Overloaded 45 ACP

SLCBill · November 13, 2009, 06:05 AM

So I think I messed up.
I loaded 500 rounds of 45 ACP (minus 20 for something not sure) with the recipe of 8 grains of power pistol behind 230 grain Hornady XTP JHP.

DISCLAIMER-DONT USE THIS LOAD CONSULT YOUR LOADING MANUAL

Not sure why that sounded good to me at the time but according to Sierra thats a bad idea. Does anyone have anyother load data that might say this is ok but not advisable in the future. I just don't want to blow up my H&K USP.

Does anyone know what Quickload has to say. Any input would help. I would hate to have to "hammer" (bullet puller) all those bullets apart.

I think those first 20 were shot out of this handgun in the summer, just can't remember but I am glad I marked the box with the recipe.

Could this be considered a +P+ load or am I just kidding my self.

WhistlerSWE · November 13, 2009, 07:54 AM

Quickload says:

With a COL of 1.224" you get a maximum pressure of 23187psi and muzzle velocity of 1003fps.

The max pressure of the .45ACP is 21000fps, you are WAY over!

Time to find you kinectic bullet puller...

Sevens · November 13, 2009, 08:18 AM

23,000 PSI is SAAMI max for +P in .45 Auto.

There exists no such designation as ".45 +P+" any more than there exists a .45 SuperColonRattler. You can name some poorly handloaded cartridge a .45 +P+, but it's nothing more than a silly nickname because there is no industry standard for it.

Shooting them would be a very bad idea, in my opinion, because unless you left a lot of details out, you did NOT work up this load... you simply made 500 of them.

And the Quickload results of 23,187 might be correct, but now you are putting your pistol, your hands, and your face in the pile and going "all in" that Quickload is accurate enough to not only make up for your poor handloading technique, but that it can also make up for all the variables that have not been entered to even come up with that number.

Bullet pullers are a handy tool at the bench for taking down a couple of rounds when you goof or when you simply want to take down a load. Using one to pull 480 loaded rounds would be like using white out to start over a 5-page document and write something entirely different on the paper.

On the other hand... the physical labor of doing that four hundred and eighty times might tattoo the experience on your brain so that maybe, just maybe, you think a little bit more next time... before you crank up your press.

Do I think these rounds will grenade your pistol? Maybe not... most pistols are designed to handle a load that goes slightly over max. Depends on the pistol and how accurate Quickload has estimated your loads and how lucky you are. But there certainly is a lot of risk with very little reward in trying it, don't you think?

Foxbat · November 13, 2009, 09:03 AM

I have shot plenty of rounds in that stress category without any issues, so most likely it will be OK, but you better be safe than sorry.

Dismantling 500 rounds is not big deal, but do not use the kinetic puller with its mess. Get the collet puller and the job will become a pie. No banging, no mess, just cleanly pulled bullets. Goes MUCH faster too. I have done several hundred rounds, no sweat.

Before you do the wholesale pull, however, do the following: pull say, ten bullets, and reduce the load in five to 7 and five to 7.5 grains, then chrono them. That should give you very good idea on what your other rounds will do.

In reality your load might be below the book velocity and quite safe to shoot.

spencerhut · November 13, 2009, 09:07 AM

My standard Defensive Practice Load for .45ACP is 7.4g Power Pistol behind a 230g Speer Gold Dot. Not a dangerous load by any measure. 7.6g is the Hornady Vol7 book max for a 230g XTP.
Speer seems to think 8.1g Power Pistol is okay with a 230g TMJ, but only 7.4g for the 230g Gold Dot.

If you want to be safe pull them. But DO NOT use one of those stupid hammer type pullers. Those are good for one or two mistakes, not 500. Get a real puller from Hornady, Forester or RCBS, if you decide to pull them. Then you can recover all the components and reload them all.

http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct...tnumber=851547

http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct...tnumber=680804

Spammy_H · November 13, 2009, 09:32 AM

Rather than using an inertia bullet puller, you may want to invest in a collet puller for that particular cartridge - it'll go a lot faster than a hammer and may save your elbow.

medalguy · November 13, 2009, 12:14 PM

Get the Forster collet puller. Very easy and fast for more than a few cases. Don't ask how I know this.

http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct...tnumber=419303

snuffy · November 13, 2009, 01:07 PM

Yeah, pull 'em!

But save yourself some time, get the Hornady cam-loc puller. The RCBS and forster are much slower.

http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct...tnumber=851547

Kyo · November 13, 2009, 03:46 PM

you are in the +p realm of pressure for sure

espnazi · November 13, 2009, 05:27 PM

I don't know much about reloading but the USP 45 is able to handle 45 Super so I don't think it would explode.

Alleykat · November 13, 2009, 05:32 PM

Since at least one reloading manual says that 8.1 grains is safe, I'd not fret a lot about it. If you'd dropped a few tenths more, then I'd say fret some.

BurkGlocker · November 13, 2009, 05:33 PM

Wooooo! Yeah, 8 grains is a little hot... My +p loadings were at 7.5 grs with a 160 gr Barnes bullet, I can only imagine what 8 would do behind a 230 XTP.

SLCBill · November 13, 2009, 05:44 PM

Thanks for all your help, I think I did work up to that load with the previous 20 rounds. I usually do when building new rounds, I just can't find any paper work or notes on them.

Glad I labeled the box though. I had always heard the 45 ACP was a low pressure round, maybe thats why I loaded them that hot after working up.

Man if I am this forgetful at 34 I better start buying notepads and pencils now. I hate getting old and you all will say "your not even there yet KID".

Thanks for your help.

SLCBill · November 13, 2009, 05:55 PM

I figured out where the load info I used came from, I was loading for a

45 ACP (Revolver)

as per Sierra. Maybe I will just buy another gun rather than pull all those bullets. (Think I can sell that excuse to the wife...... I didn't think so either.)

Does anyone still make that gun. Sounds like time for Googleman. His only weakness is dialup and carpultunnel syndrome.

Edward429451 · November 13, 2009, 06:26 PM

Snuffy says the Hornady is better than the RCBS one? Hmm, I have the RCBS one and had occassion to pull ~2600 .223's with it (NO! not my bad ammo a gunshops, I bought a 5 gal bucket of rejects for 1 cent apiece!) ...and I could imagine a better one than the RCBS....

(2600 bullets & brass for 26 bucks!)

The RCBS did work though.

Winterhawk56 · November 13, 2009, 11:04 PM

I'm telling ya Snuffy is absolutely right! Bought the Hornady Cam-Lock and used it on piston rounds!
Also as stated here don't shoot the rounds, unload them.

CPTMurdoc30 · November 13, 2009, 11:14 PM

I would pull them. Believe me when I tell you that you don't even want to think about beating a hammer puller for 500 rounds.

I did 100 308 win 168gr SMK in one session my hand swole up like a spider bit it. I couldn't use it for 2 days and it was my important hand. It hurt for 2 or 3 days. Collet puller all the way if done right quicker and safer than hammer puller.

Claude Clay · November 13, 2009, 11:29 PM

blackhawk 45 colt/45acp and a 38/357&9mm
are good to have when you play a bit outside the box.
and a jewelers 6x and 10x glass. besides the obvious over-pressure signs,
you can closely examine a gun for even the smallest signs of stress.

id fire yours through the black hawk and test for how destructive they are.
and wet white pages penetration.
have some fun

as always when reloading--observe all the rules.

sourdough44 · November 14, 2009, 07:36 AM

I spend a lot of time cross referencing before I go near the reloading bench. I don't have the data in front of me but it sounds like your best to pull them. I supposed super cooling them before shooting wouldn't be the proper advice.

20nickels · November 14, 2009, 06:06 PM

The USP handles 45 Super. After you make some reduced loads and work up to these w/ a chrony to know where you're at.. shoot 'em! Or buy a S&W 625, you will not regret that.

SLCBill · November 14, 2009, 06:21 PM

I looked into buying 45ACP revovler today. Couldn't do it had to go with the 460 S&W 5 and 3/8. Also tried pulling bullets with my uncles puller wouldn't do it looks like I am going to remember this hammering experience for a long time. I think I will only do 100 or so a weekend for a month. Let this be a lesson to everyone. Stupid hurts but at least I wont blow up my gun.

20nickels · November 14, 2009, 07:54 PM

Maybe just use the 460 for taget pactice at the sky??

November 13, 2009, 06:05 AM	#1
SLCBill Member Join Date: October 31, 2009 Location: Salt Lake Utah Posts: 18	Overloaded 45 ACP So I think I messed up. I loaded 500 rounds of 45 ACP (minus 20 for something not sure) with the recipe of 8 grains of power pistol behind 230 grain Hornady XTP JHP. *DISCLAIMER-DONT USE THIS LOAD CONSULT YOUR LOADING MANUAL* Not sure why that sounded good to me at the time but according to Sierra thats a bad idea. Does anyone have anyother load data that might say this is ok but not advisable in the future. I just don't want to blow up my H&K USP. Does anyone know what Quickload has to say. Any input would help. I would hate to have to "hammer" (bullet puller) all those bullets apart. I think those first 20 were shot out of this handgun in the summer, just can't remember but I am glad I marked the box with the recipe. Could this be considered a +P+ load or am I just kidding my self. __________________ Insert extremist comment here. Last edited by SLCBill; November 13, 2009 at 06:07 AM. Reason: additions

November 13, 2009, 08:18 AM	#3
Sevens Senior Member Join Date: July 28, 2007 Location: Ohio Posts: 11,756	23,000 PSI is SAAMI max for +P in .45 Auto. There exists no such designation as ".45 +P+" any more than there exists a .45 SuperColonRattler. You can name some poorly handloaded cartridge a .45 +P+, but it's nothing more than a silly nickname because there is no industry standard for it. Shooting them would be a very bad idea, in my opinion, because unless you left a lot of details out, you did NOT work up this load... you simply made 500 of them. And the Quickload results of 23,187 might be correct, but now you are putting your pistol, your hands, and your face in the pile and going "all in" that Quickload is accurate enough to not only make up for your poor handloading technique, but that it can also make up for all the variables that have not been entered to even come up with that number. Bullet pullers are a handy tool at the bench for taking down a couple of rounds when you goof or when you simply want to take down a load. Using one to pull 480 loaded rounds would be like using white out to start over a 5-page document and write something entirely different on the paper. On the other hand... the physical labor of doing that four hundred and eighty times might tattoo the experience on your brain so that maybe, just maybe, you think a little bit more next time... before you crank up your press. Do I think these rounds will grenade your pistol? Maybe not... most pistols are designed to handle a load that goes slightly over max. Depends on the pistol and how accurate Quickload has estimated your loads and how lucky you are. But there certainly is a lot of risk with very little reward in trying it, don't you think? __________________ *Attention Brass rats and other reloaders:* I really need .327 Federal Magnum brass, no lot size too small. Tell me what caliber you need and I'll see what I have to swap. PM me and we'll discuss.

November 13, 2009, 09:07 AM	#5
spencerhut Senior Member Join Date: March 18, 2006 Location: Idaho Posts: 147	My standard Defensive Practice Load for .45ACP is 7.4g Power Pistol behind a 230g Speer Gold Dot. Not a dangerous load by any measure. 7.6g is the Hornady Vol7 book max for a 230g XTP. Speer seems to think 8.1g Power Pistol is okay with a 230g TMJ, but only 7.4g for the 230g Gold Dot. If you want to be safe pull them. But DO NOT use one of those stupid hammer type pullers. Those are good for one or two mistakes, not 500. Get a real puller from Hornady, Forester or RCBS, if you decide to pull them. Then you can recover all the components and reload them all. http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct...tnumber=851547 http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct...tnumber=680804 Last edited by spencerhut; November 13, 2009 at 10:00 AM.

November 13, 2009, 01:07 PM	#8
snuffy Senior Member Join Date: May 20, 2001 Location: Oshkosh wi. Posts: 3,055	Yeah, pull 'em! But save yourself some time, get the Hornady cam-loc puller. The RCBS and forster are much slower. http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct...tnumber=851547 __________________ The more people I meet, the more I love my dog They're going to get their butts kicked over there this election. How come people can't spell and use words correctly?

November 13, 2009, 03:46 PM	#9
Kyo Senior Member Join Date: April 14, 2009 Posts: 897	you are in the +p realm of pressure for sure __________________ 1. The gun is *always* loaded. 2. Never let the muzzle cover anything you are not willing to destroy. 3. Keep your finger off the trigger unless you are ready to shoot. 4. Be be sure of your target and what is beyond it.

November 13, 2009, 07:54 AM	#2
WhistlerSWE Member Join Date: November 14, 2008 Location: Sweden Posts: 70	Quickload says: With a COL of 1.224" you get a maximum pressure of 23187psi and muzzle velocity of 1003fps. The max pressure of the .45ACP is 21000fps, you are WAY over! Time to find you kinectic bullet puller...

November 13, 2009, 09:03 AM	#4
Foxbat Senior Member Join Date: January 13, 2008 Posts: 367	I have shot plenty of rounds in that stress category without any issues, so most likely it will be OK, but you better be safe than sorry. Dismantling 500 rounds is not big deal, but do not use the kinetic puller with its mess. Get the collet puller and the job will become a pie. No banging, no mess, just cleanly pulled bullets. Goes MUCH faster too. I have done several hundred rounds, no sweat. Before you do the wholesale pull, however, do the following: pull say, ten bullets, and reduce the load in five to 7 and five to 7.5 grains, then chrono them. That should give you very good idea on what your other rounds will do. In reality your load might be below the book velocity and quite safe to shoot.

November 13, 2009, 09:32 AM	#6
Spammy_H Senior Member Join Date: September 17, 2009 Posts: 220	Rather than using an inertia bullet puller, you may want to invest in a collet puller for that particular cartridge - it'll go a lot faster than a hammer and may save your elbow.

November 13, 2009, 12:14 PM	#7
medalguy Senior Member Join Date: August 31, 2009 Location: New Mexico Posts: 1,033	Get the Forster collet puller. Very easy and fast for more than a few cases. Don't ask how I know this. http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct...tnumber=419303

November 13, 2009, 05:27 PM	#10
espnazi Senior Member Join Date: August 6, 2009 Posts: 256	I don't know much about reloading but the USP 45 is able to handle 45 Super so I don't think it would explode.

November 13, 2009, 05:32 PM	#11
Alleykat Junior member Join Date: July 26, 2007 Posts: 3,668	Since at least one reloading manual says that 8.1 grains is safe, I'd not fret a lot about it. If you'd dropped a few tenths more, then I'd say fret some.

November 13, 2009, 05:33 PM	#12
BurkGlocker Senior Member Join Date: May 18, 2008 Location: Sheppard AFB, TX Posts: 568	Wooooo! Yeah, 8 grains is a little hot... My +p loadings were at 7.5 grs with a 160 gr Barnes bullet, I can only imagine what 8 would do behind a 230 XTP.

November 13, 2009, 05:44 PM	#13
SLCBill Member Join Date: October 31, 2009 Location: Salt Lake Utah Posts: 18	Thanks for all your help, I think I did work up to that load with the previous 20 rounds. I usually do when building new rounds, I just can't find any paper work or notes on them. Glad I labeled the box though. I had always heard the 45 ACP was a low pressure round, maybe thats why I loaded them that hot after working up. Man if I am this forgetful at 34 I better start buying notepads and pencils now. I hate getting old and you all will say "your not even there yet KID". Thanks for your help. __________________ Insert extremist comment here.

November 13, 2009, 05:55 PM	#14
SLCBill Member Join Date: October 31, 2009 Location: Salt Lake Utah Posts: 18	I figured out where the load info I used came from, I was loading for a 45 ACP (Revolver) as per Sierra. Maybe I will just buy another gun rather than pull all those bullets. (Think I can sell that excuse to the wife...... I didn't think so either.) Does anyone still make that gun. Sounds like time for Googleman. His only weakness is dialup and carpultunnel syndrome. __________________ Insert extremist comment here.

November 13, 2009, 06:26 PM	#15
Edward429451 Junior member Join Date: November 12, 2000 Location: Colorado Springs, Colorado Posts: 9,494	Snuffy says the Hornady is better than the RCBS one? Hmm, I have the RCBS one and had occassion to pull ~2600 .223's with it (NO! not my bad ammo a gunshops, I bought a 5 gal bucket of rejects for 1 cent apiece!) ...and I could imagine a better one than the RCBS.... (2600 bullets & brass for 26 bucks!) The RCBS did work though.

November 13, 2009, 11:04 PM	#16
Winterhawk56 Senior Member Join Date: March 9, 2008 Location: Southern California Posts: 228	I'm telling ya Snuffy is absolutely right! Bought the Hornady Cam-Lock and used it on piston rounds! Also as stated here don't shoot the rounds, unload them.

November 13, 2009, 11:14 PM	#17
CPTMurdoc30 Senior Member Join Date: February 27, 2008 Location: Stafford VA Posts: 969	I would pull them. Believe me when I tell you that you don't even want to think about beating a hammer puller for 500 rounds. I did 100 308 win 168gr SMK in one session my hand swole up like a spider bit it. I couldn't use it for 2 days and it was my important hand. It hurt for 2 or 3 days. Collet puller all the way if done right quicker and safer than hammer puller. __________________ Solving Virginia's Ground Hog problems 50gr at a time.....

November 13, 2009, 11:29 PM	#18
Claude Clay Senior Member Join Date: March 14, 2007 Location: CT Posts: 325	blackhawk 45 colt/45acp and a 38/357&9mm are good to have when you play a bit outside the box. and a jewelers 6x and 10x glass. besides the obvious over-pressure signs, you can closely examine a gun for even the smallest signs of stress. id fire yours through the black hawk and test for how destructive they are. and wet white pages penetration. have some fun as always when reloading--observe all the rules. __________________ NRA Instructor -- NRA Basic Pistol & Re-Loading Make a fire for a man and you warm him for the night Light him on fire and you warm him for the rest of his life

November 14, 2009, 07:36 AM	#19
sourdough44 Senior Member Join Date: October 17, 2007 Location: WI Posts: 621	I spend a lot of time cross referencing before I go near the reloading bench. I don't have the data in front of me but it sounds like your best to pull them. I supposed super cooling them before shooting wouldn't be the proper advice.

November 14, 2009, 06:06 PM	#20
20nickels Senior Member Join Date: July 2, 2007 Posts: 274	The USP handles 45 Super. After you make some reduced loads and work up to these w/ a chrony to know where you're at.. shoot 'em! Or buy a S&W 625, you will not regret that. __________________ Hillary is a bum.

November 14, 2009, 06:21 PM	#21
SLCBill Member Join Date: October 31, 2009 Location: Salt Lake Utah Posts: 18	I looked into buying 45ACP revovler today. Couldn't do it had to go with the 460 S&W 5 and 3/8. Also tried pulling bullets with my uncles puller wouldn't do it looks like I am going to remember this hammering experience for a long time. I think I will only do 100 or so a weekend for a month. Let this be a lesson to everyone. Stupid hurts but at least I wont blow up my gun. __________________ Insert extremist comment here.

November 14, 2009, 07:54 PM	#22
20nickels Senior Member Join Date: July 2, 2007 Posts: 274	Maybe just use the 460 for taget pactice at the sky?? __________________ Hillary is a bum.