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Old October 8, 2011, 11:37 PM   #1
deepcore
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Help remembering/finding case length tool

My Savage F12 (.223) chamber dimensions are bigger than my Wilson case gauge. So when I neck size only my brass doesn't go all the way into the Wilson gauge but does chamber in my F12 with no problem.

Being unable to use the Wilson gauge to quickly take a peek at the case length (also) I need a quick look tool to do that when I'm neck sizing only.

I seem to remember a gauge/tool the looked like a big/wide metal ruler that had cut outs along the edge for various case/calibers. You'd see if you case would fit in it's specific slot... If not, trim. But i forgot who makes this tool/gauge (if there was one to begin with).

Would appreciate it if someone does remember what I'm talking about.
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Old October 8, 2011, 11:47 PM   #2
dmazur
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I believe you're OK continuing to use the Wilson gauge, provided the neck-sized case is simply longer from the shoulder reference to the base.

The critical dimension is from the shoulder reference to the lands. If your case neck fits and the neck has grown so it sticks out of the Wilson gauge, it needs to be trimmed.

On the other hand, if the neck just won't fit the Wilson "tight end", then that's another problem. One solution might be to drill out the tight end a few thousandths. (Make sure no burrs are created at the shoulder area...)

Then it should work as a case length gauge.

And, unless your rifle has excessive headspace, it should also continue to work as a cartridge headspace gauge, for cases you have full-length resized as well as neck sized. I don't think the diameter of the "tight end" of the gauge is critical.

However, if you really want the tool you described, I think this might be it -

Lyman case length gauge
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Old October 9, 2011, 12:40 AM   #3
deepcore
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Thanks!
Yes that is it. I tried using the search function on Midway but got 50 pages of what i wasn't looking for.
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Old October 9, 2011, 12:53 AM   #4
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Hello, deepcore. If your going to be handloading and working around firearms..why don't you do yourself a favor and buy a dial or dig. caliper?
A good quality 0-1" micrometer as well?
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Old October 9, 2011, 08:42 AM   #5
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deepcore, I don't know the source of your brass. But I find on the 223 Wilson gage, most of the hang up is burrs on the head of the case. So before I check one in the gage, I insert it head first into the gage. If it doesn't go that way, I know I am not going to get an accurate reading.

The Wilson gage (directions attached) is specifically cut to allow fired brass to be used in it for headspace measurement. Brass fired in my AR's fits just fine. So you might check the head of the brass that isn't going in just to check.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf Wilson Cartridge Case Gage.pdf (430.6 KB, 17 views)

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Old October 9, 2011, 09:19 AM   #6
Sport45
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Sounds like you may need one of these from Midway.

Forster Headspace No-Go Gage 223 Remington

If you have excessive headspace, I think it best to take care of that first.
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Old October 9, 2011, 09:28 AM   #7
Jim243
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Quote:
So when I neck size only my brass doesn't go all the way into the Wilson gauge but does chamber in my F12 with no problem.
Deepcore, that is strange, unless your Willson gauge is off (anything is possible) you are telling us the headspace on your F12 is off. The gauge measures headspace from the shoulder of the case to where your bolt should close. You need to turn your resizing or collet die down so that the shoulder will be bumped down. If your cases are fitting the rifle without a hard bolt close, I would take the rifle in to have it's headspace checked with go/no go gauges it might need adjustment or that the throat has been burned out and needs a barrel replacement.

As far as case lenght the Lyman case lenght tool will do the job, but not check for headspace.

Jim



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Old October 9, 2011, 09:41 AM   #8
deepcore
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Quote:
Ideal Tool Hello, deepcore. If your going to be handloading and working around firearms..why don't you do yourself a favor and buy a dial or dig. caliper?
A good quality 0-1" micrometer as well?

I have three calipers one set up for use with a Hornady OAL gauge, a second set for with a Hornady Headspace gauge, and a third plain for general measurement use. And I have a micrometer. All off them digital.

My original post was for help finding/remembering the Lyman EZ Case Length tool.

I can use my calipers I know....the fact that last night I couldn't remember the Lyman EZ bugged me.
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Old October 9, 2011, 10:04 AM   #9
deepcore
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Deepcore, that is strange, unless your Willson gauge is off (anything is possible) you are telling us the headspace on your F12 is off.
I believe I've read somewhere on another thread that it is possible for a chamber to be fine but still fail the Wilson gauge. Something about the Wilson set to make sure your round will fit not matter what, that it's dimensions are set on the small side.

Caliper-Hornady Headspace Gauge measurements of my headspace (don't have me on now, not home) post-fired reference cases I can put up later.
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Old October 9, 2011, 10:13 AM   #10
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This is what you need to measure exactly what is going on with YOUR rifle and YOUR chamber.

http://www.hornady.com/store/Headspace-Gauge-Kits/
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Old October 9, 2011, 10:39 AM   #11
deepcore
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steve4102 This is what you need to measure exactly what is going on with YOUR rifle and YOUR chamber.

http://www.hornady.com/store/Headspace-Gauge-Kits/
I mentioned I have this tool. I was just asking help to remember the Lyman EZ Case Length tool.
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Old October 9, 2011, 01:49 PM   #12
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Something about the Wilson set to make sure your round will fit not matter what, that it's dimensions are set on the small side.
Actually, except for the base to shoulder datum, the Wilson gauge is on the generous side, so that the case doesn't hit anywhere except at the shoulder.

It isn't large in all dimensions, so a nick on the case head can make the head too large to drop in, giving the appearance of a case that is too long to datum when it may not be.

While I haven't experienced it, I suppose the case neck could also bind, preventing the case from dropping in.

Is the "cartridge headspace" too large in this problem? Or is it the neck that's too big? (Just curious...)
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Old October 9, 2011, 03:19 PM   #13
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I recently bought one of those Lyman case length measuring 'thingies', though my calipers worked just fine for years. What I found, to my disappointment, was that neither the 260 Remington or the 220 Swift was listed on the Lyman device. Maybe I got crosseyed and missed seeing them, so I'll recheck (for the 3rd or 4th time). I can forgive them for leaving the 260 off, but to leave the 220 Swift off is just flat unforgivable. Geez.
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Old October 9, 2011, 05:42 PM   #14
deepcore
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Quote:
Actually, except for the base to shoulder datum, the Wilson gauge is on the generous side, so that the case doesn't hit anywhere except at the shoulder.
So with the Wilson Gauge you should still be able to get the case in even after multiple firings/case expansions near(er) the case base(and only neck sizing)?
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Old October 9, 2011, 06:42 PM   #15
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I just use my calipers. I lock it to the max length. If case does not go through it goes to the I will trim it later can. (4 one gal freezer bags full)

I shoot .223 and have so much already prepped FL sized brass I just load those, tnen neck size till they need to be trimmed. If I feel that the bolt is giving resitance after firing I just put those cases in the scrap brass bucket. I have too much of it as it is.
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Old October 9, 2011, 11:22 PM   #16
dmazur
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Quote:
So with the Wilson Gauge you should still be able to get the case in even after multiple firings/case expansions near(er) the case base(and only neck sizing)?
The Wilson gauge instructions include a section on

"Setting up full length resizing based off fired cases LE Wilson Preferred Method:"

so I'd say that they expect fired cases to fit. However, if you have a chamber with oversized diameter, either near the head or neck end of the case, it is possible that they won't fit until they are resized.
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Old November 2, 2011, 08:14 PM   #17
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Mc Killen & Heyer Inc. Case Length Gauge

I knew I had got one those gauges in a box of stuff. Mine is not a lyman it is a McKillen & Heyer Inc. about half the size of the lyman, no 223 but it does have the 220 Swift on it, right between 32/40 Win. and 244 Rem- 257 Rob.
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Old November 2, 2011, 09:39 PM   #18
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This isn't a headspace issue. The OP is neck-sizing only and the case walls are not being reduced
in diameter to SAAMI standards. That the neck-sized case won't fit the Wilson gauge is no surprise,
nor does it need to.

If the case fits back into the chamber and the 12F bolt closes, you are Good2Go headspace-wise.

I would, however, get a decent digital caliper if you want to check overall case length.
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