newbie seeks advice on primer pocket cleaning

[Frankly]

Sevens,

As a result of sorting headstamps, have you noted any distinctions?

[Gster]

I clean primer pockets, rifle and pistol. I used to use a Lee primer pocket cleaner and it was a pain. Now I decap before wet tumbling and they are cleaner than ever before without the hassle.

[jaguarxk120]

The Lyman 49th edition of the reloading handbook says "While not absolutely essential, it is advisable to clean primer pockets"

Some clean, some do not clean, it is up to the reloader as to what to do.

[jepp2]

I have cleaned primer pockets for at least 20 years. I know it doesn't improve accuracy or have any other positive impact. About 8 years ago I started uniforming primer pockets. When I uniform it cleans and cuts the bottom of the pocket square and to a uniform depth. I was having some issues with primer failures on handgun brass, and to see if it had any impact on my more accurate rifle brass.

I certainly wouldn't say it is required, but I don't load without uniforming primer pockets. I really like the consistency of seating a new primer in a clean primer pocket that is cut to the same depth. I have the time, and take pride in my loads.

[Sevens]

Sorting handgun brass by headstamp does a few things to benefit me, and I will list only the ones that I am CERTAIN of:

--in the most critical phase of the three totally different dies, sorted headstamps give me extremely consistent feedback in my press handle. That is, the seating & crimping. There is a particular resistance and feel that I recognize (easily) and demand when making my ammo. If you use a myriad of headstamp, expect no consistency here whatsoever.

----subpoint: if you chronograph handloads you can see how much the result is impacted in some rounds when the bullet pull/case mouth tension or simple "grip" on the slug varies. In heavy revolver rounds with slow burning powder, a solid & consistent crimp is paramount

----subpoint: in semi-auto pistol rounds, a pistol is by it's very nature an extremely harsh environment and rounds without solid bullet pull/case mouth tension can lead to unintended/unnoticed bullet setback. The result of bullet setback is a radical pressure spike and can be catastrophic. When you get the feel you look for and demand when seating bullets, you NEVER have the mystery of "sufficient bullet pull?"

--all of THAT removes doubt, inspires confidence in my ammo... easily and consistently contributes to more confident shooting, better results

--all of THAT and a box of 50 rounds that look the same and felt the same during assembly offers simple pride in a job well done, satisfaction, and extreme confidence in the ammo. Makes it easier to focus on the firearm and the shooting-- worrying or evem casually wondering about the ammo is out of the equation.

[Nick_C_S]

you come along and make me feel that I should

I didn't mean to. Primer pocket cleaning is optional. I choose to exercise that option. Others don't.

[Frankly]

Sevens, I made a connection between what you said and my aside from earlier. The foreign brass "feels" different going through the resizer (a whole lot stiffer, and I am still hoping someone will offer a possible reason for the drastic difference). The Rem and Win brass I can't tell apart, but perhaps I will develop a subtler feel for it... I get what you're saying and that's extremely helpful insight. I will go back and sort them and keep them separate as I load. Once I have gotten all the useful life out of the 5-gallon buckets of factory once-fired brass in my garage, I will likely stick with one make and it won't matter. Meanwhile... thanks!

[Frankly]

Nick,

You and someone else spoke of wet tumbling, which I hadn't heard of. Sounds like this method cleans the pocket whether you like it or not.

Unfortunately I already invested in a traditional tumbler. I did one thing smart though. Instead of getting ripped off buying "tumbling media" at a premium, I went to Petsmart and bought a bulk sized bag of walnut shell that is sold for lining bird cages. The manager there just happens to be a reloader himself and told me it was identical to the stuff packaged as "tumbler media" but at a fraction of the cost...

Maybe when I have used all that up...

[Shootest]

You might want to check out wet tumbling even if you don’t start using it right away. Cleanest brass I have ever seen. It’s on sale right now but out of stock.



http://www.midwayusa.com/product/713...y-case-tumbler

[Nick_C_S]

Unfortunately I already invested in a traditional tumbler.

I use my vibratory tumbler regularly still. We all have our own way of doing things, but I'll try to briefly explain my process:

When I get home from the range, the brass takes a trip in the vibratory tumbler in corn cob. This gets the "range crud" off so I can run them through my dies without worry.

After I decap/resize, and mouth flair, they then get an excursion in the Frankford Arsenal wet tumbler with SS pins. This process gets the inside clean, as well as the primer pockets. It's amazing how much crud gets suspended in the liquid.

After an air dry on an old towel (using old towels absorb better and maintains domestic tranquility with the wife ) here in dry California for a couple days; they're then ready for loading.

I like my process. It's more handling than some care to endure. But through trial and error, this is a process with which I'm comfortable. I really like loading with brass that looks near-new. Makes me happy. Looks good out at the range too.

[Frankly]

Nick, yea I was wondering about the ramifications of putting the brass through a resizing-decapping die before wet tumbling, so I dug a little deeper and found the Lee universal decapping die. I was thinking I could buy one of these and set it up on its own turret, do all the decapping as my first step (the brass doesn't need to be clean because there's no resizer involved) and I would remove the decapping pins from all my Lee resizing-decapping dies so as to not risk setting off any live primers when I get down to auto-indexed loading. This would eliminate the pre-cleaning step you describe. Your thoughts?

[Frankly]

Shootest, I might just pull the trigger on one at that price. I could either adopt Nick's 2-stage cleaning method or put the dry tumbler up for sale...Thanks for the tip.

[McCarthy]

I clean the pockets (tumbling with SS pins) because I might have OCD, I'm a perfectionist, I like shiny brass, I reload in the house and I like to keep it clean. I also use a vibratory tumbler for the final finish.

[Nick_C_S]

. . . ^^ Those are almost too pretty to shoot. ^^

Almost.

[Nick_C_S]

putting the brass through a resizing-decapping die before wet tumbling, . . . do all the decapping as my first step

I viable approach, yes.

I tried it. Got my universal decapping die (RCBS) - sends the primers flying everywhere. Too messy for me. The primer catcher that came with my press, stands no chance at catching these flying projectiles. None at all. Not even if I try to cup my hands around it. Oh well, it's still nice to have a UDCD on hand for general purposes. I've used it for other things since then.

Once my brass is wet tumbled, I don't like to tarnish them with my hand oils, and so I wear gloves for the loading process (reduces lead exposure too). Tumbling them first means wearing gloves during the resize and flair processes too. (I'm on a single stage, btw.)

Also, since I SS pin tumble after reconditioning my brass, I go ahead and use lube for the resize - which I really like (my dies are carbide). The SS pin tumble washes off the lube. If I tumbled first, I would not be able to lube - at least, not without having to deal with getting it off.

So that's why I don't do it that way. For me, it isn't the best way to go.

[WVMountaineer]

I do. Because I have experienced misfires when the pockets weren't cleaned. It is, in my opinion, necessity if you prime with a hand press, it makes it much easier to seat them well if they are clean. Hence, no misfires

I don't do it for accuracy, or to feel good. I do it because 4 of my first 100, 44 mag that I did without cleaning them, didn't go BANG. I'm tickled I only loaded 100. And they were stubborn getting the ram to bottom out when hand priming them. The misfires prove that some didn't. I have since shot that box of large pistol primers and never had a another misfire. I reckon we can all speculate that my conclusion isn't scientific. But, it is proof enough for me. God Bless

[jmorris]

Five rounds? That'll do it.

Look at the photo in the OP, mixed headstamp 44 mag brass, sorting at least by head stamp will make a lot more difference than any amount of cleaning in a primer pocket. So yeah 5 rounds is more than enough, the op can load as many as he thinks he needs to realize he is waisting his time.

[Frankly]

Seems most think cleaning the pocket is a waste of time, while a few either think it is important or are just OCD about how clean their brass looks.

From all the discussion, I've arrived at the conclusion that I can have my cake and eat it too.

I went ahead and back-ordered one of those wet tumblers that gets your brass clean enough to drink outta...

I also ordered a Lee universal decapper and a dedicated turret to mount it on.

When all this arrives, I intend to remove the decapping pins from all my resizing dies and make decapping with the universal my first step in prepping used brass.

From what I have heard here, the wet tumbler will clean even the primer pocket whether it needs it or not. So I will never have to go through the tedium of doing it by hand. And my brass will be cleaner for easier inspection. Seems no downside and no additional labor.

Win-win, right?

Anyone wanna buy a slightly used dry tumbler?

(And yes, I will go back and sort by headstamp.)

Thanks again to all for the great feedback.

Best,
Frankly

[snuffy]

One thing, (I didn't read the last 30 or so posts), I want to warn about. With those stainless pin tumblers, the result is CLEAN BRASS. Did I say clean? That results in the need to lube the cases more than if tumbled in dry media.

Handgun--,,straight walled, brass will result in more effort required to size the cases. Most are spritzing with a liquid case lube, even though you are using carbide dies. Excessive force to size can cause the brass to shorten.

Bottle necked brass will cause trouble if you DON'T lube the inside of the neck. Now you have the really CLEAN brass with lube inside the neck, your next question will be "how do I deal with that nasty lube inside the neck, will it contaminate my primers/powder?"

One solution to a non-problem causes other problems. Welcome to the reloading art!

[Frankly]

Snuffy,

Just when I thought this thread had played out...

When I dumped everything out of the reloading kit box and found this, I thought someone stuck a tube of toothpaste in by mistake and was gonna chuck it...

Do I really have to lube my brass?

I had read in the books (I thought) that you didn't have to if you had carbide dies... is it time to start a new thread, or can we cover this one quick and easy?

[condor bravo]

Yes definitely lube if you are doing rifle brass. Probably not many will recommend lubing for handgun brass.

[cw308]

I go with jepp2, I uniform my primer pockets every time, cleans & cuts them to a proper depth. Never had a problem priming.

[polyphemus]

I don't do it for accuracy, or to feel good. I do it because 4 of my first 100, 44 mag that I did without cleaning them, didn't go BANG

I had a similar experience man and now I clean them pockets too,the result is no more of that nonsense.I tried all kinds of tools for that,the little brush worked best but it wore out in a hurry so now I make my own and that works even better and it's free.

[Sevens]

Wet tumbling: your stuff will be cleaner and shinier and your primer pockets will be clean. Down side? Yes! The brass you pull out of there will be WET and let's not forget that you are adding not only a step by decapping all of these first-- but it's a grungy, dirty step because none of it has been cleaned yet. I have no desire to deal with that... obviously, others don't mind it. If those downsides are not dealbreakers, then you should be good to go.

Dealing with the wet, ensuring that it is 100% dry, and handling all of the dirty stuff for decapping (decapping and pocket cleaning that I have proven to myself to not need), all of that adds up quite easily for me.

But I still default to what I said clearly in a post up above--

If your process gives you pride & confidence in your ammo, it will benefit you greatly and amongst other positives -- your shooting will improve. That makes it worth it if it works for you.

[hounddogman]

Mine get cleaned when I tumble my cases, which is after I fire them 5 or 6 times, like I told a friend at the range it's to tell my dirty cases are mine next all the clean factory brass on the floor