Kroger: New policy of no CCW 4/28/10

[twhidd]

Disappointing. In Georgia, Kroger's Atlanta division has been a corporate sponsor of GeorgiaCarry.org (our grass roots right-to-carry organization). I wonder if it has changed corporate wide.

[WARRIOR I]

But it sounds like most of them are on the right track, twhidd. Our local group (Grassroots Gunrights) has been very successful in persuading businesses who post to remove the signs, and I always contact them
immediately when I see one. (Personally, I'm just too p*****off to even speak to a manager when I see these signs.)

[Double Naught Spy]

This Ohioans for Concealed Carry contact was prompted by a ousting of a licensee at a Kroger's for printing. Printing isn't illegal in Ohio.

Still, they want no more OC and that pi***** me off. He wasn't OC'ING!

You still don't get it, do you? No printing is not illegal and open carry is legal, but that doesn't mean that Kroger wants to see people walking around with guns. It isn't an issue about whether or not it is against the law.

He wasn't OCing? No, he wasn't. He was printing so badly that the presence of his gun was discerned by people in the store. It may not have been open carry, but it sure the heck wasn't properly concealed.

As noted in the original thread, if you are going to carry concealed, then make sure the gun is concealed. If it isn't fully concealed, then folks will notice and if they notice, they may choose to act ... which is what Kroger has done.

[ohioleadslinger]

Double Naught there is no law regarding "Conceal Properly" in Ohio. Your saying that one must keep a gun concealed at all costs. That's simply absurd and right down Brady Lane.

Doesn't it seem a little odd they are saying its for one reason to everyone outside the Division yet everyone in the Division they are saying its all about the D liquor issue? Why do you suppose that is? Do you like being lied to by a business and do you like them purposefully misstating the law to justify it when hundreds of people keep showing them that the law isn't what they are saying.

They won't say its because of OC here as they know protests are sure to happen when you flout state law. No chance of that happening out side the Division because the policy doesn't affect them. If they maintain the "I'm sorry the law says we have to post because of our D8 license" in the Division then they can deny they are going against state law on OC knowing full well that D8 isn't a prohibition.

[ohioleadslinger]

Call backs are happening from Kroger top brass to OFCC. Keep up the pressure folks. Perhaps we can get this resolved soon. Until then keep calling and keep emailing.
Following from OFCC coordinator from OFCC forums:

Originally Posted by NavyChief UPDATE!

OK, I'll be honest, that was simply to grab your attention and offer up a plea - don't let up. I can't go into detail, but I'm hoping that by sometime Monday I can offer up a definitive "Yea" or "Nay" on this situation. I have been able to talk to a few people in K's HQ that are generally sympathetic to us (whose names shall forever be protected by me), and just missed a callback (what can I say? ...even NavyChief has to do something to keep food on the table...) from someone that may have the power to make this whole situation go away - I'm off Monday, so even if I have to wait for a callback, no biggie.

In the meantime, let's take Admiral David Farragut's most famous quote to heart...

[johnwilliamson062]

What is everyone's thinking here? Should we all boycott them because they are wrong in 1 state? Or should we be loyal to the ones that allow us to carry?

These are franchises that probably cross state lines. What am i supposed to do, look up every stores franchise then contact that franchises office for their carry policy? I don't think so. I will just assume they are all part of the banning franchises.
It seems, and I don't have a reliable source for this, but the rumor mill produces:

A guy was in kroger with a young child. Picked up young child and was holding them in one arm. young child pulled on the shoulder of the fathers shirt and untucked the shirt at the waste. Someone saw a pistol. It was NOT OC and it was not printing before the child pulled on his shirt.

To state again, the child pulled on the shirt around the shoulder and was nowhere close to the gun. At least that is what the rumor mill says.

[Stiofan]

Kroger is one of the largest corporations in the US. They operate over 2,400 grocery stores, 750 convenience stores and 370 jewelry stores. They are not franchises, they are all corporate owned. Their headquarters are in Ohio.

http://www.thekrogerco.com/

[ohioleadslinger]

Corporate has taken notice and the calls an emails have started a dialog so it is working. Keep it up.

Kroger has Divisions a while they say its a Division thing they have been giving two very different reasons for the policy depending on where the compliant originates. That tells me its a run around if not a flat out lie. They are giving each reason based on their idea of what will quell the complaint at that local.

Do you like being lied to? I don't and no one else should.

[hogdogs]

I think I need to contact the Fl. panhandle owned outfit, "Tom Thumb" as I noticed any "private label" generic type goods are from the Kroger bunch...

Will call corporate Monday and ask that they contact Kroger and ask of this issue before i start slingin' mud and stirring the pot locally.

Brent

[Javelin Man]

Keep up the pressure, guy! We appreciate all the help you have given us in the Buckeye State. Remember, if it goes through here, it may extend to your part of the world.

[gyvel]

For all of you fellow Arizonans, Kroger owns Fry's.

[ohioleadslinger]

Call and complain no matter where you are.

[maestro pistolero]

For all of you fellow Arizonans, Kroger owns Fry's.

Good to know.

[johnwilliamson062]

Worked the BFA booth at the OGCA gun show in Wilmington over the weekend and told almost everybody I talked to about it. Asked them to contact Kroger and let them know they weren't happy.

[ohioleadslinger]

I was working OFCC table right across from ya on Sunday.

[TXGunNut]

Good luck, would be an empty threat on my part. I don't shop @ my local Krogers. If I did, I'd applaud their local policy, not give them grief over the actions of another region.

[rjrivero]

I sent them an email. I got this reply today:

Originally Posted by [email protected]

Thank you for taking the time to share your concerns with our Conceal Carry policy. Please know that our company follows state laws regarding this issue and policies may vary depending on the laws of the state in which you reside. For customers shopping in our Columbus Division stores, the policy is as follows:



· Employees are not allowed to carry weapons while on duty, with the exception of armed security and Police officers.

· We do not post ‘no weapons’ signs.



I hope this information is helpful to you and I appreciate the opportunity to clarify the policy for you. Should you have any additional comments or questions, please let me know.

I sent a follow up question:

Originally Posted by rjrivero

Ms. Blanton,

Thank you for the time of your reply. I am not sure if you are aware, but Ohio is an OPEN CARRY state as well. It is NOT against the law for a citizen to carry a handgun properly holstered and uncovered.

Is there a policy on OPEN carry in your stores?

Thank you in advance.

I will keep you up to date on any further communication.

[maestro pistolero]

Please know that our company follows state laws regarding this issue and policies may vary depending on the laws of the state in which you reside.

Wow. Starbucks may have set a nice precedent. Now if they will just actually follow that policy.

[johnwilliamson062]

I was working OFCC table right across from ya on Sunday.

THe guy you were working with knew one of the guys at our table and walked over to talk to him. He told us you were PGWP. I was going to walk over and have a chat, but next thing I knew your table was all packed up and you guys were long gone

I received the same reply as others indicating they can't allow CCW in places with D licenses and that they can't allow OC at all without really specifying if that is due to state law or just their policy.

I pretty much copy and pasted someone else's reply including the excerpt of the law and sent it to them.

[maestro pistolero]

Same thing in my mailbox today:
Dear Mr. ********:

Thank you for taking the time to share your concerns with our Conceal Carry policy. Please know that our company follows state laws regarding this issue and policies may vary depending on the laws of the state in which you reside. I have shared your comments with the Regional Office for further review. Again, thank you for contacting us.



Sincerely,



Amber Sublett
Consumer Affairs

[ohioleadslinger]

THe guy you were working with knew one of the guys at our table and walked over to talk to him. He told us you were PGWP. I was going to walk over and have a chat, but next thing I knew your table was all packed up and you guys were long gone

We cut out if there. Didn't raise a dime for the cause or sign any new memberships up. What a dead show to work. Its a great show for collecting but for working it blows. We may not hit that one gain. Its just too hard being in the lobby and getting anyone to stop and listen.

I did Join OGCA though. God I was in old S&W wheelgun heaven!

I did tell everyone that stopped an talked about Kroger.

[ncpatriot]

I now have the same e mail reply from Diane Blanton, minus the local references of course. I also spoke to an assistant mgr at our store. He, like the pharmacist, said he did his best to stay in the loop on issues from corporate HQ and around their networks. He had not heard of the OH situation. He said 1 person had OC'd recently here and a lot of customers complained. They asked him to leave and he did so, politely. He personally didn't have an issue with OC or CCW. I told him if Kroger posted signs, it is an invitation to robbery. He agreed 100%. Anyway, sounds like HQ is keeping other regions uninformed. Seems that would be hot news on their grapevine otherwise. I told the asst mgr we spend a lot there and may have to take it elsewhere if Kroger didn't do right by people.

So, you Ohio guys; is OC that common in your state? Can you safely walk the street without being stopped/questioned? I prefer CC but think either should be legal. OC requires greater care to ensure firearm not being snatched, people should carefully deal with that.

[LordTio3]

I wrote to Kroger myself and have not received a response in over 2 days now. I made sure to inform them of the local laws and provide sound reasoning as to why this is both an unsafe practice and a poor business move on their part.

Thank you to everyone who has contributed to the pressure so far. Let's keep it up. If you're a CCW supporter and haven't thrown in yet, just a quick 30 second message about you disagreeing with the policy will help wonders.

Keep up the fight. If we get them to realize that they've ousted themselves on this one, Kroger might recant, wise up, and become the next Starbucks. Somebody's got to do it eventually.

~LT

[ncpatriot]

Mine was about 4 days getting a reply. They are not very responsive. Local mgrs here have still not heard of the situation or will not talk about it if they have.

[ncpatriot]

I received another e mail, similar to 1st. This one was from Nicole Belcamino. I thanked her and advised that my family spent $257 at Kroger from 5-15 to 5-27, yesterday. Advised further of 1 of our expensive pharmacy meds we get from them first of each month.

Try that with future contacts with Kroger. I'm sure our business would not bankrupt them to lose, but we could still impact the bottom line, stock prices, etc. Corporations do not seek to lose business but to gain it. If each of us reminds them what we spend, someone in HQ is likely keeping a tally.

May not help, couldn't hurt.

I also reminded her that gunowners are among the most law abiding customers they have and that they have nothing to fear from us.

In one of my previous conversations with a local member of management, I said that Kroger would be inviting robberies if they posted against carry. He agreed, off the record, that thugs would be reassured that they had the only guns in the building.

While many of us, often wisely, keep quiet about carrying, sometimes it is wise to tactfully disclose to people in charge. They may be surprised, "I didn't know someone like him carried guns. He's a nice guy and good customer". "I'm surprised he carries a gun. I saw him help an elderly couple with their bags in the parking lot." And so on....