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Old January 9, 2018, 04:51 PM   #1
doofus47
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Colorado Front Range Planning Site for shooting on Public Land

Hey all, if you live in the front range of Colorado, you might want to take 30 mins to go to this site, read up a bit and comment to the USFS.

Posted as a public service to public land recreational shooters so they won't be surprised by "sudden" new rules. I've seen a steady drum beat of letters to the editor urging people to comment on the site to "make our forests more safe." So get your oar in the water now.

http://www.sportshootingpartners.org...ement-project/
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Old January 9, 2018, 06:03 PM   #2
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Yikes. Those are some large sweeping closures.


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Old January 9, 2018, 08:56 PM   #3
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This is a serious threat to having a place to shoot in Colorado.
Among the proposed alternatives :Closing essentially ALL public land to "dispersed shooting,including National Forests,BLM,and National Grassland.
(See options 3 and 4)

These proposals were drafted Oct 2017.

Looking at the maps,it appears Boulder is the epicenter of the most restrictive zones.

HMMMM. Why am I wondering about a certain Boulder based Congressman with his eye on the Colorado Governor's mansion? But that's just my tinfoil hat.
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Old January 9, 2018, 09:11 PM   #4
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I'm surprised they don't go any further south than Denver. Last time I was up in CO... I camp just west of Colorado Springs, up Gold Camp Rd... they had a huge sign telling you where you couldn't shoot, and that there were no more unlicensed ORV's allowed.
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Old January 9, 2018, 09:35 PM   #5
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It does extend further south. It is getting tougher to find unrestricted land to shoot on in what was once an excellent state.
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Old January 9, 2018, 11:41 PM   #6
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Perhaps one of the reasons for the proposed closures is the trash left behind by some (not all) shooters. In talking to a Forest Ranger at Baker Draw a couple years ago, he told me that people had shot holes in the trash cans, trashed the parking lot, left shot up targets, bottles, cans, clay pigeons etc. There are signs instructing users to clean up after themselves.

Baker Draw is a very nicely equiped range for the public to use. Too bad there are always a few rotten apples that could care less.

Rant over.
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Old January 10, 2018, 03:37 AM   #7
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Thank you doofus47 for posting this link.

I have made my comment in support of no new restrictions.
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Old January 10, 2018, 03:47 AM   #8
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Would also like to add...

I'm that guy that fills up two large black trash bags with other peoples trash every time I come back from shooting on public lands in the mountains.

Maybe I should have added that in my comment.
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Old January 10, 2018, 10:10 AM   #9
Charlie_98
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Quote:
Perhaps one of the reasons for the proposed closures is the trash left behind by some (not all) shooters. In talking to a Forest Ranger at Baker Draw a couple years ago, he told me that people had shot holes in the trash cans, trashed the parking lot, left shot up targets, bottles, cans, clay pigeons etc. There are signs instructing users to clean up after themselves.

Baker Draw is a very nicely equiped range for the public to use. Too bad there are always a few rotten apples that could care less.

Rant over.
There was a spot just up Gold Camp Rd that was designated as a shooting area... this was back in the late '80's. It slowly went from a reasonable place to shoot, to what looked like an artillery impact area... trees shot down, piles of trash and shells, shot up junk... it was awful. Further up GCR, where the High Drive 3-way is, it was worse... both of those areas are now completely restricted (2016.) Unfortunately, the clowns just keep moving west... further up, at Wye Campground, now IT looks like the other areas... Those people are not shooters... just blockheads with a gun. There is a place in southern NV that I shoot at... same thing, so it's not local to CO, either.
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Old January 10, 2018, 03:24 PM   #10
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One problem with map 4 is your not going to get public on west side of the divide agreeing with happen on east of the divide. I live Black Forest and Pikes Peak NF has some closure on shooting and all it did was move shooters to other areas with NF.

FS closed Rampart Shooting Range

http://gazette.com/rampart-range-sho.../article/58832

When we first move to Co we lived Ft Collins and I remember guys shooting across Poudre Canyon Hwy 14.

I can see some closure but does FS have money for it.
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Old January 10, 2018, 09:45 PM   #11
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The closures are definitely trouble. Closure with no realistic alternatives being offered. It's already hard enough to find places to shoot and the ranges aren't exactly cheap, in fact its darn expensive to shoot if you have a family. I'm guessing this is to some degree yet another political grab as this state is progressively being ruined.
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Old January 10, 2018, 09:53 PM   #12
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One thing stands out to me if they keep their word.......

Quote:
proposed closures would likely not take effect until developed shooting ranges were constructed in the vicinity
I have been hunting and shooting on public land since I was old enough to shoot. For many decade the only folks I saw on those parcels I hunted were hunters and shooters. Bow hunters and Turkey hunters in full camo were rare and far between(other than me). Ain't that way anymore in most areas. We have folks looking for sheds, folks pickin' berries, searching for edible mushrooms and other plants, folks snowshoeing and hiking, bird watchers and camera buffs.....all using "public land" at any given time of year. Shooters don't own public land, nor do they have any more rights to it than non-shooters. Being a responsible shooter, I would rather have a designated range in the same area knowing my shooting was not endangering anyone else recreating there. As one who also enjoys looking for morels, blueberries and Jerusalem artichokes, I'd rather not be downrange from someone irresponsible when they get their new AR and 500 rounds of ammo. Again, this does not affect legal hunting, only target shooting. Not a big deal to me. They closed down target shooting on public land other than designated ranges, years ago around here. While a few folks squawked for a while about it, you don't hear it anymore.
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Old January 11, 2018, 04:33 PM   #13
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I put in my comments. I understand not wanting to have some yahoo who doesn't understand safe shooting blazing away with his or her new AK.
I have seen trash accumulate at public shooting sites and I'm offended by it. I used to take a garbage bag and pack out what I could in addition to my own spent cartridges.
There's no excuse for unsafe shooting and there's no excuse for garbage left behind.
That said, the major complaints appear to be "This noise is ruining my expectations of quiet/ it's scaring me" or "There's too many people hiking/biking/riding and no one knows where those bullets will go." This is a bit like the family moving into a house next to a pig farm and suing the pig farm b/c of the smell that's been there since day 1.

Looking over the comments section, I see several places where people are annoyed by (to generalize) "hunters in my bean patch!" This isn't just going to be about shooting. It's going to be more and more about "too dangerous to do with this many people around." All the same arguments will apply to hunting as well. I see this movement as a first step to closing down even hunting on the front range. All of the same complaints apply and the cry will be "If it saves even one hiker/biker/rider...we should stop hunting here." One of the letters to the editor I was reading mentions the environmental dangers of lead bullets. This has all the hallmarks of a California "peace, love and no one not on our guest list" movement.
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Last edited by doofus47; January 11, 2018 at 04:34 PM. Reason: added clarity
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Old January 12, 2018, 09:36 PM   #14
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I can't remember the name of the canyon just north of Boulder that was a popular shooting spot, but the forest service had a habit of closing it year round due to "fire danger"
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Old January 12, 2018, 10:57 PM   #15
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Units I hunt here in Co, FS locks gates just after 4th season to all vehicles and they don't open them to public may/june.

You have guys trashing NF to shoot and they don't care. They trash Rampart before it was closed.

I don't blame people wanting to enjoy NF and not have to put up with shooting. How many take there families along to rifle range to enjoy picnic and good walk around the range.
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Old January 15, 2018, 06:38 PM   #16
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That's Lefthand canyon, Rob228. That side canyon shooting spot has been closed for some time. Damage from the floods of 2013 closed other areas as well.
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Old February 1, 2018, 10:14 PM   #17
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Unfortunately a few shooters bring this on ALL shooters, shooting TVs, computers, LP tanks and all kinds of trash and leaving it happens all goo often.

A range near here used to be cleaned by the Scouts and Lions. Then they said NO MORE and the DNR closed it.

At another DNR range I go to a local conservation club maintains it, mows grass, dumps trash and replaces target supports.

The target supports is a kind of chicken wire on log (timber) posts, about 4-5" diameter.. Shooting season 2016, the club replaced 67!! posts shot off by slobs. We get a few holes in the metal roofing also.
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Old February 2, 2018, 09:37 AM   #18
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Just a quick short story about shooting on public land. For 50+ years my family has been taking vacations in the U.P. of Michigan. Few years back, I had a few nephews that were interested in shooting handguns while up there, so I contacted the local Chamber of Commerce as to if there was a local public shooting range nearby. I was told there was and given explicit directions and a warm welcome. When we got up there I found out it was in a huge tract of Wilderness area, in National Forest land and was part of the Forest Service's gravel pit. No real bunker, just a small mound of dirt maybe 6 feet high by 20 feet wide. Trash, old car parts and thousands of spend shell casings on the ground. Worried it was the wrong place or maybe it was not really a legal place to shoot, I stopped by the Forest Service building and asked the folks there. All confirmed it was "the range" and everyone in the area shot there. While I was there, a county sheriff stopped by and he too told me it was okay to shoot there. went back to check it out again and while I was there heard voices in the woods behind the backstop and discovered a troop of Boyscouts portaging their canoes from one lake to the other.......not 30 yards directly behind the so called "berm". Never did shoot there for obvious reasons. This is why we need designated shooting areas on public land.
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Old February 2, 2018, 09:53 PM   #19
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And because some people are careless with fire,forest fires occur.They burn down homes and kill people.
Some people tear up meadows with 4 wd vehicles.

Only bird watchers should have access to public land.
Of course,since shooting occurs during hunting season,and some people get shot by hunters,we should ban hnting on public land.

Heck,why stop with public land ! Look at Chicago. Do you want to just ban everything?

Public land is owned by everyone,shooters too. And multiple use includes shooting,too.

buck 460,the inadequate backstop with the portage behind it was recommended by who??? The FS. Government management.
Suppose you picked your own dry wash,where you knew where every bullet would stop? Self responsibility.
The UP of Michigan is nothing like the Front Range of Northern Colorado. I will not attempt to apply Northern Colorado solutions to Michigan problems.Could we make that reciprocal?

A problem is the "official" ranges are seldom more than 100 yds.

Another is I prefer to be off by myself.If I can find a bare dirt wash that stops all my bullets and I want to set up at 600 yds,to shoot paper,I'm not hurting anything.
If I can see a whole mountainside and I want to shoot rocks with my .44 handgun,I'm not hurting anything.

Maybe what they ought to do is dedicate some large tracts of BLM ,several square miles,to range out to 1000 yds,no access in the beaten zone,two-tracks to set targets,etc. Ban birdwatching and bicycles.

Last edited by HiBC; February 2, 2018 at 10:01 PM.
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