More Rumors of a New Military Cartridge

[ed308]

More Rumors of a new military cartridge chambered in 6.8 magnum, whatever that is....

http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2...-magnum-round/

[Double Naught Spy]

Here we go again. Sheesh. Every few months, a new military cartridge. I will believe it when they start changing out guns.

[T. O'Heir]

TFB is not any kind of spokesman for anybody's military. The picture looks like a drawing from a computer game Beta.

[MarkCO]

Originally Posted by T. O'Heir

TFB is not any kind of spokesman for anybody's military. The picture looks like a drawing from a computer game Beta.

Correct, and they have to stir to pot to keep readers engaged. The more clicks they get, the more reposts they get, the more they will put out this kind of drivel.

[Pops1085]

I'm sorry but TFB has really gone downhill at this point. I used to check in daily on their page... but as of late it seems like it's just one dude on there speculating AND WHINING about the militaries buisness without a actual clue as to what is going on like your typical armchair quarterback. It would seem to me that they've gone the way of CNN and other "news" sources... Big BREAKING headlines for articles with no real substance.

They need to hire some new writers and for gods sake get rid of some of their Youtube personalities... James is the only one left that I even tune in for... Everybody else seems to be the most anti-social, awkward people I've ever seen. Seems like mismanagement to me.

Sorry, I've just been feeling this way for a while and it is disheartening because they were my go-to time killer at work haha.

[agtman]

Rumors of a new military cartridge chambered in 6.8 magnum

...

Isn't that what a .308 is?

[ed308]

Who knows. Could be the 270USA.

[rickyrick]

Man, to think of all those things in popular science and popular mechanics magazines that never came to light... this is the same thing.

[TracerTesterman]

A decade ago it was the 6.5 Grendel, now it's the 6.5 Creedmore... and whatever the hell this cartridge is.

The 6.5 Creedmore is really taking off though, I ALMOST gave in on my last rifle purchase. But resisted and stuck with a .308.

[hdwhit]

ed308 wrote:
More Rumors of a new military cartridge chambered in 6.8 magnum, whatever that is....

There will be a near-endless stream of such rumors for the foreseeable future. As I have posted elsewhere, back when I was a graduate student in the early 1980's, I participated in a study on behalf of the DoD for which one of my professors was the principal investigator. It was looking at a replacement for the 5.56x45. Our project did computations seeking to optimize a number of different factors. We came up with a specification for a cartridge with unique case and head diameter firing a 100 grain bullet at about 2600 fps. There were doubtless other teams across the country at the time being asked to optimize for different sets of factors.

The project to find a replacement for 5.56x45 is still going on. And as various candidate systems emerge, they are subjected to limited tests. And with both the military press and gun press hungry for information about an area that has been largely stagnant since Vietnam, each is featured on the cover with the question of whether this is the new round.

If you're a betting man, you would put your money on "No".

The military wants caseless or polymer cased ammunition for both the weight savings but also to reduce the need for copper and zinc. It will settle for a brass case round if those other development efforts fail to turn up something workable, but right now everything that comes out and gets a limited field trial should be regarded as a design study and not the next big thing.

[5whiskey]

To change caliber is a HUGE undertaking in the military. The logistics involved is frightening. The military will likely not adopt a new caliber until they look at adopting a new weapon system altogether. Changing barrels/bolts/magazines/ammo contracts, all while convincing other NATO countries of the need to do so, is no small task. To undertake this task, it will take more than an extra 150 ft/lbs of energy and rounds capable of an extra 200-300 yards effective range (area already covered by 7.62).

I'm with hdwhit. I think we have the m4 and 5.56 until a fairly radical innovation comes about. Like case-less ammo.

[globemaster3]

A few months ago the Army ended its official search for a new battle rifle, opting not to choose any candidate and just stick with what they have.

http://www.businessinsider.com/the-a...l-rifle-2017-9

I think this is either latent info or fabricated. I've not seen any announcement in any official military venue of the reopening of competition, or even consideration, of a new rifle system.

[ed308]

The article you referenced is for scrapping the 7.62 mm Interim Combat Service Rifle. My take on that was that it was a stop gap until they could develop something better. I think the search for a new battle rifle hasn't ended, only the Interim Combat Service Rifle program.

[TracerTesterman]

They could stick with the M16 platform if they wanted and just change calibers. That would reduce a lot of the headache from changing over, especially in the weapons training aspect.

Ultimately, I think it comes down to tactics.

Fire and Maneuver is the name of the game now, which means a LOT of covering fire and ammo expenditure. Dropping from 30 round mags of 5.56 to 20 round mags of .308 or 6.5 goes against our current tactics. The ammo load out/or weight carried would change significantly.

Here's a nice little 'chart', where I took the weight differences that I quote below.
http://www.survivalistboards.com/showthread.php?t=159381

.223/5.56X45
(milsurp) British Radway Green SS109 63gr
Rounds per pound: 37.21
Weight per 100 rounds (lbs): 2.69

.308 Winchester
Remington UMC 150gr FMJ
Rounds per pound: 19.05
Weight per 100 rounds (lbs): 5.25

If I recall correctly, the standard loadout in the Marine Corps is 180 rounds. (Maybe it's 120? I can't recall - been out to long)

So we would be going from 6 magazines to 9, and almost doubling the weight we carry in ammo if we keep the same loadout. Figure on double mag pouches, and you're trying to find somewhere on your flak to attach 1 to 2 more pouches. And there ain't much room as it is.

And then maybe their is some discussion of the 'wound over kill' concept, that wounding hurts an enemy force more than deaths. (Which is of piss poor comfort to the Soldiers/Marines the wounded enemy are still trying to kill)

Just some thoughts.

[hdwhit]

globemaster3 wrote:
A few months ago the Army ended its official search for a new battle rifle...

The article you cite to for authority for your statement has nothing do with the efforts to replace the 5.56x45 cartridge. That article had to do with the so-called "Interim Combat Service Rifle" (ICSR).

Moreover the very article you link to cites the Army Times as saying:

"While the Army is working on an ammunition-and-rifle combo between 5.56 mm and 7.62 mm caliber to replace the M4/M16 rifle platform, the ICSR will no longer be sought to stand in while that long-term plan goes on."

[globemaster3]

Hmmm, I'll have to dig a little more. Maybe I am confusing that with this.

[Model12Win]

Should be an awesome tactical assault weapons system platform system game changer overmatch cartridge unit.

Bruh.