HK-UMP in 45 ACP

**4V50 Gary** · October 7, 2000, 04:37 PM

This past week gave me an opportunity to try the new HK UMP smg in 45 ACP. Unlike its predecessor, the MP5, the UMP`s frame is polymer in construction. The UMP is also blowback operated and much simplier than the MP5. While it is available in 9mm, the 9mm version is not being imported into this country as HK does not want it to compete against the already popular MP5.

Being polymer, the UMP enjoys an advantage in weight saving which allows the user either to carry more equipment/ammo or to travel lighter. The bolt carrier is tungsten filled - something I suspect was done to delay unlocking. Empty, the UMP weighs less than 5 lbs. Simple adjustment to a spring in the trigger group allows the user to select either a bolt hold open or have the bolt remain closed after the last shot. Controls for cocking is on the top and the cocking lever swivels to either side - making it easy for a left handed user. The safety is also ambidextrious.

Taking a cue from the magazine of the Sig Sauer assault rifle, the magazines of the UMP clip together. I found them to be awkward to use and prefer to keep the spares in a pocket or in a carrier unit. The magazines are clear plastic and allows the user to see how many rounds are remaining from the original twentyfive.

Basic sights were iron with a choice of peep or large "U" for the shooter to choose from. The UMP allows for the mounting of other types of sights (optical, red dot, laser, holographic).

A nice feature of the UMP is that it allows the user to adapt it for left handed usage. Extra holes in the folding stock have been purposefully place there for just this purpose. You can arrange the sling for prone shooting.

During the short four hour introductory course taught by the staff of the HK Academy, we were drilled in reloading drills, communication and shooting drills, movement drills - much of which was done through the use of burst fire. In the full auto mode, we found the UMP to be very controllable and it sacrifices nothing in the way of accuracy from the MP-5.

It was quite a bold step for HK to make a new SMG in light of the popularity of their MP-5. SMG fans will not be disappointed.

Badger Arms · October 9, 2000, 02:42 AM

Just wondering if the gun felt in any way bulky or awkward to use. It looks somewhat larger than the MP-5. Also, how 'solid' did the stock feel when locked open, when locked closed, and when shouldered?

Heck, I'm chuck full of questions. Did the method for securing the stock in the folded position seem awkward? Do you think this mechanism will wear too quickly? What was your impression of burst and full-auto fire? Were there any things you'd like chagned? Did your gun have a fore-grip on it?

**4V50 Gary** · October 9, 2000, 08:12 AM

Heckler & Koch did their research and testing as the folding stock did not wobble at all when extended. During firing, one did not even realize that it was a folder and it was comfortable to use both right handed and left handed. Sorry but I didn`t try hip shooting with it with the stock closed. That method isn`t taught or practiced today by police since we`re suppose to use aimed fire. In the closed state though, I don`t recall that the stock wobbled and thanks to the openings of the stock, the gun isn`t disabled and it will still shoot. Admittingly, I could have tried the sternum position with a closed stock.

Regarding the size, it is larger than the MP-5 but it is also much lighter. Personally, I dislike the practice of attaching the magazines together (ala Sig 550) as it makes holding (and pulling down & into your body) the foreend. Once the spare magazine was detached, it felt fine.

Glen · October 9, 2000, 08:30 AM

My PD has a few of these UMP's in .45 ACP. They are extremely reliable and controllable. They don't feel bulky to me, although they look it a bit. The polymer constructtion keeps the weight down. The stock is rigid and sturdy when unfolded. Ours do not have the forward grip.

We liked ours so much, we ordered more in .40 SW, since our duty pistols are chambered in that caliber. The .45's were all that was available at first.

Burst fire with these is unique because they are two-round bursts. Very controllable and precise. The weapons are also capable of sustained fire. There are a variety of trigger groups available, depending on what your needs are.

My favorite feature about the UMP is it's simplicity. As one of the dept armorers. I'm in love with it. Unlike the MP5, the barrel is replacable. Drive out the pin that holds the barrel in and replace it! With the MP, it has to go back to HK due to the installation process (welding). Obviously, we don't go through that many barrels, however, it is a convenience when the barrel needs changed.

They are also cost effective. We paid $833ea for our last order, as opposed to $1300 for an MP5 with retractable stock.

The only complaint I have with HK is the wait. We placed an order in March and are still waiting. To top it off, you can't get the time of day from anyone at HK on the phone. They know they have a great product that everyone wants, so customer service goes out the window.

October 7, 2000, 04:37 PM	#1
4V50 Gary Staff Join Date: November 2, 1998 Location: Colorado Posts: 21,832	This past week gave me an opportunity to try the new HK UMP smg in 45 ACP. Unlike its predecessor, the MP5, the UMP`s frame is polymer in construction. The UMP is also blowback operated and much simplier than the MP5. While it is available in 9mm, the 9mm version is not being imported into this country as HK does not want it to compete against the already popular MP5. Being polymer, the UMP enjoys an advantage in weight saving which allows the user either to carry more equipment/ammo or to travel lighter. The bolt carrier is tungsten filled - something I suspect was done to delay unlocking. Empty, the UMP weighs less than 5 lbs. Simple adjustment to a spring in the trigger group allows the user to select either a bolt hold open or have the bolt remain closed after the last shot. Controls for cocking is on the top and the cocking lever swivels to either side - making it easy for a left handed user. The safety is also ambidextrious. Taking a cue from the magazine of the Sig Sauer assault rifle, the magazines of the UMP clip together. I found them to be awkward to use and prefer to keep the spares in a pocket or in a carrier unit. The magazines are clear plastic and allows the user to see how many rounds are remaining from the original twentyfive. Basic sights were iron with a choice of peep or large "U" for the shooter to choose from. The UMP allows for the mounting of other types of sights (optical, red dot, laser, holographic). A nice feature of the UMP is that it allows the user to adapt it for left handed usage. Extra holes in the folding stock have been purposefully place there for just this purpose. You can arrange the sling for prone shooting. During the short four hour introductory course taught by the staff of the HK Academy, we were drilled in reloading drills, communication and shooting drills, movement drills - much of which was done through the use of burst fire. In the full auto mode, we found the UMP to be very controllable and it sacrifices nothing in the way of accuracy from the MP-5. It was quite a bold step for HK to make a new SMG in light of the popularity of their MP-5. SMG fans will not be disappointed.

October 9, 2000, 02:42 AM	#2
Badger Arms Senior Member Join Date: July 2, 2000 Location: Harnett County, NC Posts: 1,700	Just wondering if the gun felt in any way bulky or awkward to use. It looks somewhat larger than the MP-5. Also, how 'solid' did the stock feel when locked open, when locked closed, and when shouldered? Heck, I'm chuck full of questions. Did the method for securing the stock in the folded position seem awkward? Do you think this mechanism will wear too quickly? What was your impression of burst and full-auto fire? Were there any things you'd like chagned? Did your gun have a fore-grip on it?

October 9, 2000, 08:12 AM	#3
4V50 Gary Staff Join Date: November 2, 1998 Location: Colorado Posts: 21,832	Heckler & Koch did their research and testing as the folding stock did not wobble at all when extended. During firing, one did not even realize that it was a folder and it was comfortable to use both right handed and left handed. Sorry but I didn`t try hip shooting with it with the stock closed. That method isn`t taught or practiced today by police since we`re suppose to use aimed fire. In the closed state though, I don`t recall that the stock wobbled and thanks to the openings of the stock, the gun isn`t disabled and it will still shoot. Admittingly, I could have tried the sternum position with a closed stock. Regarding the size, it is larger than the MP-5 but it is also much lighter. Personally, I dislike the practice of attaching the magazines together (ala Sig 550) as it makes holding (and pulling down & into your body) the foreend. Once the spare magazine was detached, it felt fine.

October 9, 2000, 08:30 AM	#4
Glen Junior Member Join Date: June 10, 1999 Posts: 12	My PD has a few of these UMP's in .45 ACP. They are extremely reliable and controllable. They don't feel bulky to me, although they look it a bit. The polymer constructtion keeps the weight down. The stock is rigid and sturdy when unfolded. Ours do not have the forward grip. We liked ours so much, we ordered more in .40 SW, since our duty pistols are chambered in that caliber. The .45's were all that was available at first. Burst fire with these is unique because they are two-round bursts. Very controllable and precise. The weapons are also capable of sustained fire. There are a variety of trigger groups available, depending on what your needs are. My favorite feature about the UMP is it's simplicity. As one of the dept armorers. I'm in love with it. Unlike the MP5, the barrel is replacable. Drive out the pin that holds the barrel in and replace it! With the MP, it has to go back to HK due to the installation process (welding). Obviously, we don't go through that many barrels, however, it is a convenience when the barrel needs changed. They are also cost effective. We paid $833ea for our last order, as opposed to $1300 for an MP5 with retractable stock. The only complaint I have with HK is the wait. We placed an order in March and are still waiting. To top it off, you can't get the time of day from anyone at HK on the phone. They know they have a great product that everyone wants, so customer service goes out the window.