Do Dinosaurs still roam the earth? - Page 4

**44 AMP** · April 29, 2015, 11:07 AM

Quote:

I'm still trying to get in on 44's family tree somehow...

Before the post about you and the MRS, I was going to tell you that my daughter is recently divorced.....

adoption might be an option....

Magnum Wheel Man · April 29, 2015, 11:09 AM

There you go BONGO...

44... would that work out for you as well as for me if I was a single guy

or would that be too freaky if your SIL had the exact same interests ???

Quote:

"Honey, can you ask your dad if I could have my Automag 5 back for the weekend"

Bongo Boy · April 29, 2015, 11:16 AM

My dad was a machinist and when he retired he built scale cannons--lots of them, and all museum quality (but all shootable). For most of them, he went around the country and measured original pieces that he found, and when his interest shifted to naval guns, he wrote the British War Museum and was able to get drawings from them. Most of the guns he built were on the order of 1/6 to 1/4 scale, and remarkable. While I have a few of the mortars, everything else disappeared--mostly sold or given away because I had no practical way of getting them from Michigan to Colorado. You couldn't just get two guys and pick them up and put 'em in the truck.

A real shame. Not semi-automatics, so off-topic. But losing that collection was totally my fault, really.

Magnum Wheel Man · April 29, 2015, 11:21 AM

got a 1/4 mile long driveway, & always wanted a pair of field cannons one on each side of the drive, up by the house... real ones or working replicas are the only thing I'd consider, & they cost way too much for lawn ornaments... & I just couldn't make myself do a pair of the concrete ones...

if I won't keep an antique gun if it's not shootable... I just couldn't live with myself & a pair of concrete cannons

Bongo Boy · April 29, 2015, 01:08 PM

Understand. Most if not all of the guns he built were turned from solid billets of 4140 'Stressproof'. You couldn't blow them up with black powder no matter what load you put in them--and god knows we tried a few times with the smaller ones. I reckon the walls at the chamber area of the Columbiad he build were probably 2" thick--4140 steel now, not cast iron. I'd like to know who got that gun.

At the home where I grew up and for most of my life there, we had a 3" bore 'Lyle Gun' (I think that's right) mounted in the yard. This was a deck gun intended for firing a line from one ship to another for...well, anytime you needed to do that. We lived directly across the road from a skeet and trap club, and during the big tournaments often folks would stop in and want to know all about this little cannon in the yard. Eventually it was brought inside and restored, as dad figured it would likely go missing what with all those 'big city Detroit people' snooping around. This would be in the late 60s.

Very nice story on NAA, reticle. I know I read your briefer version somewhere else recently, but this added a lot. I truly enjoy these historical stories about the 'pioneer days'. Maybe it's just me but it seems like there was a period in the 50s and 60s when individuals played bigger roles. Maybe not..but it seems the magazines were thicker, the personalities (and egos) bigger and the developments a little more exciting. Could be it's just that the latest polymer 9 just doesn't get my attention.

reticle · April 29, 2015, 11:13 PM

I think you are right, Bongo. Now everything seems corporatized. Every design has to fit a certain model of success. Fewer departures from the norm. American automobile manufacturers did the same thing in the 70's. Vehicles used to be dramatically different between brands. Body styles were more exciting and bold. Now? Well it's all fairly bland. Only the supercars are unique. Seems the firearms industry has been on a plateau.

Hunter0924 · April 29, 2015, 11:45 PM

The new 2015 all stainless Desert Eagle I reviewed after SHOT. I liked it so good I decided to hang onto the test sample.
Is it practical? Maybe, depending on your needs but I can see how it would work great for defense in bear country.

**Mike Irwin** · April 30, 2015, 06:26 AM

Sure we do. We're called revolver shooters...

Bongo Boy · April 30, 2015, 11:42 AM

Quote:

The new 2015 all stainless Desert Eagle I reviewed after SHOT.

Probably was your review I saw on YouTube, then--I'd asked if was available or planned in 44 Mag. Now, of course, it would be 45 Win Mag I'd like to have it in. I very much like the idea of them offering it in stainless, but honestly, 50AE is out of my range in terms of being able to feed it. The round is fun to shoot in that gun, but someone else would have to be paying.

Did anyone from Magnum Research make any comments about the rail? I suppose they thought "Well, it looks cool, everybody likes rails all over everything, and a light would be handy for camp or home defense." It really gums-up the appearance of the gun, to me, but hats off for these guys making a go of it and for the long haul. They've done a nice job.

Hunter0924 · April 30, 2015, 08:58 PM

They do offer it in .44 Magnum as well as a conversion kit for the 50 AE, which is really just a barrel and a couple of magazines.

I do get the rail takes away from the sleek look but it does add a bit of function to the gun as a trail/hiking gun.

**44 AMP** · May 1, 2015, 01:36 AM

I do like the ported muzzle. It would probably tame the .44 a bit too. In .357 it might even eliminate the small muzzle rise the DE has in that caliber. That would be something.

Don't care for the belly rail at all. I prefer certain spots to be smooth.

It doesn't add any function for me, but then I'm not one of the folks who bolts lights, lasers, or drop tanks under my pistols. And I can't help but think of all those nice edges to catch on things.

Any chance it comes with a rail cover?

Bongo Boy · May 1, 2015, 01:16 PM

Quote:

Any chance it comes with a rail cover?

Ah, see? You're already accessorizing.

**44 AMP** · May 1, 2015, 06:09 PM

Accessorizing? no, just looking to see if I can avoid a gun with a built on cheese grater or sawblade..

AKhog · May 3, 2015, 10:00 PM

Another gun/round combo that can be included in this thread is the 460 Rowland in your pick of different guns. Shooting it in my XD-45/460 it is almost to the level of my Grizzly. Definitely 44 mag level.

nstoolman1 · May 3, 2015, 11:03 PM

I love my new old dinosaur.

Very smooth and more accurate than I am.

Bongo Boy · May 4, 2015, 07:36 PM

Quote:

Accessorizing? no, just looking to see if I can avoid a gun with a built on cheese grater or sawblade..

My Sig P220 Elite Stainless...after removal of the cheese grater and trigger guard finger hook:

..and I really hate finger hooks:

Did it all with a die grinder and lot of tiny little files. That's commitment to a smooth underside.

The first few cuts are the scariest...

Japle · May 4, 2015, 08:18 PM

Before I lost my mind and sold it, I had a .357 Automag with an 8 1/2" polished barrel. It was amazingly accurate. My deer load was a Sierra 150gr JHC at 1855 fps. For jackrabbits and coyotes, I used the Sierra 90 gr 9mm JHC over a compressed load of 33.0 gr of WW296. It chronographed consistently at 2496 fps. That load would kill a coyote in his tracks and turn a jackrabbit into a thin pink cloud.

The muzzle flash was impressive. The only light in this pic is from the flash.

I had a custom scope mount made from T6 aluminum and mounted a 1.7X Hudson Handgunner scope.

orionengnr · May 4, 2015, 08:38 PM

Dang, when I lived in IL (15 years ago) I was at a small local gun show and should have bought the .357 Auto Mag for $750. Kicking myself ever since.

I've been looking at Coonans for about two years now. If they'd make a .41 Auto...

**44 AMP** · May 5, 2015, 03:03 AM

I would kick you too. $750 for an Auto Mag 15 years ago was less than half the going rate at that time.

The first Auto Mag I saw "in person" was one of the long barrel .357s. The price was $395. Doesn't sound like a lot today, but at the time, it was. MSRP of the S&W M29 .44mag was $283.50.

I watched that one sit on the dealer's shelf, for nearly 3 years, and saw the price go up to $695. Went into the Army. When I got back, the gun was gone, of course.

Saw two of them in a Payless in 76. Standard 6.5" ribbed guns, .357 & .44. $795 & $895. Next one I saw was in 80. Standard .44AMP, $995.

Then Sudden Impact came out. The price jumped to $1500. (83)

I got a loan, when I found this one..

also came with a bit more than this..

A couple more boxes of ammo, and several boxes of fired brass.

Nice action shot of the .357, Japle! Interesting scope mount, too. Mounted to the grips? or the frame?

I've seen where several people scoped Auto Mags, mounting them to the barrel extension. This is apparently a scope killer. Seems that while they live through the recoil, the sudden stop in the opposite direction when the gun returns to battery is too much. Or so I've heard, back in the day...

ezmiraldo · May 6, 2015, 06:20 PM

These are some awesome guns, guys! Makes me wanna get that S&W 500!

reticle · May 6, 2015, 10:13 PM

Found more pics of my Grizzly

Bongo Boy · May 7, 2015, 04:28 PM

Very nice. I love that finish on these. It looks like you have a conventional steel backstrap/mainspring housing whatever it's called. Mine has a rubber insert in it--which is okay I guess. Is your lovely Grizzly all-factory or did you make some changes?

There was a specimen on gunbroker that was in somewhat rough condition but perfectly fixable, and I was giving serious though to going for it and having it hard chromed. Couldn't make up my mind before it got away--it was going for a relatively low price.

reticle · May 7, 2015, 07:18 PM

Bongo, the back strap or mainspring housing is part of the Smith and Alexander mag well. I kept the original rubber covered MSH too in case I ever sell and the buyer wants it back to original. Everything else is as it came from LAR. I toyed with the idea of updating to a beaver tail grip safety and skeletonized hammer, but I decided not to modify the frame and the hammer because it might affect the sear release negatively. I could install the new parts and have then tuned, but it seemed to me all of that would yield diminishing returns in value and performance. The fact is, the factory action is every bit as tuned as my Colt Delta Gold Cup. The factory trigger shoe even has an over travel set screw like my Gold Cup.

Believe it or not, I picked this gun up for 600.00 back in 97 (I think that was the year)

Bongo Boy · May 7, 2015, 07:27 PM

Well, there's a two-tone in mint condx at gb right now with a buy it now of $1,595...and I'd greatly prefer one-tone to two-tone. I have yet to see an all-chrome for auction.

As for the stock trigger, I'm perfectly happy with mine although it's a tad heavy. I don't believe I'm at the point where any aspect of the gun is holding back my grouping though.

reticle · May 7, 2015, 08:14 PM

I've seen all hard chromed Grizzlies on gunbroker before. There are not as many as there are parkerized and two tone pistols so they are not posted as often. IIRC the last all hard chromed Grizzly that sold on GB went for 1800-ish.

Regardless of finish, these pistols are beasts and can generate a toothy grin on the face of even the most grumpy shooter.

April 29, 2015, 11:16 AM	#78
Bongo Boy Senior Member Join Date: December 18, 2008 Location: Colo Spgs CO Posts: 517	My dad was a machinist and when he retired he built scale cannons--lots of them, and all museum quality (but all shootable). For most of them, he went around the country and measured original pieces that he found, and when his interest shifted to naval guns, he wrote the British War Museum and was able to get drawings from them. Most of the guns he built were on the order of 1/6 to 1/4 scale, and remarkable. While I have a few of the mortars, everything else disappeared--mostly sold or given away because I had no practical way of getting them from Michigan to Colorado. You couldn't just get two guys and pick them up and put 'em in the truck. A real shame. Not semi-automatics, so off-topic. But losing that collection was totally my fault, really. __________________ NRA Benefactor Member “If I had to live my life again, I'd make the same mistakes, only sooner.” T Bankhead "I think only the authorities should have weapons." The New American Electorate

April 29, 2015, 11:21 AM	#79
Magnum Wheel Man Senior Member Join Date: July 26, 2006 Location: Southern Minnesota Posts: 9,333	got a 1/4 mile long driveway, & always wanted a pair of field cannons one on each side of the drive, up by the house... real ones or working replicas are the only thing I'd consider, & they cost way too much for lawn ornaments... & I just couldn't make myself do a pair of the concrete ones... if I won't keep an antique gun if it's not shootable... I just couldn't live with myself & a pair of concrete cannons __________________ In life you either make dust or eat dust...

April 29, 2015, 01:08 PM	#80
Bongo Boy Senior Member Join Date: December 18, 2008 Location: Colo Spgs CO Posts: 517	Understand. Most if not all of the guns he built were turned from solid billets of 4140 'Stressproof'. You couldn't blow them up with black powder no matter what load you put in them--and god knows we tried a few times with the smaller ones. I reckon the walls at the chamber area of the Columbiad he build were probably 2" thick--4140 steel now, not cast iron. I'd like to know who got that gun. At the home where I grew up and for most of my life there, we had a 3" bore 'Lyle Gun' (I think that's right) mounted in the yard. This was a deck gun intended for firing a line from one ship to another for...well, anytime you needed to do that. We lived directly across the road from a skeet and trap club, and during the big tournaments often folks would stop in and want to know all about this little cannon in the yard. Eventually it was brought inside and restored, as dad figured it would likely go missing what with all those 'big city Detroit people' snooping around. This would be in the late 60s. Very nice story on NAA, reticle. I know I read your briefer version somewhere else recently, but this added a lot. I truly enjoy these historical stories about the 'pioneer days'. Maybe it's just me but it seems like there was a period in the 50s and 60s when individuals played bigger roles. Maybe not..but it seems the magazines were thicker, the personalities (and egos) bigger and the developments a little more exciting. Could be it's just that the latest polymer 9 just doesn't get my attention. __________________ NRA Benefactor Member “If I had to live my life again, I'd make the same mistakes, only sooner.” T Bankhead "I think only the authorities should have weapons." The New American Electorate Last edited by Bongo Boy; April 29, 2015 at 08:03 PM.

April 29, 2015, 11:45 PM	#82
Hunter0924 Senior Member Join Date: September 12, 2007 Location: North Carolina Posts: 472	The new 2015 all stainless Desert Eagle I reviewed after SHOT. I liked it so good I decided to hang onto the test sample. Is it practical? Maybe, depending on your needs but I can see how it would work great for defense in bear country. __________________ My firearms review site. http://rangehot.com/

April 30, 2015, 06:26 AM	#83
Mike Irwin Staff Join Date: April 13, 2000 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 41,390	Sure we do. We're called revolver shooters... __________________ "The gift which I am sending you is called a dog, and is in fact the most precious and valuable possession of mankind" -Theodorus Gaza Baby Jesus cries when the fat redneck doesn't have military-grade firepower.

April 29, 2015, 11:13 PM	#81
reticle Senior Member Join Date: November 27, 2002 Location: ut. Posts: 341	I think you are right, Bongo. Now everything seems corporatized. Every design has to fit a certain model of success. Fewer departures from the norm. American automobile manufacturers did the same thing in the 70's. Vehicles used to be dramatically different between brands. Body styles were more exciting and bold. Now? Well it's all fairly bland. Only the supercars are unique. Seems the firearms industry has been on a plateau.

April 30, 2015, 08:58 PM	#85
Hunter0924 Senior Member Join Date: September 12, 2007 Location: North Carolina Posts: 472	They do offer it in .44 Magnum as well as a conversion kit for the 50 AE, which is really just a barrel and a couple of magazines. I do get the rail takes away from the sleek look but it does add a bit of function to the gun as a trail/hiking gun. __________________ My firearms review site. http://rangehot.com/

May 1, 2015, 01:36 AM	#86
44 AMP Staff Join Date: March 11, 2006 Location: Upper US Posts: 28,839	I do like the ported muzzle. It would probably tame the .44 a bit too. In .357 it might even eliminate the small muzzle rise the DE has in that caliber. That would be something. Don't care for the belly rail at all. I prefer certain spots to be smooth. It doesn't add any function for me, but then I'm not one of the folks who bolts lights, lasers, or drop tanks under my pistols. And I can't help but think of all those nice edges to catch on things. Any chance it comes with a rail cover? __________________ All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better.

May 1, 2015, 06:09 PM	#88
44 AMP Staff Join Date: March 11, 2006 Location: Upper US Posts: 28,839	Accessorizing? no, just looking to see if I can avoid a gun with a built on cheese grater or sawblade.. __________________ All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better.

May 4, 2015, 08:18 PM	#92
Japle Senior Member Join Date: October 12, 2004 Location: Viera, Florida Posts: 1,340	Before I lost my mind and sold it, I had a .357 Automag with an 8 1/2" polished barrel. It was amazingly accurate. My deer load was a Sierra 150gr JHC at 1855 fps. For jackrabbits and coyotes, I used the Sierra 90 gr 9mm JHC over a compressed load of 33.0 gr of WW296. It chronographed consistently at 2496 fps. That load would kill a coyote in his tracks and turn a jackrabbit into a thin pink cloud. The muzzle flash was impressive. The only light in this pic is from the flash. I had a custom scope mount made from T6 aluminum and mounted a 1.7X Hudson Handgunner scope.

May 4, 2015, 08:38 PM	#93
orionengnr Senior Member Join Date: July 9, 2004 Posts: 5,177	Dang, when I lived in IL (15 years ago) I was at a small local gun show and should have bought the .357 Auto Mag for $750. Kicking myself ever since. I've been looking at Coonans for about two years now. If they'd make a .41 Auto...

May 5, 2015, 03:03 AM	#94
44 AMP Staff Join Date: March 11, 2006 Location: Upper US Posts: 28,839	I would kick you too. $750 for an Auto Mag 15 years ago was less than half the going rate at that time. The first Auto Mag I saw "in person" was one of the long barrel .357s. The price was $395. Doesn't sound like a lot today, but at the time, it was. MSRP of the S&W M29 .44mag was $283.50. I watched that one sit on the dealer's shelf, for nearly 3 years, and saw the price go up to $695. Went into the Army. When I got back, the gun was gone, of course. Saw two of them in a Payless in 76. Standard 6.5" ribbed guns, .357 & .44. $795 & $895. Next one I saw was in 80. Standard .44AMP, $995. Then Sudden Impact came out. The price jumped to $1500. (83) I got a loan, when I found this one.. also came with a bit more than this.. A couple more boxes of ammo, and several boxes of fired brass. Nice action shot of the .357, Japle! Interesting scope mount, too. Mounted to the grips? or the frame? I've seen where several people scoped Auto Mags, mounting them to the barrel extension. This is apparently a scope killer. Seems that while they live through the recoil, the sudden stop in the opposite direction when the gun returns to battery is too much. Or so I've heard, back in the day... __________________ All else being equal (and it almost never is) bigger bullets tend to work better.

May 6, 2015, 06:20 PM	#95
ezmiraldo Senior Member Join Date: April 5, 2013 Location: one of the un-free states Posts: 240	These are some awesome guns, guys! Makes me wanna get that S&W 500! __________________ When Darth Vader killed the younglings, did anyone blame the lightsaber???

May 6, 2015, 10:13 PM	#96
reticle Senior Member Join Date: November 27, 2002 Location: ut. Posts: 341	Found more pics of my Grizzly

May 7, 2015, 04:28 PM	#97
Bongo Boy Senior Member Join Date: December 18, 2008 Location: Colo Spgs CO Posts: 517	Very nice. I love that finish on these. It looks like you have a conventional steel backstrap/mainspring housing whatever it's called. Mine has a rubber insert in it--which is okay I guess. Is your lovely Grizzly all-factory or did you make some changes? There was a specimen on gunbroker that was in somewhat rough condition but perfectly fixable, and I was giving serious though to going for it and having it hard chromed. Couldn't make up my mind before it got away--it was going for a relatively low price. __________________ NRA Benefactor Member “If I had to live my life again, I'd make the same mistakes, only sooner.” T Bankhead "I think only the authorities should have weapons." The New American Electorate

May 7, 2015, 07:18 PM	#98
reticle Senior Member Join Date: November 27, 2002 Location: ut. Posts: 341	Bongo, the back strap or mainspring housing is part of the Smith and Alexander mag well. I kept the original rubber covered MSH too in case I ever sell and the buyer wants it back to original. Everything else is as it came from LAR. I toyed with the idea of updating to a beaver tail grip safety and skeletonized hammer, but I decided not to modify the frame and the hammer because it might affect the sear release negatively. I could install the new parts and have then tuned, but it seemed to me all of that would yield diminishing returns in value and performance. The fact is, the factory action is every bit as tuned as my Colt Delta Gold Cup. The factory trigger shoe even has an over travel set screw like my Gold Cup. Believe it or not, I picked this gun up for 600.00 back in 97 (I think that was the year)

May 7, 2015, 07:27 PM	#99
Bongo Boy Senior Member Join Date: December 18, 2008 Location: Colo Spgs CO Posts: 517	Well, there's a two-tone in mint condx at gb right now with a buy it now of $1,595...and I'd greatly prefer one-tone to two-tone. I have yet to see an all-chrome for auction. As for the stock trigger, I'm perfectly happy with mine although it's a tad heavy. I don't believe I'm at the point where any aspect of the gun is holding back my grouping though. __________________ NRA Benefactor Member “If I had to live my life again, I'd make the same mistakes, only sooner.” T Bankhead "I think only the authorities should have weapons." The New American Electorate

May 7, 2015, 08:14 PM	#100
reticle Senior Member Join Date: November 27, 2002 Location: ut. Posts: 341	I've seen all hard chromed Grizzlies on gunbroker before. There are not as many as there are parkerized and two tone pistols so they are not posted as often. IIRC the last all hard chromed Grizzly that sold on GB went for 1800-ish. Regardless of finish, these pistols are beasts and can generate a toothy grin on the face of even the most grumpy shooter.