Side by Side for Defense - Recommendations?

Racingsnake · December 10, 2009, 06:09 PM

I want to buy a side by side shotgun for home defense. I have shot pumps and semi-autos but prefer the simplicity of a double barrel gun.

Which guns would be good for this purpose and represent good value for money?

Racingsnake

TimM · December 10, 2009, 06:40 PM

Stoeger

http://www.stoegerindustries.com/fir...e_triggers.php

or if you are more tactically minded.

http://www.stoegerindustries.com/fir...le_defense.php

Sgt.Fathead · December 10, 2009, 07:33 PM

I just had to sell a Coach Gun that I'd bought used in Maine at the Sanford Cabela's store for about $300 last year. It was the older cowboy action 12 gauge side by side in nickel. It has the double trigger set-up which I really liked for HD as it allowed one the option of one trigger at a time or both at once!

Try and find a double trigger model and you'll have that option, too.

TimM · December 10, 2009, 07:36 PM

I personally do not like double triggers and would never own one... just sayin'.

StuntManMike · December 10, 2009, 08:35 PM

Quote:

I personally do not like double triggers and would never own one... just sayin'.

Fair enough but I am leary of inertia triggers in life and death situations.

Glenn Dee · December 10, 2009, 09:15 PM

Savage/Stevens 311

TimM · December 10, 2009, 10:04 PM

Quote:

Fair enough but I am leary of inertia triggers in life and death situations.

That's a good point. And that is one reason that I would never consider one for HD.

gyvel · December 10, 2009, 10:47 PM

If you can find a Baikal, they are available with single triggers, which are also selective via a very simple push button on the trigger.

If you are looking for an older outside hammer gun, Rossi's are pretty fair.

Just remember: Doubles are neat to look at, are always threatening looking in old cowboy movies and the Beverly Hillbillies, but, in the final analysis, you have two shots only.

TimM · December 11, 2009, 12:35 AM

Quote:

Just remember: Doubles are neat to look at, are always threatening looking in old cowboy movies and the Beverly Hillbillies, but, in the final analysis, you have two shots only.

Doubles aren't Kimber LifeAct pepper spray. You do realize that they are re-loadable right?

Racingsnake · December 11, 2009, 03:45 PM

Thanks guys. Tim that Stoeger looks good. Regarding the Stevens / Savage 311 - didn't the NYPD use them for some time?

SilentHitz · December 11, 2009, 04:10 PM

Quote:

but, in the final analysis, you have two shots only.

After 2 hits with 12 ga. 00 Buck, how much of a target are you gonna have left? LOL...not much.

bigghoss · December 11, 2009, 07:12 PM

Quote:

After 2 hits with 12 ga. 00 Buck, how much of a target are you gonna have left? LOL...not much.

depends on how many targets you started with

USMCGrunt · December 11, 2009, 08:14 PM

Or how many times you missed.

Laz · December 11, 2009, 10:22 PM

I like the coachguns and much prefer the double trigger versions but I am more uncomfortable with their readiness than I am with their capacity. They are empty and have to be loaded, or loaded and cracked open, or loaded and "on-safe". "On-safe", at least on most models, only blocks the triggers so, in my mind, their is some danger of AD. Empty with shells nearby complicates the already low capacity with the possibility of a fumbled loading under pressure. Loaded with hammers down (on a rebounding hammer type) means having to break the gun open to cock it before using. Loaded and cracked open might be the best but like some other methods means the hammers are continually cocked, which is probably not a concern especially on coil-spring models but is not my druthers. I do have a coachgun on the premises, loaded with the internal (rebounding) hammers uncocked. For immediate use I actually prefer a shorter barreled single-shot where I merely have to cock the hammer upon raising the gun. On the whole, I think a good pump, chamber empty, off-safe, full magazine makes the most sense. Pretty easy to chamber a round upon mounting the weapon and the safety is already off. Just my thoughts on it...no expert here.

As a postscript - I like the Stoegers but don't believe they are amenable to loaded, shut, with the hammers down - I believe their firing pins are not rebounding and would protrude. I have a Remington Spartan (Baikal) which works quite well in this mode.

gyvel · December 11, 2009, 10:51 PM

Quote:

Doubles aren't Kimber LifeAct pepper spray. You do realize that they are re-loadable right?

Yes, I know they are reloadable, but, as one of the other posters said, it depends on many you are confronted with. Granted, it would hold a group at bay, since nobody wants to be "first," and, in that case, you are relying on psychological effect.

I would still rather have two or three extra shots in a pump and not have to rely on reloading in a stress situation. The pump has the added advantage that it can be reloaded with a shell in the chamber.

Don't get me wrong; I think doubles are a lot of fun, and I have a few, but you know as well as I that every situation is different.

Glenn Dee · December 12, 2009, 10:09 AM

Yep Racingsnake.

The NYPD probably still uses them. They do have a specific duty though. They are used by detectives in plain clothes. They are easily concealed, and easily taken down for discrete transport. With the proper training they are a very formidable weapon.

PI Rob · December 12, 2009, 03:02 PM

I have a Stoeger 12ga. coach gun and love it. I travel alot in my car for work and it fits nicely in my suitcase when taken down and is great for motel room piece of mind. I can't always stay in nice places so the coach is a great addition to my .38 spl. Stick a butt cuff on it for reloads and you're good to go. For me, the coach gun swings great, points like my finger, and feels like an extention of my arm. They're also tons of fun for busting clays.

Firepower! · December 12, 2009, 03:46 PM

How is this for HD:

Webley & Scott double barrel rifle chambered in 303 British.

Dave McC · December 12, 2009, 11:42 PM

Big city detectives, including B-more's, often carry SxS shotguns as raid guns.

B-more's finest use Savage 311s with short barrels, possibly 311Rs.

However, they have backup right there, and serving warrants is a little different than say, repelling boarders in a home invasion.

gyvel · December 13, 2009, 07:06 AM

Quote:

However, they have backup right there, and serving warrants is a little different than say, repelling boarders in a home invasion.

Or for that matter, repelling boarders off your boat in the Bahamas.

oneounceload · December 13, 2009, 11:16 AM

A double with two triggers gives you an immediate second trigger in case something fails. Single trigger guns with mechanical triggers are also available to alleviate any concerns regarding inertia triggers. My Savage/Fox has a mechanical single trigger. With practice, a double can be quickly loaded. IIRC, Clint Smith or someone similar has a video showing how quickly it can be done

Jkwas · December 15, 2009, 08:25 AM

Quote:

Savage/Stevens 311

Ditto.

Grey · December 15, 2009, 11:20 PM

Personally, I wouldn't like to have a sxs for hd. I would would rather have a nice pump action that takes less time to load, can have more than two rounds in it and does not have to remain chambered and loaded at all times. Accidents do happen. I think a pump action that can hold between 5-7 rounds in the tube is efficient.

vitesse9 · December 16, 2009, 03:55 PM

http://www.blackweaponsarmory.com/ma...ed-loader.html

I have one for my stoeger coach gun supreme and I can say they work as advertised. It is quite simple to shoulder the gun with the speedloader attached to the hand supporting the gun's forearm. reloads take about 1.5 seconds with a little practice (never tried it under the stress of life or death situation, however). Is it as fast as racking the slide again for a third and fourth shot? No. But, it's about as fast as you can get with a double. I think doubles are good choices for home defense as long as you are not dealing with 3 or more attackers. It seems like home-invasions involving multiple attackers are getting more common based on my reading of the local news.

However, you have to ask yourself this: if 3 or 4 guys break into your house and you give 2 of them a good course of 00 buck therapy, are the other two going to stick around long enough to test your reload skills? Maybe. In that case, perhaps a 4 shot, 6 shot, or 8 shot repeater would have been a better choice.

I think a coach gun with a handgun for back would be a good choice. Even though I usually keep repeating shotgun in my room, I still have a handgun gun. Why? Any gun can fail. better to grab another gun than to try to clear a jam or whatever. Plus, in a home invasion, I can arm my wife with the handgun if need be.

rickyjames · December 16, 2009, 04:51 PM

if you use a double barrel coach gun do you keep it loaded or a couple of shells near by? mine has a safety yet i feel better with a loaded pump and nothing in the chamber. just sayin.

December 10, 2009, 06:09 PM	#1
Racingsnake Senior Member Join Date: November 5, 2008 Posts: 153	Side by Side for Defense - Recommendations? I want to buy a side by side shotgun for home defense. I have shot pumps and semi-autos but prefer the simplicity of a double barrel gun. Which guns would be good for this purpose and represent good value for money? Racingsnake

December 11, 2009, 10:22 PM	#14
Laz Senior Member Join Date: November 12, 1999 Posts: 1,278	I like the coachguns and much prefer the double trigger versions but I am more uncomfortable with their readiness than I am with their capacity. They are empty and have to be loaded, or loaded and cracked open, or loaded and "on-safe". "On-safe", at least on most models, only blocks the triggers so, in my mind, their is some danger of AD. Empty with shells nearby complicates the already low capacity with the possibility of a fumbled loading under pressure. Loaded with hammers down (on a rebounding hammer type) means having to break the gun open to cock it before using. Loaded and cracked open might be the best but like some other methods means the hammers are continually cocked, which is probably not a concern especially on coil-spring models but is not my druthers. I do have a coachgun on the premises, loaded with the internal (rebounding) hammers uncocked. For immediate use I actually prefer a shorter barreled single-shot where I merely have to cock the hammer upon raising the gun. On the whole, I think a good pump, chamber empty, off-safe, full magazine makes the most sense. Pretty easy to chamber a round upon mounting the weapon and the safety is already off. Just my thoughts on it...no expert here. As a postscript - I like the Stoegers but don't believe they are amenable to loaded, shut, with the hammers down - I believe their firing pins are not rebounding and would protrude. I have a Remington Spartan (Baikal) which works quite well in this mode. __________________ Laz I’m just a nobody, trying to tell everybody, about Somebody, who can save anybody.

December 16, 2009, 03:55 PM	#24
vitesse9 Senior Member Join Date: November 9, 2004 Posts: 340	This Helps with the Ammo Capacity Problem http://www.blackweaponsarmory.com/ma...ed-loader.html I have one for my stoeger coach gun supreme and I can say they work as advertised. It is quite simple to shoulder the gun with the speedloader attached to the hand supporting the gun's forearm. reloads take about 1.5 seconds with a little practice (never tried it under the stress of life or death situation, however). Is it as fast as racking the slide again for a third and fourth shot? No. But, it's about as fast as you can get with a double. I think doubles are good choices for home defense as long as you are not dealing with 3 or more attackers. It seems like home-invasions involving multiple attackers are getting more common based on my reading of the local news. However, you have to ask yourself this: if 3 or 4 guys break into your house and you give 2 of them a good course of 00 buck therapy, are the other two going to stick around long enough to test your reload skills? Maybe. In that case, perhaps a 4 shot, 6 shot, or 8 shot repeater would have been a better choice. I think a coach gun with a handgun for back would be a good choice. Even though I usually keep repeating shotgun in my room, I still have a handgun gun. Why? Any gun can fail. better to grab another gun than to try to clear a jam or whatever. Plus, in a home invasion, I can arm my wife with the handgun if need be.

December 10, 2009, 06:40 PM	#2
TimM Member Join Date: October 5, 2009 Location: Colorado Posts: 76	Stoeger http://www.stoegerindustries.com/fir...e_triggers.php or if you are more tactically minded. http://www.stoegerindustries.com/fir...le_defense.php

December 10, 2009, 07:33 PM	#3
Sgt.Fathead Junior member Join Date: March 3, 2007 Location: Dallas, TX Posts: 1,637	I just had to sell a Coach Gun that I'd bought used in Maine at the Sanford Cabela's store for about $300 last year. It was the older cowboy action 12 gauge side by side in nickel. It has the double trigger set-up which I really liked for HD as it allowed one the option of one trigger at a time or both at once! Try and find a double trigger model and you'll have that option, too.

December 10, 2009, 07:36 PM	#4
TimM Member Join Date: October 5, 2009 Location: Colorado Posts: 76	I personally do not like double triggers and would never own one... just sayin'.

December 10, 2009, 09:15 PM	#6
Glenn Dee Senior Member Join Date: September 9, 2009 Location: South Florida Posts: 1,560	Savage/Stevens 311

December 10, 2009, 10:47 PM	#8
gyvel Senior Member Join Date: August 30, 2009 Location: Northern AZ Posts: 7,172	If you can find a Baikal, they are available with single triggers, which are also selective via a very simple push button on the trigger. If you are looking for an older outside hammer gun, Rossi's are pretty fair. Just remember: Doubles are neat to look at, are always threatening looking in old cowboy movies and the Beverly Hillbillies, but, in the final analysis, you have two shots only.

December 11, 2009, 03:45 PM	#10
Racingsnake Senior Member Join Date: November 5, 2008 Posts: 153	Thanks guys. Tim that Stoeger looks good. Regarding the Stevens / Savage 311 - didn't the NYPD use them for some time?

December 11, 2009, 08:14 PM	#13
USMCGrunt Senior Member Join Date: February 27, 2000 Location: Somewhere in 14T NT Posts: 730	Or how many times you missed.

December 12, 2009, 10:09 AM	#16
Glenn Dee Senior Member Join Date: September 9, 2009 Location: South Florida Posts: 1,560	Yep Racingsnake. The NYPD probably still uses them. They do have a specific duty though. They are used by detectives in plain clothes. They are easily concealed, and easily taken down for discrete transport. With the proper training they are a very formidable weapon.

December 12, 2009, 03:02 PM	#17
PI Rob Member Join Date: August 16, 2004 Location: Dallas,Tx Posts: 52	I have a Stoeger 12ga. coach gun and love it. I travel alot in my car for work and it fits nicely in my suitcase when taken down and is great for motel room piece of mind. I can't always stay in nice places so the coach is a great addition to my .38 spl. Stick a butt cuff on it for reloads and you're good to go. For me, the coach gun swings great, points like my finger, and feels like an extention of my arm. They're also tons of fun for busting clays.

December 12, 2009, 03:46 PM	#18
Firepower! Senior Member Join Date: February 3, 2008 Posts: 2,109	How is this for HD: Webley & Scott double barrel rifle chambered in 303 British.

December 12, 2009, 11:42 PM	#19
Dave McC Staff In Memoriam Join Date: October 13, 1999 Location: Columbia, Md, USA Posts: 8,811	Big city detectives, including B-more's, often carry SxS shotguns as raid guns. B-more's finest use Savage 311s with short barrels, possibly 311Rs. However, they have backup right there, and serving warrants is a little different than say, repelling boarders in a home invasion.

December 13, 2009, 11:16 AM	#21
oneounceload Junior member Join Date: April 18, 2008 Location: N. Central Florida Posts: 8,518	A double with two triggers gives you an immediate second trigger in case something fails. Single trigger guns with mechanical triggers are also available to alleviate any concerns regarding inertia triggers. My Savage/Fox has a mechanical single trigger. With practice, a double can be quickly loaded. IIRC, Clint Smith or someone similar has a video showing how quickly it can be done

December 15, 2009, 11:20 PM	#23
Grey Junior Member Join Date: December 12, 2009 Posts: 7	Personally, I wouldn't like to have a sxs for hd. I would would rather have a nice pump action that takes less time to load, can have more than two rounds in it and does not have to remain chambered and loaded at all times. Accidents do happen. I think a pump action that can hold between 5-7 rounds in the tube is efficient.

December 16, 2009, 04:51 PM	#25
rickyjames Senior Member Join Date: July 5, 2009 Posts: 558	if you use a double barrel coach gun do you keep it loaded or a couple of shells near by? mine has a safety yet i feel better with a loaded pump and nothing in the chamber. just sayin.