Has Sig Quality Gone Down?

[DanTSX]

Yes, there is a debate about Sig's quality over time.


They have changed production methods, moved production overseas, instituted a global supply chain, diversified well outside of core competencies and expertise with new product lines and created entirely new segments, and have had numerous management changes while trying to profit in a highly competitive and fickle market. Now they have to deal with the problem of the German side having to stop exports to the USA, which is a major problem with their high end X-series and 210 legends as well as some other definitive products that set sig apart from the competition.

Any company that even bites off half of what sig has will have quality control issues. Their success will be determined by how they respond to the issues, as well as how innovative they are being.


I think the General concensus is that Sig's worst days are behind them, but they are still not quite sure what they will be as a manufacturer in 2015, or 2025, but they are certainly more defined than what they were in 2010. The quality control debate will go on for a long time, especially as folks are emotionally invested into what they deem to be the "best" by their standards, regardless of the validity of how they arrived at their conclusions. On the other hand, sig will produce a majority of happy customers regardless of what they do. No matter how good they get, there will be plenty of lemons causing batches of sour grapes just due to Sig's volume of sales.

[JDBerg]

I've had 2 P228's, selling the first was the biggest dumb@$$ move of my life. The second P228 is one of my best guns, and it ain't going nowhere. My P225 is still one of the best shooting subcompact 9mm's I know of, the S&W 3913TSW is the other. I paid $319.00 for it about 7yrs. ago, when nobody wanted these W.German police turn-ins, I have the German language manual for it. My P220 got traded for an HK45 that I think is a better service pistol, but a P227 is definitely in my future. My P226 .40S&W is my remaining .40, it shoots beautifully. My M11-A1 is my other EDC along with my HK P30 V3. I've been very lucky with my SIG pistols!

[Banger357]

Steel frame Sigs like the P226/229/220, P238, etc. have very few problems. When I was selling guns (admittedly, it has been almost 2 years), we had just butt-tons of P250s and P2022s coming back. It got to the point that I hated selling those models. Very rarely did I see any legitimate issues with the steel frame models though. Sig has come out with multiple new polymer models recently that I have not tried or heard a lot of first-hand feedback on, so they may have improved their game a lot. I'm not sure why they do (or did) have such a huge quality difference between the polymer and steel framed options (and I'm not a "plastic gun" hater- I generally prefer polymer framed pistols), but it was really apparent to me as the person responsible for returning all warranty repair issues to the factories.

I would not hesitate to buy a new steel frame Sig because in my personal experience, they are very well made and reliable guns. I would never spend money on one of their polymer guns though- even if they're better now I'm a flawed human and I have trouble getting over the terrible quality I saw in those models before.

[TunnelRat]

Steel frame Sigs like the P226/229/220, P238, etc. have very few problems.

I think you mean aluminum frame, though there are special steel frame variants.

[Skans]

I only own 1 Sig, the Sig X-Five Competition in 9mm. It's the same frame as the level one, but without the adjustable trigger. It was made several years ago, yes made in Germany, and does not have a bottom rail (I don't like bottom rails on pistols)

It is by far the most accurate semi-auto I've ever shot. This is compared to a custom ported STI 2011; various 1911's, a Steyr GB; a Tanfoglio Stock 10mm, Ruger Mark II, Browning Hi-Power, CZ 75B, Glock 17, as well as to revolvers I've owned. There simply is no comparison.

I can't imagine owning a semi-auto that can out perform the Sig X-Five in terms of accuracy. Its simply a dream to shoot.

[Banger357]

Yeah Tunnelrat, you're right, my bad. I got in the habit of saying "steel" just as the alternative to polymer, even when it is an alloy of some sort. It would probably be better to say "metal", but that brings to mind cruddy little pot metal .22 single actions that you can get for $100 and don't have a brand written on them...

[DBnuke]

Sadly I have to say "YES".
First of all I am a very critical person, and I would expect a $1000 sig to be near flawless.
I own a 226 Legion, 239, 938 and a 238. All are GREAT guns.
I decided to add a P225 A1 to my collection and have regretted it since day 1.
The FIRST and only real thing anyone who picks up the gun notices is that it is noisy. It sounds like a babies rattle. The slide cluncks forward and back, side to side.
A call to sig and I was told this is normal. They could pull any gun out of the display case and they all do it. But, it will shoot just fine. That is not okay to me though. I don't want a noisy sloppy gun.None of my other sigs do it, the 225's I looked at in the stores did not do it. None of the numerous handguns I own do it. Heck, I sold a CZ75 DPCR to buy the sig. A choice I am regretting.
After a second call to sig and a short video with volume and they had me send the gun back.
I am still waiting, but expect nothing more than disappointment with their response.

[JDBerg]

This 2015 thread just got resurrected, but I’ve added an M11-A1 and a P239 SAS Gen2 since that time, and I’m very pleased with both. If I had to compare build quality of the new production SIGs vs. the old production SIGs, the old production pistols are probably better, but the new ones are pretty darn good anyway.

You can say the same thing about S&W revolvers, if you have to have a LN pre-lock 686, you have to find one & pay a premium for it. Otherwise a new production 686 isn’t a bad thing to own & shoot!

[Groundhog34]

IMO, which is often wrong, the U.S. made Sigs are not of the same quality as the older W German or Swiss made pistols.

[rodfac]

I've had no reason to gripe about the two I've bought in the last 3 years: P226 Mk25 & a M11A1...great guns, well finished, accurate to < 2" at 25 yds with selected loads, and superbly reliable. As good 9mm's as I've ever owned.

As to customer service: a P290, a used gun when I bought it, with a dark front sight and light firing pin strikes...they fixed both on their dime. A 1911 RCS (the best carry 1911 I"ve ever owned) had a bbl. ramp that extended into the mag well...they fixed that and did a beautiful trigger job on their dime as well. Should they have caught it in the QC examination...yep, but they fixed it pronto. I had both of those guns back in my hands in less than two weeks.

As a company, they make a good/great product, and respond to customer problems in a timely manner. I appreciate that they're US made. I do have a factory nickle German made P220 that's as good as the P226 and M11 but not better....

YMMV, but from my viewpoint, they're as good a company as any, and for the money, they're better than most.

[WVsig]

Sadly it has gotten worse since this thread was first created.

[Siggy-06]

Would I buy a new P229? Sure. Would I buy any of Sig's poly offerings? Nah...

[Lohman446]

If you have to ask... seriously we are having a conversation that even questions Sig’s quality. That in itself speaks to the severity of the drop

[hemiram]

I say yes too, sadly. I never had much love for the stamped slide ones, I was kind of shocked when I found out that was how they were made. It still doesn't really make sense to me. My friend's P226's slide rusts almost daily if not wiped down any time it's picked up. I've had old tools that don't rust nearly as easily.

All my Sigs are and have been the "traditional" P series, a 220, 226, and 229. I sold off the 229 because I decided to get rid of all my .40 S&W guns and go 9mm or .45. My 220 has a German frame, with a US made "solid" slide. My 226 is a US made older ex NYPD gun converted from DAO to DA/SA. I'm not interested in the polymer DAO Sigs at all. I will be buying an all steel P229 or P226 Elite, and probably a 2022 along the way, but the 320 and 365 are like Glocks to me. Something someone else buys for some strange reason.

[Dragline45]

No problems at all with my Sig 226 I purchased new a couple years ago.