November 14, 2012, 01:30 AM | #101 | |
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This constable was a big guy too.
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November 14, 2012, 02:12 AM | #102 |
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is 8 rounds enough
yes. make it work.
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November 14, 2012, 10:31 AM | #103 |
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Why 8? My pistol carries 8+1. And my pocket or belt carries 16 more in two convenient 8 round packages. If I had a revolver, I'd carry at least two more convenient packages containing 8(or 5 or 6 or however many fit) packages, plus maybe even some speed strips.
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November 14, 2012, 11:14 AM | #104 |
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Big guy - came up in Insights knife class. Instructor was a little guy. Student was big guy who said he didn't have much to worry about.
Teacher, with training knife, came close and 'stabbed' him in the stomach several times in a second or two. Said you can run into little crazy guys. I worked on a case where a big guy got into an argument with a little old man. The latter took a paring knife (like to peel an apple) and stuck it into big guy's chest. Big guy was hit a magic spot and dropped stone cold dead. Little old man was on drugs. 8 is enough unless you run into 101 Dalmatians or 11 wild African Dogs.
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November 14, 2012, 12:22 PM | #105 |
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If the experts say to keep extra ammo on you for that "in case" moment why not have it already in your gun ready to use and have even more on hand in case?
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November 14, 2012, 12:42 PM | #106 |
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Because that extra ammo will be in a seperate magazine for the odd magazine issue...
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November 14, 2012, 01:30 PM | #107 |
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Speed-Loaders
Personally, I would feel just fine with a couple of speed-loaders (no different than a .45acp with an extra mag).
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November 14, 2012, 01:55 PM | #108 |
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I remember seeing a law enforcement study that said on average it required 2 hits to subdue most humans. In a real life situation most trained professionals would miss their moving target a little more than 60%. So you figure about 6 shots to hit your target the required number of times to subdue or kill. Since most people are not trained professionals nor have they been in real life gun fights odds would say you might need more than 8 especially of there is
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November 14, 2012, 03:22 PM | #109 | |
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8 would not even get some on a moving target. Yes a scary thought but true.
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November 14, 2012, 03:26 PM | #110 | ||
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Originally posted by Nanuk
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Originally posted by Glenn E. Meyer Quote:
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November 14, 2012, 04:37 PM | #111 |
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Didn't Dick Van Patten teach us anything? 8 is always enough!
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November 14, 2012, 06:21 PM | #112 | |
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November 14, 2012, 07:01 PM | #113 |
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Hey! I'm under 40. To get back on topic though, if it's a revolver, I'd have speedloads in a belt pouch and maybe even a couple strips in my pocket. For a semi auto I'd have at least two magazines somewhere... I have a belt mountable magpouch that I stick in a cargo pants pocket rather than stick it on my belt.
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November 14, 2012, 07:07 PM | #114 | |
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November 14, 2012, 07:08 PM | #115 |
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Eight is more than enough to give me peace of mind. I'm even comfortable with six.
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November 15, 2012, 12:26 AM | #116 |
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Enough is enough. Speed loaders or moon clips and some practice, you'll reload just as fast as you would with a magazine fed gun. 8 becomes 16, 16 becomes 24. More than enough. I have the TRR8 and I'm plenty comfortable with it on my nightstand.
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November 15, 2012, 01:10 AM | #117 |
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8 rounds will be enough if the circumstances of the shooting dictate that it will be enough. It's not possible to accurately say more than that.
However, it is possible to point out some things that will have absolutely no effect on whether 8 rounds is enough or not. 1. The shooter's preference in self-defense handguns. Liking revolvers or pocket pistols--even liking them a LOT--won't mean that the amount of ammunition in them is always sufficient to prevail in a self-defense encounter. There's no way what a shooter likes or prefers can possibly dictate the circumstances of a shooting such that it limits the number of rounds required to the number of rounds in the shooter's gun. 2. Whether or not the defender can reload quickly. Not even if the defender can reload as quickly with a revolver as an autopistol. If a reload is required to finish the encounter then 8 rounds was clearly not enough. 3. What gives the defender peace of mind. Being comfortable with the amount of ammo in the gun will have absolutely no effect on the circumstance of the shooting a defender is dealt. I know people who are comfortable with carrying no gun at all. A defender's comfort level won't preclude him from being in a shootout that calls for more rounds than his defense gun holds. 4. What the defender has used to adequately protect himself/herself in the past. There can be no guarantee that the next encounter will be like the last one. 5. Rationalizations provided to justify behavior or decisions already made for other reasons. People are amazingly adept at rationalizing the decisions they've already made or behavior that they've already chosen to engage in. Reasons provided as rationalization for the decision to carry a low-capacity defense handgun will not change the outcome or circumstances of a self-defense encounter. For example: John decides to carry a pocket pistol because it very conveniently fits in his pocket easily and doesn't poke him like a larger pistol carried in an IWB does. His ability to come up with other reasons to justify/rationalize his decision won't have any effect on whether or not the capacity of the pistol will actually be sufficient for the self-defense encounters he will be faced with. I'm sure there are more, but that's a good start.
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November 15, 2012, 02:18 AM | #118 |
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Is 8 enough, 8 well placed bullets will do wonders. What any person that plans on defending themselves with a handgun needs to know how to shot their chosen gun. They need to know how to do a combat reload, they need to know how shot accurately. When a person decides to buy a gun for self defense or home protection they need to get good training. The way to improve your rate of survival is training and planning. I carry a S&W 686+ that 7 rounds of 38+P 125 grain of SJWP plus 2 speed loaders. I practice daily drawing and presenting my pistol, I practice reloading with snap caps I do in the dark or with my eyes closed. I am at the range weekly doing drills, shooting one handed off hand, from behind a barrel, both left and right handed. I shot from the ground, on my back on my sides. I do slow fire, single action and double action shooting, I do rapid fire drills. My father always told me if you want to be good at something you need to put in the time. My back up is a 12 ga. with buck shot.
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November 15, 2012, 02:19 AM | #119 |
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if 8 isn't enough then you need more practice shooting.
edit: here is what i should have wrote: if you can't hit the BG with at least 1 of the 8 rounds without reloading, your best bet is to try doing IIRC figure 8 drills, it is a drill that you can do by moving in a figure 8 pattern between two pieces of "cover", i seen it done in a defensive training video i got from PDN.
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November 15, 2012, 08:50 AM | #120 | |
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Or is it you haven't considered those things? |
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November 15, 2012, 10:35 AM | #121 |
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Good points. Folks have the implicit assumption that ALL gun fights are the single mugger who you wave your gun at and flees. Or, you shoot one shot that is immediately effective.
That might be modal but if you are in the extremes of the incident distribution, as pointed out, OOOOPPPS!
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November 15, 2012, 10:51 AM | #122 |
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Yes, it truly is amazing how the slightest bit of movement can drop the success rates of hitting your target by more than half. You go from hitting all your targets to becoming a bit frustrated instantly. And that us just one change to the environment.
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November 15, 2012, 11:02 AM | #123 | |
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November 15, 2012, 11:08 AM | #124 |
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Some other considerations:
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November 15, 2012, 11:39 AM | #125 |
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Unless it is the gunfight at the OK corral, 8 should be fine.
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