on the shelf, without BCM having to track all the possible combinations and have them assembled in house ready to go.

At no point, is the gun shop or distributor assembling a rifle from scratch/piece parts.

All the shop is doing is putting an upper on a lower... Something you do every time you field strip an AR to clean it... Its basically zero effort.

Its the same thing an individual can do... Which is why many people like BCM, they have options... They can select the combination they want, order the appropriate upper, and a mating lower, and have a complete BCM rifle just how they want it, with no real effort in assembly.
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Old April 21, 2017, 02:36 AM   #32
CodeSection
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Thanks for a great explanation marine6680!

Well, I guess I have a lot to learn. For some reason, I thought BCM test fired every assembled rifle as well as check for a tight fit. I found that dealers and distributors do not test fire the rifles they assemble nor do they disclose they are assembling the rifle configuration that may be listed on their website or on GunBroker. Which by the sounds of it is no big deal....

Also, I found a video made a couple of years ago with Larry Vickers interviewing Paul Buffoni and at the 3:15 mark it shows the uppers being test fired. https://youtu.be/JPLRUZbK_6I

So I wonder if some of BCM vendors are better than others on trying to find a tight fit? Any recommendations on BCM vendor list?

http://bravocompanymfg.com/support/where_to_buy.php
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Old April 21, 2017, 06:34 AM   #33
turtlehead
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The Aero Precision rifle mentioned earlier solves this "problem" with a tensioning screw built into the lower.

If you are concerned about this you may wish to handle any rifle in person before buying.
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Old April 21, 2017, 08:01 AM   #34
marine6680
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BCM test fires every rifle and upper before it leaves the factory... they even test fire every stand alone BCG they sell as well.

This is why you are not likely to have a bad BCM get out in the wild.

A tight fit between receivers is desirable but ultimately not a big issue. If it bothers you if you order separate uppers and lowers and get a little play, there are simple ways of correcting the issue.
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