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Old December 16, 2017, 08:48 PM   #1
Stats Shooter
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45-70: 525 gr pile driver load

As I have said in other threads, I have a couple 45-70's. I like to push them. My single shot Handi I load to max trap door pressure of about 28k psi. I load the 1895 GBL to about 40k psi or a 405 gr woodleigh weld core to 1850 fps from an 18.5" barrel.

I just got some beartooth 525 gr pile drivers. Beartooth has some load data on their website listing 3031, 4198, 4895, H322, and RE7. With the 405 weld cores (and before that the speer 400's) I was/am using 58.5 gr H335.

I want 1550-1600 fps from the GBL and 525 pile driver. I was thinking RE7 as it has the best velocity according to beartooth but I'm not sure how it meters. 3031 gets good velocity and its an old standard in the 45-70 for several bullets, especially cast shooters. Maybe I should just use 3031 and quit worrying about it?
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Old December 16, 2017, 09:52 PM   #2
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RE7 is a lot shorter than IMR 3031. With out looking and going by memory, it is near IMR 4198 in granule size. I consider them cousins in burn rate but I always get a little higher velocities with RE7......some of my arms like IMR 4198 and some like RE 7.

I always go with the accurate loading and velocity is what I consider second place.
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Old December 17, 2017, 09:22 PM   #3
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Thanks Dufus,

I'm a bit surprised that I have but one reply in this thread. Anyway, I'm going to call bear tooth tomorrow and see what they say.
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Old December 17, 2017, 11:47 PM   #4
ocharry
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How deep in the case do you have to seat that big bullet to get it to cycle in the lever gun???

And if you get it to cycle.....seems it would use up all the case capacity for a hot load??

I'm just curious... But COL is gona play here I would think....I've always used those big bullets in a single shot

I'm interested in how you are gona get this to work or cycle

I will be watching this post

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Old December 18, 2017, 07:34 AM   #5
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The bullet was designed for lever action 45-70's. Similar to the Garrett load which uses a 540 gr bullet in the lever action rifles. So it cycles fine and works fine.
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Old December 18, 2017, 09:39 AM   #6
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Pushing 45-70s:

I learned the hard way there is no reason to push the envelope on cast 45-70 rounds.

Figured they were like revolver bullets, the harder the lead, and faster the bullet, the better off you are.

Then I take my hard fast lead bullets to a creedmoor match shooting 800-900 and 1000 yards just to find out I was way off base.

You can hear (and so can everyone else on the line) you're bullet tumbling through the air.

As I discovered from taking the advice of people who knew what they are doing, soft lead bullets traveling at the old standard velocity BP loads, are a heck of a lot more accurate.

I have no idea what "pile driver" bullets are, but the most common long range 45-70 bullet is the 535 gr Postell and normally driven between 1200 and 1300 fps.

For hunting there isnt much that bullet wont kill, considering a gazzilian buffalo were killed using the 405-gr 45-70 (which was the Calvary load and actually a 45-55).
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Old December 19, 2017, 12:25 PM   #7
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The expert long range an silhouette shooters advise to load the 525-550 gr match bullets to about 1275 and just let them glide gently through transonic if that's the case.. LOL

I've just recently enter the heavy 545 gr 45-70 BPCR handloading with my 1874 Sharp's and I am just amazed at the accuracy i'm getting (and I looking to PP'ing in the future). I'm realizing BPCR and PP is a true art !
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Old December 21, 2017, 08:52 AM   #8
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That is going to be akin to lobbing a mortar shell. Are you going to have time to triangulate your target? I've just never shot anything bigger than 300 grains when hunting. Can you imagine the arc? Just watch out for low hanging limbs between you and the target.
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Old December 21, 2017, 12:32 PM   #9
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There's a good reason my Montana Vintage Arm's Winchester "B" 5x series scope on my 1874 45-70 Sharps has about 213 moa of available elevation..
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