Deciding on a .22LR semi auto ... Walther, Bersa, Ruger - Page 3

guitar1580 · February 11, 2020, 01:17 PM

Hey, thanks for all of your help, folks. Lots of good info, and I did take everything into account, and have been burning the midnight oil the last couple of nights looking up different models, reading reviews, watching YT videos, etc ... and yes, as mentioned, I'm looking at the smaller models at this point.

I also got out to a couple of dealers yesterday to check some out, and talked to one guy who has several of the compact models that we mentioned in this thread. Like most of the reviews, he likes them all, and said he couldn't think of anything negative, or a model to "stay away from".

So I've decided on the S&W M&P .22 Compact, and a Thunder Beast .22 Takedown can. I've always been mostly a S&W enthusiast anyway, although my guns are older, and revolvers. I like the ergonomics, feel, weight, and sights on the S&W, and I think this will be a good combo to start with. Later, I'll likely get one of the heavier & longer barreled Victory, Ruger, or Buckmark models, and can see myself at some point getting one of those Phoenix Arms plinkers. Those look pretty cool for the price.

Thanks again. Will update.

Bill DeShivs · February 11, 2020, 01:47 PM

Zamak IS a zinc alloy! Z (zinc) A (aluminum)

Forte S+W · February 11, 2020, 04:16 PM

Quote:

Zamak IS a zinc alloy! Z (zinc) A (aluminum)

Yep, it's actually an acronym...

Zinc
Alumininum
Magnesium
And
Kupfer (German for Copper),

Which makes up the composition of the alloy in order of percentages. However, one misconception is that ZAMAK is the same molten scrap metal that the old Ring of Fire companies were using back in the day. It isn't, it's an industry standard alloy used in a wide range of applications which most folks who bash it aren't even aware of is present in everything from the razor they shave with in the morning to the vehicle they drive. The stuff the Ring of Fire companies were using was quite literally scrap metal which was brittle due to impurities in its composition. ZAMAK on the other hand can is actually quite durable, but often requires quite a bit of thickness to it to withstand the pressures of centerfire cartridges, hence why the slides on Hi-Points are so massive. Rimfire firearms can still be made to ordinary thicknesses though because .22LR and even .22WMR just don't have very high peak operating pressure, nor do they generate much recoil force, ergo many firearms manufactures make use of it to produce inexpensive rimfire pistols and rifles.

guitar1580 · February 11, 2020, 04:20 PM

I don't really have to be concerned with the Zamak since I'm getting the S&W, which has an aluminum slide. I wouldn't really be concerned anyway if I'd decide to get a Walther. As mentioned above, there have been no known failures. I'd be more concerned if it were a larger caliber, but with a .22, not so much.

There are different variations of Zamak alloys, but yes, it does contain 4% aluminum, along with zinc, magnesium, and copper.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zamak

JT

Forte S+W · February 11, 2020, 04:48 PM

It really is rather remarkable just how much of a difference adding a small percentage of other metals to an alloy can make.

Like the Scandium Alloy that Smith & Wesson uses for their revolver frames, it's actually mostly Aluminum, with something like 3%-5% Scandium in the mix, but that little percentage makes it substantially stronger.

stuckinthe60s · February 11, 2020, 05:14 PM

high standard 102 or 103 series tournament, citation or trophy.
get one and youll be set for life.
best 22 for the money EVER made.

smee78 · February 11, 2020, 05:49 PM

I have the Ruger 22/45 and it makes a great host gun and eats everything. Ialso see the new guns are even easy to take down and clean. I am currently looking at the new Keltec P17 to add as a host gun.

When I worked part time at a gun store a few years ago we sold a lot of the Ruger SR22 and the S&W M&P 22 guns so those are worth a look also.

guitar1580 · February 12, 2020, 08:59 PM

It's official. I ordered the S&W M&P .22 Compact and the TBAC .22 Takedown. Now the wait begins. Thanks to everyone for the comments and suggestions.

Adventurer 2 · February 13, 2020, 01:07 PM

Just my opinions - the suppressor adapter has to be removed before you can remove the slide - I recommend soaking the suppressor adapter overnight in liquid wrench before trying to remove it. As I said I broke the included take down wrench my first attempt at removing the nut. Had to place my S&W M&P 22 compact in a vise for round two. Remember this - right tighten left loosen if you get to this point. I felt like that adapter was red thread locked. I’m not familiar with your suppressor. If it screws apart like mine I also recommend putting anti-seize on the screw threads before firing as 22 or runs dirty and the crud will make suppressor disassemblly difficult if you don’t use anti-seize.

guitar1580 · February 13, 2020, 01:59 PM

Thanks Adventurer2, I did take that into account, and looked up some info on it. Here's how I handled it.

I ordered the "non suppressor ready" model, for less $$. Then I ordered a better adapter from Hughes Precision for $20.

I had found a YT vid that talks about the lack of an undercut on the last thread on the factory adapter, and how it can cause some suppressors to not seat properly. The hughes does have the undercut, and a nice fluted thread protector.

I'll post that video a little later if I can find it again.

riffraff · February 13, 2020, 08:47 PM

I own 2 SR22s, long and short slides, and bumped the mags all up to 17 w/ the aftermarket kits, they are great, and the M&P is nice too (better trigger, but worse controls and mag capacity)... the new kel tec in .22 looks fun too. Maybe one of both in my future.. and the kel tec pmr30 looks really cool too (in 22wmr)..

But the point of a surpressed .22lr escapes me. I mean at the range ears are no problem, occasionall shooting with this caliber simply isn't that painful (if you were hunting or defending yourself somehow).. just no need for it if you ask me, especially not worth it gven the red tape required anyway.

GarandTd · February 13, 2020, 10:08 PM

There is a mag capacity upgrade kit for the m&p 22c that increases capacity to 14 rounds. I don't have it and don't know if it's reliable or not, but it's available.

I don't like the backward safety of the Ruger SR22. It's opposite of all my safety equiped handguns. Otherwise, it seems like a fine pistol.

guitar1580 · February 13, 2020, 11:15 PM

@GarandTd, yep, the backward safety on the SR22 is the main thing that steered me away from it.

@riffraff, I have tinnitus and other ear conditions from playing in a loud rock band for 20 years. Even with plugs and muffs, it will get flared up after a certain amount of shooting, because your bones will conduct sound and it will still get to your eardrums. The suppressor will allow me to shoot more and for longer. Plus, there are areas near me in the woods where I can plink around, and the suppressor will help keep the neighbors from calling the cops. And, if I need to dispense of errant animals in my back garden, I can do so without the neighbors calling the cops. (although my rifle and CB caps currently work pretty well for that) Every person's situation is different, and the suppressor will be worth every penny & every bit of red tape to me. May end up with one for a .45 at some point. It's only money, and ya can't take it with ya.

I'll likely get a couple other .22 models, like the more accurate longer barreled Victory, or one of the Rugers or the Buckmark, and use the same suppressor.

guitar1580 · February 14, 2020, 01:10 AM

Here is Auger Precision Firearms' video that I was talking about. It wouldn't really matter for the can I'm getting, but it is interesting info to know about the thread adapters.

The other good thing about the Hughes adapter that I ordered is it accepts a standard open end wrench, 7/16" I believe, eliminating the need for the thin factory pot metal wrench.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CUjYYCq2jiQ

The M&P Compact i ordered won't have an adapter, but I suppose the thread protector itself will be a bitch to get loose. If so, I plan on soaking it in my favorite penetrant, Kroil, overnight. It has worked wonders on everything I've used it on.

riffraff · February 14, 2020, 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GarandTd

There is a mag capacity upgrade kit for the m&p 22c that increases capacity to 14 rounds. I don't have it and don't know if it's reliable or not, but it's available.

I don't like the backward safety of the Ruger SR22. It's opposite of all my safety equiped handguns. Otherwise, it seems like a fine pistol.

The SR22 safety thing is backwards but functions as a decocker just like a DA/SA Sig, so for me is like other pistols. I do not typically use the safety on my SR22s other than to decock, in DA mode the trigger is inherently safe IMHO... at least for normal use where I employ a good holster on my hip, I do not feel the need to ever safety an SR22.

wild cat mccane · February 16, 2020, 06:29 PM

As an aside, I've met few Zamak bashers online who knew the extent of what metal alloys include.

Steel is an allow of carbon and iron after all...

Jim Watson · February 17, 2020, 03:51 PM

What does it allow?

wild cat mccane · February 17, 2020, 09:54 PM

hahah.

Alloy.

Stainless steel and carbon steel (ss and blue) guns are also alloy metals.

Jim Watson · February 18, 2020, 08:50 AM

I know. Your spell check probably bit you again. There are funny statements about metals on the www.

Ibmikey · February 20, 2020, 08:57 AM

Well Guitar, I was going to jump into the middle of this pile of recommendations with suggesting the S&W M&P compact would fit you well, however, you have discovered that wisdom by yourself. I keep my compact, extra magazines and two bricks of ammo in a plastic ammo can sealed with a padlock securing everything,

NobodyJones · February 23, 2020, 12:40 AM

And now for something completely different...Look at the Beretta Neos. My wife wanted one and since it was going to be her pistol I bought her one. While it is kind of weird looking it shoots well and is easy to take down and clean.

fl_rich · March 16, 2020, 05:33 PM

I recently on impulse bought a Ruger TX22. Almostv100 rounds with my MysticX silencer and its only coughed a time or two. Usually amo was to blame. Rack, smack bang. Actually rack and bang. Bent nose hollowpoints to blame. Only used Winchester range bucket ammo. 1400 rnds for $55 at Walmart.

The included barrel to can adaptor is what made me pull the trigger... Shoots very quietly in my back yard.

wild cat mccane · March 17, 2020, 03:26 PM

Congrats on the Walther M&P compact.

Post up a pic if you get a chance

bjw741 · March 17, 2020, 06:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wild cat mccane

Congrats on the Walther M&P compact.

Actually the M&P 22 Compact is not a Walther.

Its entirely made at the factory in Springfield, Massachusetts so it really is a Smith & Wesson.

Forte S+W · March 18, 2020, 10:05 AM

Yeah, Walther makes the full-size M&P22.

February 11, 2020, 01:47 PM	#52
Bill DeShivs Senior Member Join Date: April 7, 2006 Posts: 10,986	Zamak IS a zinc alloy! Z (zinc) A (aluminum) __________________ Bill DeShivs, Master Cutler www.billdeshivs.com

February 11, 2020, 04:48 PM	#55
Forte S+W Senior Member Join Date: October 12, 2019 Posts: 819	It really is rather remarkable just how much of a difference adding a small percentage of other metals to an alloy can make. Like the Scandium Alloy that Smith & Wesson uses for their revolver frames, it's actually mostly Aluminum, with something like 3%-5% Scandium in the mix, but that little percentage makes it substantially stronger. __________________ Conspiracy theorists are the greatest political spin-doctors of all time. Only they can make the absolute worst political blunders sound like spectacular feats of ingenuity.

February 11, 2020, 05:14 PM	#56
stuckinthe60s Senior Member Join Date: January 31, 2017 Location: Va., Ct., Mo.. Posts: 878	high standard 102 or 103 series tournament, citation or trophy. get one and youll be set for life. best 22 for the money EVER made. __________________ Retired Military Aviation Former Member Navy Shooting Team Distinguished Pistol Shot,NRA Shotgun/Pistol Instructor NSSA All American, Skeet/Trap Range Owner

February 11, 2020, 05:49 PM	#57
smee78 Senior Member Join Date: July 14, 2008 Location: South Carolina Posts: 2,918	I have the Ruger 22/45 and it makes a great host gun and eats everything. Ialso see the new guns are even easy to take down and clean. I am currently looking at the new Keltec P17 to add as a host gun. When I worked part time at a gun store a few years ago we sold a lot of the Ruger SR22 and the S&W M&P 22 guns so those are worth a look also. __________________ We know exactly where one cow with Mad-cow-disease is located, among the millions and millions of cows in America, but we haven't got a clue where thousands of illegal immigrants and terrorists are

February 13, 2020, 10:08 PM	#62
GarandTd Senior Member Join Date: June 15, 2016 Location: Rural PA Posts: 1,639	There is a mag capacity upgrade kit for the m&p 22c that increases capacity to 14 rounds. I don't have it and don't know if it's reliable or not, but it's available. I don't like the backward safety of the Ruger SR22. It's opposite of all my safety equiped handguns. Otherwise, it seems like a fine pistol. __________________ 22lr, 20 gauge, 8mm Mauser, 35 Remington, 30-06, 5.56x45/223, 9mm, 380acp

February 11, 2020, 01:17 PM	#51
guitar1580 Senior Member Join Date: December 8, 2009 Posts: 201	Hey, thanks for all of your help, folks. Lots of good info, and I did take everything into account, and have been burning the midnight oil the last couple of nights looking up different models, reading reviews, watching YT videos, etc ... and yes, as mentioned, I'm looking at the smaller models at this point. I also got out to a couple of dealers yesterday to check some out, and talked to one guy who has several of the compact models that we mentioned in this thread. Like most of the reviews, he likes them all, and said he couldn't think of anything negative, or a model to "stay away from". So I've decided on the S&W M&P .22 Compact, and a Thunder Beast .22 Takedown can. I've always been mostly a S&W enthusiast anyway, although my guns are older, and revolvers. I like the ergonomics, feel, weight, and sights on the S&W, and I think this will be a good combo to start with. Later, I'll likely get one of the heavier & longer barreled Victory, Ruger, or Buckmark models, and can see myself at some point getting one of those Phoenix Arms plinkers. Those look pretty cool for the price. Thanks again. Will update.

February 11, 2020, 04:20 PM	#54
guitar1580 Senior Member Join Date: December 8, 2009 Posts: 201	I don't really have to be concerned with the Zamak since I'm getting the S&W, which has an aluminum slide. I wouldn't really be concerned anyway if I'd decide to get a Walther. As mentioned above, there have been no known failures. I'd be more concerned if it were a larger caliber, but with a .22, not so much. There are different variations of Zamak alloys, but yes, it does contain 4% aluminum, along with zinc, magnesium, and copper. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zamak JT

February 12, 2020, 08:59 PM	#58
guitar1580 Senior Member Join Date: December 8, 2009 Posts: 201	It's official. I ordered the S&W M&P .22 Compact and the TBAC .22 Takedown. Now the wait begins. Thanks to everyone for the comments and suggestions.

February 13, 2020, 01:07 PM	#59
Adventurer 2 Senior Member Join Date: September 5, 2006 Posts: 663	Just my opinions - the suppressor adapter has to be removed before you can remove the slide - I recommend soaking the suppressor adapter overnight in liquid wrench before trying to remove it. As I said I broke the included take down wrench my first attempt at removing the nut. Had to place my S&W M&P 22 compact in a vise for round two. Remember this - right tighten left loosen if you get to this point. I felt like that adapter was red thread locked. I’m not familiar with your suppressor. If it screws apart like mine I also recommend putting anti-seize on the screw threads before firing as 22 or runs dirty and the crud will make suppressor disassemblly difficult if you don’t use anti-seize.

February 13, 2020, 01:59 PM	#60
guitar1580 Senior Member Join Date: December 8, 2009 Posts: 201	Thanks Adventurer2, I did take that into account, and looked up some info on it. Here's how I handled it. I ordered the "non suppressor ready" model, for less $$. Then I ordered a better adapter from Hughes Precision for $20. I had found a YT vid that talks about the lack of an undercut on the last thread on the factory adapter, and how it can cause some suppressors to not seat properly. The hughes does have the undercut, and a nice fluted thread protector. I'll post that video a little later if I can find it again.

February 13, 2020, 08:47 PM	#61
riffraff Senior Member Join Date: January 21, 2016 Posts: 629	I own 2 SR22s, long and short slides, and bumped the mags all up to 17 w/ the aftermarket kits, they are great, and the M&P is nice too (better trigger, but worse controls and mag capacity)... the new kel tec in .22 looks fun too. Maybe one of both in my future.. and the kel tec pmr30 looks really cool too (in 22wmr).. But the point of a surpressed .22lr escapes me. I mean at the range ears are no problem, occasionall shooting with this caliber simply isn't that painful (if you were hunting or defending yourself somehow).. just no need for it if you ask me, especially not worth it gven the red tape required anyway.

February 13, 2020, 11:15 PM	#63
guitar1580 Senior Member Join Date: December 8, 2009 Posts: 201	@GarandTd, yep, the backward safety on the SR22 is the main thing that steered me away from it. @riffraff, I have tinnitus and other ear conditions from playing in a loud rock band for 20 years. Even with plugs and muffs, it will get flared up after a certain amount of shooting, because your bones will conduct sound and it will still get to your eardrums. The suppressor will allow me to shoot more and for longer. Plus, there are areas near me in the woods where I can plink around, and the suppressor will help keep the neighbors from calling the cops. And, if I need to dispense of errant animals in my back garden, I can do so without the neighbors calling the cops. (although my rifle and CB caps currently work pretty well for that) Every person's situation is different, and the suppressor will be worth every penny & every bit of red tape to me. May end up with one for a .45 at some point. It's only money, and ya can't take it with ya. I'll likely get a couple other .22 models, like the more accurate longer barreled Victory, or one of the Rugers or the Buckmark, and use the same suppressor.

February 14, 2020, 01:10 AM	#64
guitar1580 Senior Member Join Date: December 8, 2009 Posts: 201	Here is Auger Precision Firearms' video that I was talking about. It wouldn't really matter for the can I'm getting, but it is interesting info to know about the thread adapters. The other good thing about the Hughes adapter that I ordered is it accepts a standard open end wrench, 7/16" I believe, eliminating the need for the thin factory pot metal wrench. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CUjYYCq2jiQ The M&P Compact i ordered won't have an adapter, but I suppose the thread protector itself will be a bitch to get loose. If so, I plan on soaking it in my favorite penetrant, Kroil, overnight. It has worked wonders on everything I've used it on.

February 16, 2020, 06:29 PM	#66
wild cat mccane Senior Member Join Date: May 22, 2011 Posts: 3,628	As an aside, I've met few Zamak bashers online who knew the extent of what metal alloys include. Steel is an allow of carbon and iron after all...

February 17, 2020, 03:51 PM	#67
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 18,543	What does it allow?

February 17, 2020, 09:54 PM	#68
wild cat mccane Senior Member Join Date: May 22, 2011 Posts: 3,628	hahah. Alloy. Stainless steel and carbon steel (ss and blue) guns are also alloy metals.

February 18, 2020, 08:50 AM	#69
Jim Watson Senior Member Join Date: October 25, 2001 Location: Alabama Posts: 18,543	I know. Your spell check probably bit you again. There are funny statements about metals on the www.

February 20, 2020, 08:57 AM	#70
Ibmikey Senior Member Join Date: June 1, 2013 Location: Now relocated to Texas Posts: 2,943	Well Guitar, I was going to jump into the middle of this pile of recommendations with suggesting the S&W M&P compact would fit you well, however, you have discovered that wisdom by yourself. I keep my compact, extra magazines and two bricks of ammo in a plastic ammo can sealed with a padlock securing everything,

February 23, 2020, 12:40 AM	#71
NobodyJones Member Join Date: December 21, 2019 Posts: 64	And now for something completely different...Look at the Beretta Neos. My wife wanted one and since it was going to be her pistol I bought her one. While it is kind of weird looking it shoots well and is easy to take down and clean.

March 16, 2020, 05:33 PM	#72
fl_rich Senior Member Join Date: October 27, 2015 Posts: 103	TX22 I recently on impulse bought a Ruger TX22. Almostv100 rounds with my MysticX silencer and its only coughed a time or two. Usually amo was to blame. Rack, smack bang. Actually rack and bang. Bent nose hollowpoints to blame. Only used Winchester range bucket ammo. 1400 rnds for $55 at Walmart. The included barrel to can adaptor is what made me pull the trigger... Shoots very quietly in my back yard. __________________ Many things others should worry about....

March 17, 2020, 03:26 PM	#73
wild cat mccane Senior Member Join Date: May 22, 2011 Posts: 3,628	Congrats on the Walther M&P compact. Post up a pic if you get a chance

March 18, 2020, 10:05 AM	#75
Forte S+W Senior Member Join Date: October 12, 2019 Posts: 819	Yeah, Walther makes the full-size M&P22. __________________ Conspiracy theorists are the greatest political spin-doctors of all time. Only they can make the absolute worst political blunders sound like spectacular feats of ingenuity.