.32 S&W "Short" for solid frames

TruthTellers · February 20, 2021, 05:21 AM

Been thinking about getting a solid frame .32 H&R for a long time and with Spring a few weeks away, I'm thinking about buying one and loading up some ammo. Given that I'm not sure whether it will be chambered for .32 S&W or .32 S&W L., I have to accept that it may be .32 Short.

That's fine, I have brass and dies to load it, but if I have to load .32 Short, I'd like to get as much power out of it as I can. I know that with the top breaks we have to keep our loads as weak as possible to prolong their life, but with a solid frame revolver, even an old H&R, how hot can we load the .32 S&W Short to?

Ideally, I'd like to get 700 fps from a 2 to 3 inch barrel with a 95 grain LFN. Is that possible?

ligonierbill · February 20, 2021, 12:28 PM

Well, the only 32 S&W I've shot is a H&R topbreak. As I've reported, I broke the latch on it, and I only shoot black in the repaired gun. Before then, I clocked some Magtech 85 RNFP advertised at 705 at a pretty consistent 701. I could match that with HP-38. What if I went to a 95 gr bullet, as you are considering? First, I would ensure that it isn't too long for that stubby little cylinder. If its OK, you can almost certainly fit enough HP-38 to drive it to 700. Safe? I have no idea. I wouldn't run that in my gun.

And one reason I would not is the availability of excellent 32 S&W Long revolvers like the Colt Police Positive and the S&W Regulation Police. You could easily and safely exceed your goal with that case in those nifty little pistols. Don't know what H&R offered back then, but it was a popular round. Good luck!

TruthTellers · February 20, 2021, 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ligonierbill

Well, the only 32 S&W I've shot is a H&R topbreak. As I've reported, I broke the latch on it, and I only shoot black in the repaired gun. Before then, I clocked some Magtech 85 RNFP advertised at 705 at a pretty consistent 701. I could match that with HP-38. What if I went to a 95 gr bullet, as you are considering? First, I would ensure that it isn't too long for that stubby little cylinder. If its OK, you can almost certainly fit enough HP-38 to drive it to 700. Safe? I have no idea. I wouldn't run that in my gun.

And one reason I would not is the availability of excellent 32 S&W Long revolvers like the Colt Police Positive and the S&W Regulation Police. You could easily and safely exceed your goal with that case in those nifty little pistols. Don't know what H&R offered back then, but it was a popular round. Good luck!

The Police Positive and Regulation Police are larger than what I'm looking at getting.

The only reason I'm looking at using a 95gr bullet instead of a more traditional 77 or 85 grain is it's a very good shooting bullet for me in all the .32's I load it in. I guess if I can only get 650 fps out of it in in a snub H&R American, I could live with that.

TruthTellers · February 22, 2021, 12:14 AM

I guess nobody shoots .32 S&W short in anything except a top break.

5whiskey · February 22, 2021, 07:49 AM

Most* solid frame .32s, even the very old ones, will be chambered for .32s&w long. And a full load of .32 long within industry limits will be safe in them. The older top breaks stuck with the shorts, and for good reason in top breaks.

I actually long for a vintage snub nosed .32 long small enough for pocket carry, but most are a little too large.

**Mike Irwin** · February 22, 2021, 10:43 AM

You can possibly do it...

But doing it safely is another matter. As 5Whiskey mentioned, most of the solid frame guns you're going to find will be chambered in .32 Long.

Those that are chambered in .32 S&W (such as the Iver Johnson "US Revolver Co." guns are almost universally black powder frames that will not do well with the smokeless loads you'll need to get to that velocity with that heavy a bullet.

reddog81 · February 22, 2021, 02:27 PM

I've never seen a solid frame gun in .32 S&W and I can't imagine wanting something smaller than a Police Positive. I've got a Police Positive in .38 S&W and wish it was bigger if anything. The grip frame is about the perfect size for a 10 year old.

Why buy a tiny antiquated gun and then try and hot rod it? It'll be easier to just buy something in .32 S&W Long.

**Mike Irwin** · February 22, 2021, 03:09 PM

"I've never seen a solid frame gun in .32 S&W"

Compared to the break tops they're relatively uncommon and were usually very inexpensive.

The US Revolver Co. guns were apparently Iver Johnson's solution to making a bargain basement gun that would use up the last of its stocks of black powder frame guns.

This one is very similar to the one I have (mine's plated). My Great Grandfather purchased it in the early 1900s when he was the foreman on a track gang for the Pennsylvania Railroad.

**Mike Irwin** · February 22, 2021, 03:12 PM

Hum... I'm finding some information on the web that US Revolver Co. handguns were smokeless powder frames, but didn't have Iver Johnson's safety features (hammer the hammer transfer bar safety).

TruthTellers · February 22, 2021, 04:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mike Irwin

You can possibly do it...

But doing it safely is another matter. As 5Whiskey mentioned, most of the solid frame guns you're going to find will be chambered in .32 Long.

Those that are chambered in .32 S&W (such as the Iver Johnson "US Revolver Co." guns are almost universally black powder frames that will not do well with the smokeless loads you'll need to get to that velocity with that heavy a bullet.

The solid frame H&R I'm looking at acquiring is the Young America and it's a 2nd gen smokeless model.

74A95 · February 22, 2021, 07:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TruthTellers

I guess nobody shoots .32 S&W short in anything except a top break.

I shoot them in my Ruger 327 Fed Mag guns.

TruthTellers · February 23, 2021, 05:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 74A95

I shoot them in my Ruger 327 Fed Mag guns.

Yeah, well, we know how strong those revolvers are.

I'm gonna go out on a limb and state that solid frame .32 S&W short revolvers are equal in strength to .32 S&W Long revolvers and that the reason why .32 S&W Long was never used in .32 S&W revolvers was because it was too long to fit in the cylinder, but it did fit in the .38 S&W models with the larger frame.

TruthTellers · February 25, 2021, 07:01 AM

I found this interesting piece while trying to find out what the penetration depth is for .32 S&W when shot from a .32 S&W revolver and even at roughly 650 fps the .32 S&W's 88 grain bullets are capable of doing 14 to 18 inches of penetration in ballistic gel and the bullets all go straight, they don't do curls like .22 bullets do.

That's pretty impressive and practically the same as what .32 S&W Long does but from larger and heavier revolvers. So, knowing this now, I see no reason to push the .32 S&W beyond a max charge.

Here's the link to the article:

https://www.guns.com/news/review/gun...m_medium=cl_NA

ligonierbill · February 25, 2021, 08:13 AM

Well, McKinley was assassinated with a 32 S&W (an Iver Johnson revolver), although it was probably his doctors who did him in.

February 20, 2021, 05:21 AM	#1
TruthTellers Senior Member Join Date: October 22, 2016 Posts: 3,883	.32 S&W "Short" for solid frames Been thinking about getting a solid frame .32 H&R for a long time and with Spring a few weeks away, I'm thinking about buying one and loading up some ammo. Given that I'm not sure whether it will be chambered for .32 S&W or .32 S&W L., I have to accept that it may be .32 Short. That's fine, I have brass and dies to load it, but if I have to load .32 Short, I'd like to get as much power out of it as I can. I know that with the top breaks we have to keep our loads as weak as possible to prolong their life, but with a solid frame revolver, even an old H&R, how hot can we load the .32 S&W Short to? Ideally, I'd like to get 700 fps from a 2 to 3 inch barrel with a 95 grain LFN. Is that possible? __________________ "We always think there's gonna be more time... then it runs out."

February 22, 2021, 12:14 AM	#4
TruthTellers Senior Member Join Date: October 22, 2016 Posts: 3,883	I guess nobody shoots .32 S&W short in anything except a top break. __________________ "We always think there's gonna be more time... then it runs out."

February 22, 2021, 07:49 AM	#5
5whiskey Senior Member Join Date: October 23, 2005 Location: US Posts: 3,652	Most* solid frame .32s, even the very old ones, will be chambered for .32s&w long. And a full load of .32 long within industry limits will be safe in them. The older top breaks stuck with the shorts, and for good reason in top breaks. I actually long for a vintage snub nosed .32 long small enough for pocket carry, but most are a little too large. __________________ Support the NRA-ILA Auction, ends 03/09/2018 https://thefiringline.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=593946

February 22, 2021, 10:43 AM	#6
Mike Irwin Staff Join Date: April 13, 2000 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 41,381	You can possibly do it... But doing it safely is another matter. As 5Whiskey mentioned, most of the solid frame guns you're going to find will be chambered in .32 Long. Those that are chambered in .32 S&W (such as the Iver Johnson "US Revolver Co." guns are almost universally black powder frames that will not do well with the smokeless loads you'll need to get to that velocity with that heavy a bullet. __________________ "The gift which I am sending you is called a dog, and is in fact the most precious and valuable possession of mankind" -Theodorus Gaza Baby Jesus cries when the fat redneck doesn't have military-grade firepower.

February 22, 2021, 03:09 PM	#8
Mike Irwin Staff Join Date: April 13, 2000 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 41,381	"I've never seen a solid frame gun in .32 S&W" Compared to the break tops they're relatively uncommon and were usually very inexpensive. The US Revolver Co. guns were apparently Iver Johnson's solution to making a bargain basement gun that would use up the last of its stocks of black powder frame guns. This one is very similar to the one I have (mine's plated). My Great Grandfather purchased it in the early 1900s when he was the foreman on a track gang for the Pennsylvania Railroad. __________________ "The gift which I am sending you is called a dog, and is in fact the most precious and valuable possession of mankind" -Theodorus Gaza Baby Jesus cries when the fat redneck doesn't have military-grade firepower.

February 20, 2021, 12:28 PM	#2
ligonierbill Senior Member Join Date: May 20, 2007 Posts: 2,448	Well, the only 32 S&W I've shot is a H&R topbreak. As I've reported, I broke the latch on it, and I only shoot black in the repaired gun. Before then, I clocked some Magtech 85 RNFP advertised at 705 at a pretty consistent 701. I could match that with HP-38. What if I went to a 95 gr bullet, as you are considering? First, I would ensure that it isn't too long for that stubby little cylinder. If its OK, you can almost certainly fit enough HP-38 to drive it to 700. Safe? I have no idea. I wouldn't run that in my gun. And one reason I would not is the availability of excellent 32 S&W Long revolvers like the Colt Police Positive and the S&W Regulation Police. You could easily and safely exceed your goal with that case in those nifty little pistols. Don't know what H&R offered back then, but it was a popular round. Good luck!

February 22, 2021, 02:27 PM	#7
reddog81 Senior Member Join Date: October 16, 2014 Location: Iowa Posts: 1,634	I've never seen a solid frame gun in .32 S&W and I can't imagine wanting something smaller than a Police Positive. I've got a Police Positive in .38 S&W and wish it was bigger if anything. The grip frame is about the perfect size for a 10 year old. Why buy a tiny antiquated gun and then try and hot rod it? It'll be easier to just buy something in .32 S&W Long.

February 22, 2021, 03:12 PM	#9
Mike Irwin Staff Join Date: April 13, 2000 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 41,381	Hum... I'm finding some information on the web that US Revolver Co. handguns were smokeless powder frames, but didn't have Iver Johnson's safety features (hammer the hammer transfer bar safety). __________________ "The gift which I am sending you is called a dog, and is in fact the most precious and valuable possession of mankind" -Theodorus Gaza Baby Jesus cries when the fat redneck doesn't have military-grade firepower.

February 25, 2021, 07:01 AM	#13
TruthTellers Senior Member Join Date: October 22, 2016 Posts: 3,883	I found this interesting piece while trying to find out what the penetration depth is for .32 S&W when shot from a .32 S&W revolver and even at roughly 650 fps the .32 S&W's 88 grain bullets are capable of doing 14 to 18 inches of penetration in ballistic gel and the bullets all go straight, they don't do curls like .22 bullets do. That's pretty impressive and practically the same as what .32 S&W Long does but from larger and heavier revolvers. So, knowing this now, I see no reason to push the .32 S&W beyond a max charge. Here's the link to the article: https://www.guns.com/news/review/gun...m_medium=cl_NA __________________ "We always think there's gonna be more time... then it runs out."

February 25, 2021, 08:13 AM	#14
ligonierbill Senior Member Join Date: May 20, 2007 Posts: 2,448	Well, McKinley was assassinated with a 32 S&W (an Iver Johnson revolver), although it was probably his doctors who did him in.