Ans so it begins for Illinois

[USNRet93]

Originally Posted by 44 AMP

I find it astonishing we allow people who make statements like this to hold public office...

yer kidding, right? Silly, wrong, inaccurate, mean, idiotic, forehead slapping stuff comes out of our 'elected officials' on both ends of the spectrum, all the time, all day, everyday...

[USNRet93]

Originally Posted by M88

Scary stuff... there just aren't enough of "us" compared to so many un-informed or misinformed "them", and the demographics don't look favorable for us in the future. That said... I'm not a "sky is falling" kinda guy... just saying it don't look good!

Look at the 'message' on each side. The NRA/etc needs a better message..not the fear based one that will convince not a single person who wants more gun control. Gun owners are losing the messaging battle..

[M88]

Originally Posted by USNRet93

Look at the 'message' on each side. The NRA/etc needs a better message..not the fear based one that will convince not a single person who wants more gun control. Gun owners are losing the messaging battle..

Agree we are losing the PR battle. Obviously the fact that the mainstream media sows misinformation about guns daily doesn't help. I live in a relatively gun-UNfriendly area unless I drive a couple hours. In my world here I'm often asked about gun related issues from those close enough to me that know I'm an avid gun enthusiast and a FEW I trust enough to have even seen my collection. But they are anti-gun for the most part and I agree, "our" message has to change a bit. NOT backing away from the 2d, and if I was King, things would be different. That said, most anti gun folks I run into are NOT swayed by me saying that if we don't do something we as American's will be disarmed, slowly but surely, one little regulation at the time. Their reaction to that, fed my the media, is usually "great, then we'll all be safer". I tactfully try and explain that the opposite would be true. What seems to get the most traction when talking to those types are stories like the woman down in Georgia not long ago. A guy escaped from prison, broke into her home, think he had a knife?... and was going to do God knows what, and she shot him and saved herself. I tell them that in many states she would not have been able to EASILY acquire that gun that may have saved her life, for several reasons. Taxing the gun or it's ammo out of reach for her, waiting periods, permits needed just to be ABLE to buy it etc. I tell them that many of whose laws would have possibly killed her! THAT often makes them stop and think. Another that stops them in their tracks and makes them think about this is explaining that half (not sure of the actual percentage) of America does NOT live where a cop is 4-5 minutes away from a 911 call. On the farm I grew up on, a call to the police would have cop at your door in MAYBE 15 minutes if the cop was in your part of the county. Those are the things that have made some of my anti-gun friends see more of the truth, and start to question some of the laws proposed or already on the books restricting law abiding citizens right to firearms.

[kmw1954]

The anti-gunners don't scare me it's the uninterested and uneducated non gun owners that scare me. They are the one the media and anti-gun sides are out to influence. They are also probably a larger group than both sides of the gun issue.

As was stated, to them it isn't that they want to restrict guns they just don't want people shot and their side of the gun control issue is all in how the question is framed. We all know we can ask the same question 2 different ways and get 2 completely different answers.

Problem comes in the fact that right now the media and gun control groups are speaking louder than we are. They are more vocal and it is their voice that is being heard by the non gun owners. Including the blatant lies and false statistics.

[Mike38]

Look at the 'message' on each side. The NRA/etc needs a better message..not the fear based one that will convince not a single person who wants more gun control. Gun owners are losing the messaging battle..

I have to agree with that. The NRA needs to tone down the rhetoric and ramp up facts. Every time I open my American Rifleman, it reads like the world is coming to an end. I'm sure, neutral non gun owners see that, and wonder just what kinds of loons are running the NRA. Present undeniable, indisputable facts, and they will get farther in my opinion.

[sigarms228]

Yeah this new law is really bad deal for illinois gun stores and FFL. I don't know where the ridiculous low dollar amount comes from needed for a gun store/FFL to become compliant with new rules but working in onsite IT support before I retired I can say that such video system and electronic inventory could easily run well into 5 figures for such with ongoing costs for support, licenses, and maintenance. The backup system alone to be compliant are very expensive to be done right.

IMO this is largely all about payback for Chicago being ordered by the court to allow gun stores in the city limits and to harass out of business the dozen or so near suburban gun stores, including Chucks and Midwest, that Chicago politicians keep blaming for the gun violence problem while Crook County has a pathetic record of prosecuting violent thugs.

https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/20...ustice-system/ --- Crime Under Illinois’ “Catch and Release” Justice System

I can't see anyone wanting to open a gun store in Chicago if all this is allowed to happen. Kitchen table FFLs will most likely disappear as will small family owned and operated gun stores. I was going to put a few firearms on consignment and small LGS but I am concerned about doing that now in case they closed up while they had my firearms. Very sad times for Illinois.

[CedarGrove357]

In my own singular way, I will stand and resist this environment. Even the GCA of 1994 was repealed 10 years later. Politicians fall and die like everyone else. Laws can be eliminated or reversed. I just renewed my FFL. Good news is I owe nothing in my shop which couldn't be fixed with a bankruptcy. Building owned, guns paid with cash up front, utilities incorporated into my own. I understand the retailers who have mortgages, rents, lines of credit and other business bills which force them to make so much profit to keep the doors open. These abusive policies are abysmal.

[CedarGrove357]

I was going to put a few firearms on consignment and small LGS but I am concerned about doing that now in case they closed up while they had my firearms. Very sad times for Illinois.

Sigarms228, they would have to distribute consignments back to the original owners before they closed their doors. Therefore you would not lose your guns; however, the rules of consignments, whether or not the place closes, is that in order for you to get your own gun back, you must submit a 4473 and I believe that is federal too. either way they got your serial number on a form forever and tied to your name.

[CedarGrove357]

As one being subject to the new implementations, Some have indicated the $1500 is for the upgrades in security, et al. Nope. The upgrades are on the retailers own dime, and the $1500 is the FEE for the Illinois FFL "Certificate" which must be purchased in order to practice retail shenanigunnery within this state. If you are not a retailer, but have an FFL, you still have to pay $300 for your shenanigunnery PLUS do all the upgrades et al to the location of the FFL. This is one reason why the tabletop shenanigunners are expected to fold. So, once a retailer doles out the expense for upgrading their store [which frankly should already be implemented if you are already an established retailer and, imho, are not really different from whats in a pawn broker store.] In addition to that, retailers are also expected to go full electronic implementation of background checks etc, which means computers, internet, and other supporting infrastructure to implement. No more paper 4473's in the long term for illinois.

[ammo.crafter]

So now Blumberg and Soros have purchased Illinois.
Their endless wealth has been under estimated to our detriment.
All should bear in mind the Founders’ intent of the Second Amendment…to protect citizens from a tyrannical government.

[sigarms228]

Originally Posted by CedarGrove357

Sigarms228, they would have to distribute consignments back to the original owners before they closed their doors. Therefore you would not lose your guns; however, the rules of consignments, whether or not the place closes, is that in order for you to get your own gun back, you must submit a 4473 and I believe that is federal too. either way they got your serial number on a form forever and tied to your name.

Good info, thanks!