Carrying a Sig P938 cocked and safety OFF?

[USNRet93]

Originally Posted by Walt Sherrill

Slip ups happen. Carrying a small, single-action gun with the safety off is a serious problem waiting to happen. You cited one concern. The other side of that same coin is that if you might also "slip up" and pull the trigger while drawing the weapon. If so, that means you can 1) shoot yourself, or 2) shoot something [or someone] other than your intended target.

If that happens, you've done nothing to protect yourself and may have gotten yourself into a much bigger pile of hurt.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p3kJ6SU3ycs

[Josh17]

Originally Posted by dontcatchmany

I used to have a Sig P938. Really enjoyed the gun until it started having problems dropping magazines and the safety came out. Never could trust the repaired gun after that.

However....

I pocket carry and prior to carrying the 938 loaded, I carried it unloaded. On a lark I carried it cocked and unlocked in a pocket holster just to see how that would work. There were several times that when the gun came out of a pocket with only the gun in it, that the hammer was down. Needless to say that when I carried it loaded "for real", it was always cocked and Locked. Even with that, I was always not very comfortable carrying it cocked and locked.

LOL...now I carry striker fired Shields with no safety.

The safety came off as in fell off? I assume it became useless after that since it couldn’t fire?

That was the main reason I don’t like the safety: it’s extra parts that can all break. The extra step isn’t that big of a deal I suppose with training.

If I do choose the 938 i’ll Learn to practice with the safety.

[hornetguy]

I would never carry a SA pistol with the chamber loaded and the safety off. In my opinion, that is the height of foolishness. It is not just you who would be in danger. Anyone near you would be in danger in the event of a negligent discharge. That is highly irresponsible.

It is simply no problem to wipe the safety off when drawing.

If you find that onerous, then you should carry a DAO pistol.... for your safety, and for the safety of anyone near you.

[JJNA]

Funny enough, this is how S&W M&P 380-EZ (the non-manual safety version) is supposed to be carried - the hidden SAO hammer cocked. Though that gun does have a grip safety.

[Ibmikey]

The S&W ez is not going to fire unless the grip safety is pushed forward and held tightly in that position as the trigger is pulled rearward through it’s free travel. Mine does not have a manual safety other than the grip and has an internal hammer, I am quite safe carrying it with a round in the chamber unlike I would be carrying the 938 with the manual safety off.

[TomNJVA]

I'm having a hard time understanding the danger from carrying an SA pistol chambered without a manual safety. I carry my LCP II in this condition all the time without fear. The gun is safe when in the holster, and it never leaves the holster unless I intend to shoot it. Even then, I never touch the trigger until ready to fire, a basic safety rule. I can understand the concern if one tends to shove it into pockets without a holster or play with it outside the holster, but if carried with care in the holster what's the issue?

To me there is a safety issue carrying a defensive handgun that is not ready to immediately defend, no matter how much you have trained under non-stressful conditions. But so many here have strong feelings about carrying this way that I have to wonder if I am missing something.

[Walt Sherrill]

Originally Posted by TomNJVA

I'm having a hard time understanding the danger from carrying an SA pistol chambered without a manual safety. I carry my LCP II in this condition all the time without fear. The gun is safe when in the holster, and it never leaves the holster unless I intend to shoot it. Even then, I never touch the trigger until ready to fire, a basic safety rule...

Ruger advertises the gun as having a "single-action feel," but I don't think it's really a single-action design. I think it's what's called a modified double-action (or modified single action) in that slide action, when chambering a round, partially tensions the hammer spring. It still has a lighter trigger pull than many of the other small guns.

While not all SA guns have light triggers many do, and I think that a light trigger was the concern being addressed with responses, here. And most SA guns triggers break a bit more easily than guns like the LCP and LCPII or the KelTec P3AT. A somewhat heavier trigger pull is part of their design -- offsetting the need for a safety lever a bit.

I've pocket carried several small guns without problems, but all of them were carried in a pocket holster which had a small thumb rest on the side that allowed me to press down on the holster as I unholstered the gun. That meant there was never an issue getting the gun out of the holster or leaving the holster in the pocket.

If nothing else, the holster keeps things away from the trigger if you ever forget and drop things in your pocket without remembering that the gun is in there.

[CDW4ME]

The possibilities if carried safety off AIWB about 12:30 with a clip-draw.

[HighValleyRanch]

I'm having a hard time understanding the danger from carrying an SA pistol chambered without a manual safety.

Would you feel comfortable carrying a revolver with the hammer cocked back in your pocket?

[Ibmikey]

High valley ranch, Nicely put, kind of sums up what the majority have suggested. If the advice is not heeded I suggest the carrier get extra medical insurance to cover from the waist down....

[TomNJVA]

Quote: Would you feel comfortable carrying a revolver with the hammer cocked back in your pocket?

Yes if both the trigger and hammer are completely covered and protected by a holster. The LCP II has an internal hammer so when in a holster both the trigger and hammer are are completely covered and protected.

[davidsog]

The possibilities if carried safety off AIWB about 12:30 with a clip-draw.

Life is tough....It's tougher when you are stupid.

[WyMark]

Life is tough....It's tougher when you are stupid.

On the plus side.......the gene pool gets a little bit cleaner.

[5whiskey]

I really dont know what to say. No way I would ever, ever think about carrying a revolver cocked. Even in the holster. Even if it's in the holster, if you're ever in a SD scenario you must draw it. Sympathetic reflex is real. My daughter experienced it first hand at the range the last time we went. Fire and movement, she stuttered stepped and we heard bang before a target was called. It scared her, but she was pointing the weapon in a safe direction.

She had her finger resting on the frame. I was videoing so I replayed it. Sure enough, her little stumble caused her to stutter step, regain balance,and she squeezed the gun tighter to prevent dropping it. She pulled the trigger when she did. It scared her, and she declared herself done at point. I agreed, but gave some praise that she was pointing it in a safe direction. We were doing side movement drills, and the ND happened between targets on a multiple target string. She was using a da/sa pistol. Training now includes decock after active threat is down.

Long story short, a true SA pistol should be kept safety on or decocked. No other safe way.

[sirgilligan]

Originally Posted by Josh17

So I wondered: what is dangerous or bad about carrying it cocked with safety off?

Interaction with a firearm reveals the dangers associated with firearms.

A firearm with a hair trigger and ready to fire is perfectly harmless lying in the middle of nowhere with nothing to interact with it.

So, how do you interact with a pistol?


you pick them up
you load them with ammo
you put them in your pocket or holster or out from under the seat...
you take them out of your pocket or holster...
you point them at things
you put your finger on the trigger
you pull the trigger

I think you all can make a big long list of how a firearm is interacted with intentionally. Now make the list of unintentional.

So, in any of your scenarios would it be better to have the safety on on the Sig?

Is it "bad". Nope, it is neither good nor bad.

:-)

[Josh17]

So with the Sig if the hammer gets snagged and falls forward by accident (without pulling the trigger) would it go bang if safety is off?
Or does it have safeties in place to prevent that, and the only way for it to fire is if the trigger is pulled & Safety off?

I know many people carry a Glock with a 3.5 lb trigger pull which besides the hammer getting stuck seems more dangerous?

Personally I like simple point and shoot. Glocks, revolvers. But the Sig is a quality gun and I like Sig. I just am trying to decide if I can get used to a whole “new system”. I also like hammer fired guns. IMO more reliable. Plus second strike capability is a big plus, IMO. I assume this Sig has it?
As one time when I put my Ruger LCR & Glock 26 through “4+ years of no maintenance/etc” just sat locked up in the trunk? The only issue was a light strike (2) which both went off on second try.

[5whiskey]

OP if you like the idea of hammer fired and a simple manual of arms, get a da/sa or a dao sig. Or cz or beretta. Carrying a sao with safety off is ill advised. Don't believe me? Go find any, I mean any, firearms instructor with a credible reputation and he will tell you the same thing.

The hammer snagging or drop firing is not the issue. I can think of no way the hammer snag would cause it to fall. Even if it did, there is a firing pin block. It's the trigger that.is the problem. There is a difference in break and length of pull between a glock trigger and a SA trigger, even if they are the same weight pull. I personally believe Glock triggers tuned to sub 4 lbs are not suitable for carry, but they're a far cry better than a 4.5 lb crisp SA trigger.

[labhound]

My wife has a Sig 938 and it's SA only. No second strike capability. Much lighter trigger than my three Glock 19's with a 3.5 connector. It is absolutely not safe to carry a Sig 938 cocked and not have the safety on.

[sirgilligan]

Originally Posted by Josh17

So with the Sig if the hammer gets snagged and falls forward by accident (without pulling the trigger) would it go bang if safety is off?
Or does it have safeties in place to prevent that, and the only way for it to fire is if the trigger is pulled & Safety off?

I know many people carry a Glock with a 3.5 lb trigger pull which besides the hammer getting stuck seems more dangerous?

Personally I like simple point and shoot. Glocks, revolvers. But the Sig is a quality gun and I like Sig. I just am trying to decide if I can get used to a whole “new system”. I also like hammer fired guns. IMO more reliable. Plus second strike capability is a big plus, IMO. I assume this Sig has it?
As one time when I put my Ruger LCR & Glock 26 through “4+ years of no maintenance/etc” just sat locked up in the trunk? The only issue was a light strike (2) which both went off on second try.

Hammer snag - That is not something I have ever heard of happening to a Sig.
Sig 938 has a firing pin block. Just google that.
The saying "Glock Leg" comes to mind.
Single Action Only pistols require you to cock the hammer again for second strike. Double Action pistols allow you to pull the trigger to cock and release the hammer a second time.

I don't want to start a discussion on how to carry a semi-auto handgun, but I carry mine in the following manner (known as the condition of the firearm):
Magazine Loaded and fully seated in firearm.
Chamber empty.
Safety Off.

That way I don't have to remember, is this my Browning High Power, or my CZ 75, or maybe my 1911-22 Browning, or the S&W 659, or the Walther PPK/S...

Some have safeties that go up, some that go down, some are single action only and some are double action.

[Bill DeShivs]

Carrying guns with the chamber empty might make you feel safe, but it can get you killed if you need the gun.
Carry the same gun, learn it like your tongue knows your teeth, learn to shoot it.