Powder Suggestions

[squirreljuice]

Hey all!

I was just wondering if anyone had any recommendations for a good powder for a really hot 9mm load.

I'm looking to use 147 gr. jacketed hollow points in my MechTech carbine. I want something that will really kick the heavy bolt back to make sure that the rounds fully cycle. MechTech recommends using +P ammo, and I'd like to be able to hand load something for it in that range, as my current loads give consistent stovepipes and failures to eject (they're not crazy hot because all I've got right now are 115 and 124 gr plated bullets).

I have a couple of good reloading data books, but before I buy a new powder I like to see what real life people like to use before I make a decision.

[Jim Watson]

Power Pistol and HS6 are the powders that have given me top speeds.
Look on Benos and see what the Kool Kids are using for 9mm Major.

[Nick_C_S]

Welcome to TFL.

I'm not familiar with that gun (undoubtedly, not legal here in Ca.). But one of the better propellants that works well for full-thrust 147's is AA#7. I think it was actually developed for 147's in carbines. Not sure about that though.

I use it mostly for 10mm. It's good stuff.

[squirreljuice]

I'm not familiar with that gun (undoubtedly, not legal here in Ca.)

I'm not sure if it is legal in CA, but its basically classified as a new slide for your Glock, XD, or 1911. It converts the handle and trigger assembly of your handgun into a small carbine. The accessory is scary accurate, I have a red dot on it now and I can hit almost anything I point it at up to 40-50 yards with a very tight group. My local indoor range goes out to 50 ft and I can get a 2" group almost every time (while the carbine is functioning, that is). A short scope will really start putting rounds accurately a ways away.

Here is their page: http://mechtechsys.com/

Thank you guys for the powder suggestions, I will have to look up some of these powders and find out if I can find them out here in WY.

[5whiskey]

HS6 does hot 9mm well in my experience. Should do even better when you step up to 147 gns.

[Sure Shot Mc Gee]

What powder to use? Depends on whether spring or gas operated?

[74A95]

Look at the powder manufacturer's data for Accurate #7, Silhouette, Longshot, N105, 3N38. These seem to be producing some of the highest speeds.

[RC20]

I am going to be growly here.

If I see someone who needs a suggestion for a hot 9mm powder that tells me that person should not be given any data (and the gun listed that won't work with normal loads? - makes me nervous)

A hot 9mm load is advance reloading.

If you are going advanced and can't read a reloading book and figure out what powders would do that?

So no, I would not recommend a powder.

[T. O'Heir]

Consistent stovepipes and failures to eject in a carbine are about using plated bullets with cast data.
You need to work up a load for your MechTech. They don't have to be hot, but there's 125 grain(close enough to 124) +P(that being about pressure) and 115 grain "coated" and cast bullet data on Alliant's site.
I knew a guy who had a real semi'd Uzi, long ago when they weren't evil, that'd go FA with cast bullet loads.

[74A95]

Originally Posted by RC20

I am going to be growly here.

If I see someone who needs a suggestion for a hot 9mm powder that tells me that person should not be given any data (and the gun listed that won't work with normal loads? - makes me nervous)

A hot 9mm load is advance reloading.

If you are going advanced and can't read a reloading book and figure out what powders would do that?

So no, I would not recommend a powder.

I guess it depends on how you define 'hot'. A hot 9mm load is not advanced reloading if it does not exceed industry standard pressures. I don't see where the OP said he wanted something to exceed industry standard pressures.

There is published data for 9mm +P. According to the OP, "MechTech recommends using +P ammo," so there is no reason for concern if the OP follows load data for that purpose. All he has to do is read a reloading book. We've pointed out powders and load sources for that purpose.

OP, selecting a slow powder will usually result in a stronger recoil impulse because; 1) they tend to produce higher velocity, 2) they usually produce more recoil force because they require more weight, and more gunpowder weight for the same velocity produces more recoil force. That is explained here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recoil...he_ejected_gas

[Shotgun Slim]

Go take a look at Vihtavouri data for 3N38 with a Hornady 147 XTP bullet. I wager you will not find a more stout load within reason.

[Mike38]

Another vote for HS6.

[squirreljuice]

Thanks guys for the recommendations! I will be sure to look them up and try them out. I'll definitely be getting a can of HS6 since everyone seems to like it so much.

Look at the powder manufacturer's data for Accurate #7, Silhouette, Longshot, N105, 3N38. These seem to be producing some of the highest speeds.

I do think I have some Silhouette at my bench right now, I will try to work up some loads with that once I get some bullets. I generally stay away from the fine powders because my press has the Lee Auto Disk on it right now, and that stuff gets EVERYWHERE using that system. The Auto Disk is really great with flake powders like HP38 and throws very consistent charges, but fine powders are a nightmare with the thing. I am ordering a different powder dispenser that will work better with the finer powders, so when that comes in I will definitely dabble in that.

I am going to be growly here.

If I see someone who needs a suggestion for a hot 9mm powder that tells me that person should not be given any data (and the gun listed that won't work with normal loads? - makes me nervous)

A hot 9mm load is advance reloading.

If you are going advanced and can't read a reloading book and figure out what powders would do that?

So no, I would not recommend a powder.

I am fully capable of reading a reloading manual and comparing the FPS and all that to determine the most powerful charge I can get, I merely wanted to know what people like to use. I like to start new forays into charges by finding out what others commonly like and trying it out first before I start buying cans of powder that I may or may not like. I don't have a huge budget for this, and powder isn't the cheapest thing ever. None of my friends around here reload much 9mm, especially not hot loads, so I turned to the internet. Simple as that.

Consistent stovepipes and failures to eject in a carbine are about using plated bullets with cast data.
You need to work up a load for your MechTech. They don't have to be hot, but there's 125 grain(close enough to 124) +P(that being about pressure) and 115 grain "coated" and cast bullet data on Alliant's site.
I knew a guy who had a real semi'd Uzi, long ago when they weren't evil, that'd go FA with cast bullet loads.

Thanks for the tip. I have been slowly working up my loads with my plated bullets and haven't found the sweet spot yet. My last test was 124 gr RNPL with 4.8 gr of HP38 at an OAL of 1.120 and it still wasn't cycling consistently. Its getting closer, so I think I need to bump the charge a bit more. I will definitely check out Alliant's site and see what I can come up with next. Mostly, I just want a good stout load with a really heavy projectile that runs reliably in what I already have. Gotta make the most of what you have, right?

OP, selecting a slow powder will usually result in a stronger recoil impulse because; 1) they tend to produce higher velocity, 2) they usually produce more recoil force because they require more weight, and more gunpowder weight for the same velocity produces more recoil force. That is explained here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recoil...he_ejected_gas

Thanks for the info! I will definitely read up on that.

Go take a look at Vihtavouri data for 3N38 with a Hornady 147 XTP bullet. I wager you will not find a more stout load within reason.

I'll look into that one, but I don't think I've ever seen Vhitavouri of any kind available anywhere in a 50 mile radius of me. I will look into possibly ordering some if I can't find a load I like with the powders readily available to me.

[squirreljuice]

Originally Posted by Sure Shot Mc Gee

What powder to use? Depends on whether spring or gas operated?

The MechTech is a spring recoil assembly.

[Overkill777]

Power pistol is a great powder but has a lot of flash.

BE86 is a great performer with much less flash.

[Nick_C_S]

I'll definitely be getting a can of HS6 since everyone seems to like it so much.

Well yeah, I like it and think it could serve you well. . . with some reservations.

I have used a lot of HS-6 over the years. It has some distinct positive attributes that should do well for you.

First, it likes heavy bullets. It seems to burn most clean and consistent when it has to push heavies.

Second, it is forgiving. Its low energy content lends itself to novice loaders. When it's underloaded, it runs very dirty. It cleans up as you move up in the charge weight - further telegraphing how it's doing. As you get into overcharge territory, it'll let you know with the usual signs, but does so relatively slowly - pressure curves are rarely sharp as you move up in charge weight. It's an excellent propellant that way; and this is particularly beneficial with the confining 9mm.

Third, it also tends to be abundant and available.

But it's not without its drawbacks:

First, it's not economical. Economy isn't really much of a factor with powder selection, but I feel it is noteworthy in this case. Charge weights are relatively heavy.

Second, it only runs clean when you pump it up. This will likely not be a factor for you because you intend to run 'em on the hot side.

Third, it won't yield maximum velocity. It's a low energy propellant and rarely delivers top velocity. Power Pistol - for instance - runs at about the same burn rate range, but is much more energetic. Power Pistol consistently delivers higher velocities compared to HS-6 with every load work up I've done (lots of calibers). This is the drawback side of HS-6's forgiving characteristic.

Fourth - and this is most noteworthy - HS-6 has given me some feeding problems with 10mm Auto, using 180gn plated and jacketed bullets. Where I had no issues using Power Pistol or AA#7 at similar velocities. I think it may have something to do with its gas production - I'm not sure. That's for people smarter than me. The guns used in this case was Glocks 20 and 29 - out of the box stock. HS-6 is an old propellant. I rather doubt that it was engineered for semi-auto operation.

So that's why I didn't endorse HS-6 in this case. I'll stick with my AA#7 endorsement. It's a little slower than both HS-6 and Power Pistol and will likely yield top velocity in your application. Your application is right in AA#7's wheelhouse - dead center.

[Shotgun Slim]

Nick C S knows his stuff. For me I didn't mind the trouble of sourcing Vihtavouri powders for my application but I'm with Nick on the #7 powder. If it's a more common powder you seek then Accurate's stuff is pretty easy to come by. I have been a fan of #7 for a very long time,loading down until my guns won't run and then up to the limit with no issues and always good accuracy. Please refer to the latest Western Powder loading data for #7 in 9mm. I have an original Accurate manual,very old,which shows starting loads that are WAY higher than the latest maximums listed. The old maximum loads are insane and I would stay away from that risk. Good luck

[Jim Watson]

You sure need current data for Accurate powders. They have sold powders from all over the world under the same designation. I have to wonder how closely a different factory working with different raw materials in different equipment can truly match somebody else's stuff.
Ed Harris did not consider IMR made in Canada to be just the same as IMR made by DuPont in USA.

[Sure Shot Mc Gee]

Spring operated. Fast burning like Bullseye and alike. Pops that bolt back for a quicker cycling speed. And 147gr weight will shoot flatter than either of its two lighter weight siblings. Again small in length barrels heat up fast with repetitive shooting. Be aware there's always a better than average chance of seeing that dreaded {lead streaking} with non-G/checked cast leads.