Pistol reloading

balyon85 · May 7, 2013, 10:01 PM

I'm sure this is a pretty noob of a question but here it goes. Today I fibally got around to testing five rounds each of powerbond plated, xtremebullets plated hollow points and colorado bullets lead round nose with clays and hp38. All the rounds fired and cycled flawlessly, question is, with pistol loads is there any point to continue working the loads or will the accuracy improvements be unnoticable? Should I just use the data from these loads and start loading up my rounds as they are?

Thanks.

jag2 · May 7, 2013, 10:14 PM

Using published data is always the way to go, what will improve your accuracy is practice. Don't get caught up in the "perfect" load concept, just shoot as much as you can and I guarantee you your accuracy will improve. Nothing wrong with trying something new from time to time (you may have to because of availability) but you're not going to learn anything from five rounds.

Revolver1 · May 7, 2013, 10:19 PM

Use the data. Don't get caught up in the FPS bull! Published loads are plenty, and in some cases too hot for their own good. You're handgunning, if velocity meant that much you'd grab your 30-06 !

jersurf101 · May 7, 2013, 10:24 PM

Sometimes there are combinations that do not work with powders/bulets in a particular gun. I have a .38 special 158 grn lead load that has a noticible lack of accuracy. For the most part my rounds are more accurate than me though. It is obviously bad to go outside of the published loads.

balyon85 · May 7, 2013, 10:25 PM

I'm on the lowest end of hodgdon's site data, so since they ran through, just leave it there and load away? I didn't chrono, so not sure where my fps is.

I did load sone .223 with cfe223, but I was so focused on everything cycling the gun I didn't really check for its accuracy.

Thanks for the advice, I will load 50-100 of the ones I have, probably leave the clays to my clay loads and just use the hp38 for my 9.

Thanks guys.

Misssissippi Dave · May 7, 2013, 11:28 PM

With HP38 I work up to the point they start loosing accuracy. I find this powder does burn cleaner above the minimum levels. I have not found a better load with this powder at the top end of published data. I like to see what works best for my pistols as I work the loads up. I don't go outside of the published data to keep things safe. I also tend to tinker with trying different powders and bullets to get what I'm looking for. Once I find something that works well I do load up a fair amount of it. I do my testing on several different range trips before I start loading a round by the thousands. First I test 5 to 10 of different powder amounts. Then I load 50 of the best loads to check again. I might take my second best load of the first group to test 50 of them as well. Then I load 100 of what I feel is the best and if I like this load better than what I have been using I start to load a lot of them. Your mileage may vary.

dahermit · May 8, 2013, 06:36 AM

Quote:

All the rounds fired and cycled flawlessly, question is, with pistol loads is there any point to continue working the loads or will the accuracy improvements be unnoticable?

Paper will tell. Take your load, shoot five (at least) rounds at a paper target at 25 yards from a seated, bench rest, sandbag support position. Then do it again with five more rounds with .5 or .2 grains more or less powder. You will discover yes, that working up loads is more than getting them to cycle the action and go bang.

mikld · May 9, 2013, 10:53 AM

Quote:

All the rounds fired and cycled flawlessly, question is, with pistol loads is there any point to continue working the loads or will the accuracy improvements be unnoticable? Should I just use the data from these loads and start loading up my rounds as they are?

Yes! Continue. All guns will have their "sweet spot" for loads. A major part of the enjoyment of reloading is that search for the "perfect" load (and you can determine what perfect is. I have one load for my 1911 that will group around 2" at 20 yards and toss all the empties into a 18" circle just to my right)

Record your results so you can always go back to a specific load...

serf 'rett · May 9, 2013, 12:00 PM

If you just like to hear "bang" and the next round is chambered properly, then you can quit now and claim you're reloading.

However, if you want to produce:
1. custom cartridges
2. tuned for a specific firearm
3. with the best accuracy for a particular bullet, case, powder, primer combination
4. suited for a specific purpose (plinking, bullseye, combat shooting sports, hunting, varmint, etc.)

Then you will start loading series and recording and testing and recording and evaluating and recording and loading refined loads for additional testing, verification and evaluation to determine a “good” load, which leads to the production of hundreds or thousands of custom cartridges and the Universe comes into balance (until you get a new pistol/rifle, want to try a new bullet or powder or primer or case or caliber…which restarts the whole process) and you have now entered the world of handloading.

SL1 · May 9, 2013, 07:30 PM

Working-up loads for auto-loading pistols, I start with the "start" load (10% below "max") or perhaps even lower with some data that goes lower.

Then I work-up looking first for reliable cycling/feeding. Then, I start looking at accuracy while I also look at how cleanly the powder is buring. When I get to a load that is reliable, accurate and clean burning, I usually stop the work-up. However, if I am shooting the rounds in some game that requires a minimum "power factor" I will continue the work-up until I reach that power factor or hit the "max" charge.

Sometimes, a particular powder in a particular case and bullet combination will get clean before it gets accurate, and sometimes it will be the other way around. Sometime accuracy will max-out before I hit the required "power factor" and that leads me to either try another powder or at least know what the accuracy is.

Typical "good" accuracy is around 2" 5-shot groups at 25 yards from a rest. I call that perfectly acceptable for games like IDPA. Great accuracy is more like 1" 5-shot groups at 25 yards, which would be better if the loads were intended for bullseye matches and you intend to win. Accuracy can easily be as bad as 3" or 4" at 25 yards with poor handloads. Remember, all of this is while using a rest on a bench. When shooting the matches, your groups will be larger due to shooting off-hand.

SL1

Misssissippi Dave · May 9, 2013, 08:18 PM

All can have a good time loading ammo. I have heard there are reloaders and then there are loaders. The first just reloads to shoot and the second loads for precission. I think most fall some place in between. They start out as re-loaders and progress to becoming loaders.

rlc323 · May 9, 2013, 08:52 PM

I agree there is a lot of enjoyment to be had from the search for the "right" combination of powder brand, charge weight, and bullet weight/type.

Since I have been a trapshooter and shotshell reloader for the past 40 years I have a variety of powder on hand that work well in pistol loads.

I had worked up a few 9mm loads with Red Dot and 700x that seemed to be good. Then I loaded some WSF and the accuracy and clean burn were better right out of the gate than anything I had tried before. So the search continues...

It will be nice to see powder, especially pistol specfic powder such as W231 and Power Pistol become more readily available in the future. I am looking forward to trying them out.

Misssissippi Dave · May 9, 2013, 09:03 PM

When I loaded for skeet I loved 700x. I found I needed to weigh every load to get it to work right in pistol loads. WSF is great for the upper end loads. For ammo to shoot all day long I have yet to find something better than WST without paying double the price per load. For 124 grain jacketed bullets in 9 mm AA5 is quite good. Who knows what I will be using in a few more years. The search goes on.

jokker1978 · May 10, 2013, 09:33 AM

With my .40.
I use titegroup, and hornady XTP bullets the best I have shot was with 4.4 grains.
That is only a little over the starting point. It burns clean and is more accurate than my factory ammo.
I had my girlfriend help me in a blind taste test so to speak. She loaded 4 magazines for me two factory and two with reloads. The reloads grouped consist. And all went bang. I had one white box of Winchester that didn't go bang.

May 7, 2013, 10:01 PM	#1
balyon85 Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2013 Location: Lochbuie, CO Posts: 140	Pistol reloading I'm sure this is a pretty noob of a question but here it goes. Today I fibally got around to testing five rounds each of powerbond plated, xtremebullets plated hollow points and colorado bullets lead round nose with clays and hp38. All the rounds fired and cycled flawlessly, question is, with pistol loads is there any point to continue working the loads or will the accuracy improvements be unnoticable? Should I just use the data from these loads and start loading up my rounds as they are? Thanks.

May 7, 2013, 10:25 PM	#5
balyon85 Senior Member Join Date: February 13, 2013 Location: Lochbuie, CO Posts: 140	Re: Pistol reloading I'm on the lowest end of hodgdon's site data, so since they ran through, just leave it there and load away? I didn't chrono, so not sure where my fps is. I did load sone .223 with cfe223, but I was so focused on everything cycling the gun I didn't really check for its accuracy. Thanks for the advice, I will load 50-100 of the ones I have, probably leave the clays to my clay loads and just use the hp38 for my 9. Thanks guys.

May 9, 2013, 12:00 PM	#9
serf 'rett Senior Member Join Date: June 25, 2009 Location: Stuttgart, AR Posts: 1,569	If you just like to hear "bang" and the next round is chambered properly, then you can quit now and claim you're reloading. However, if you want to produce: 1. custom cartridges 2. tuned for a specific firearm 3. with the best accuracy for a particular bullet, case, powder, primer combination 4. suited for a specific purpose (plinking, bullseye, combat shooting sports, hunting, varmint, etc.) Then you will start loading series and recording and testing and recording and evaluating and recording and loading refined loads for additional testing, verification and evaluation to determine a “good” load, which leads to the production of hundreds or thousands of custom cartridges and the Universe comes into balance (until you get a new pistol/rifle, want to try a new bullet or powder or primer or case or caliber…which restarts the whole process) and you have now entered the world of handloading. __________________ A lack of planning on your part does not necessarily constitute an emergency on my part.

May 7, 2013, 10:14 PM	#2
jag2 Senior Member Join Date: June 30, 2009 Location: dallas Posts: 773	Using published data is always the way to go, what will improve your accuracy is practice. Don't get caught up in the "perfect" load concept, just shoot as much as you can and I guarantee you your accuracy will improve. Nothing wrong with trying something new from time to time (you may have to because of availability) but you're not going to learn anything from five rounds.

May 7, 2013, 10:19 PM	#3
Revolver1 Junior member Join Date: January 21, 2013 Location: NY Posts: 150	Use the data. Don't get caught up in the FPS bull! Published loads are plenty, and in some cases too hot for their own good. You're handgunning, if velocity meant that much you'd grab your 30-06 !

May 7, 2013, 10:24 PM	#4
jersurf101 Senior Member Join Date: January 27, 2013 Location: Eastern NC Posts: 553	Sometimes there are combinations that do not work with powders/bulets in a particular gun. I have a .38 special 158 grn lead load that has a noticible lack of accuracy. For the most part my rounds are more accurate than me though. It is obviously bad to go outside of the published loads.

May 7, 2013, 11:28 PM	#6
Misssissippi Dave Senior Member Join Date: December 5, 2009 Posts: 1,411	With HP38 I work up to the point they start loosing accuracy. I find this powder does burn cleaner above the minimum levels. I have not found a better load with this powder at the top end of published data. I like to see what works best for my pistols as I work the loads up. I don't go outside of the published data to keep things safe. I also tend to tinker with trying different powders and bullets to get what I'm looking for. Once I find something that works well I do load up a fair amount of it. I do my testing on several different range trips before I start loading a round by the thousands. First I test 5 to 10 of different powder amounts. Then I load 50 of the best loads to check again. I might take my second best load of the first group to test 50 of them as well. Then I load 100 of what I feel is the best and if I like this load better than what I have been using I start to load a lot of them. Your mileage may vary.

May 9, 2013, 07:30 PM	#10
SL1 Senior Member Join Date: November 8, 2007 Posts: 2,001	Working-up loads for auto-loading pistols, I start with the "start" load (10% below "max") or perhaps even lower with some data that goes lower. Then I work-up looking first for reliable cycling/feeding. Then, I start looking at accuracy while I also look at how cleanly the powder is buring. When I get to a load that is reliable, accurate and clean burning, I usually stop the work-up. However, if I am shooting the rounds in some game that requires a minimum "power factor" I will continue the work-up until I reach that power factor or hit the "max" charge. Sometimes, a particular powder in a particular case and bullet combination will get clean before it gets accurate, and sometimes it will be the other way around. Sometime accuracy will max-out before I hit the required "power factor" and that leads me to either try another powder or at least know what the accuracy is. Typical "good" accuracy is around 2" 5-shot groups at 25 yards from a rest. I call that perfectly acceptable for games like IDPA. Great accuracy is more like 1" 5-shot groups at 25 yards, which would be better if the loads were intended for bullseye matches and you intend to win. Accuracy can easily be as bad as 3" or 4" at 25 yards with poor handloads. Remember, all of this is while using a rest on a bench. When shooting the matches, your groups will be larger due to shooting off-hand. SL1

May 9, 2013, 08:18 PM	#11
Misssissippi Dave Senior Member Join Date: December 5, 2009 Posts: 1,411	All can have a good time loading ammo. I have heard there are reloaders and then there are loaders. The first just reloads to shoot and the second loads for precission. I think most fall some place in between. They start out as re-loaders and progress to becoming loaders.

May 9, 2013, 08:52 PM	#12
rlc323 Senior Member Join Date: January 23, 2013 Location: Forgottonia, Il Posts: 217	I agree there is a lot of enjoyment to be had from the search for the "right" combination of powder brand, charge weight, and bullet weight/type. Since I have been a trapshooter and shotshell reloader for the past 40 years I have a variety of powder on hand that work well in pistol loads. I had worked up a few 9mm loads with Red Dot and 700x that seemed to be good. Then I loaded some WSF and the accuracy and clean burn were better right out of the gate than anything I had tried before. So the search continues... It will be nice to see powder, especially pistol specfic powder such as W231 and Power Pistol become more readily available in the future. I am looking forward to trying them out.

May 9, 2013, 09:03 PM	#13
Misssissippi Dave Senior Member Join Date: December 5, 2009 Posts: 1,411	When I loaded for skeet I loved 700x. I found I needed to weigh every load to get it to work right in pistol loads. WSF is great for the upper end loads. For ammo to shoot all day long I have yet to find something better than WST without paying double the price per load. For 124 grain jacketed bullets in 9 mm AA5 is quite good. Who knows what I will be using in a few more years. The search goes on.

May 10, 2013, 09:33 AM	#14
jokker1978 Member Join Date: March 8, 2013 Posts: 23	With my .40. I use titegroup, and hornady XTP bullets the best I have shot was with 4.4 grains. That is only a little over the starting point. It burns clean and is more accurate than my factory ammo. I had my girlfriend help me in a blind taste test so to speak. She loaded 4 magazines for me two factory and two with reloads. The reloads grouped consist. And all went bang. I had one white box of Winchester that didn't go bang.