Adding a press, A,B or C

[kmw1954]

looking for thoughts on adding one of these three presses to the bench, so this is about press A,B or C so please no D.

Right now I use a 3 station press and need/want a 4th station to add a FCD for my 45acp. At this point I'm just tired of loading these 45acp in my 3 hole press and then having to run them all again thru another press to crimp them.

My budget is $125.00 and these are the choices I'm looking at. The new 2010 model Lee Value turret press, the new one w/o the Red base, $86.00.. The New Lee Breech Lock Pro with a 45acp shellplate, $125.00.. Or I've been seeing a few used old Dillon 450 presses on ebay recently.

Which ever press it is it will most likely be set up and dedicated to just the 45acp to allow using the FCD. The volume for this is only about 1500/2000 round per year depending on how much the wife shoots.

I understand a bare Dillon 450 may be a bit more than the $125.50 I'm looking to spend so I'm trying to understand why I should spend more for a press that really will not do any more than the other two.

[dallasb]

Originally Posted by kmw1954

looking for thoughts on adding one of these three presses to the bench, so this is about press A,B or C so please no D.

Right now I use a 3 station press and need/want a 4th station to add a FCD for my 45acp. At this point I'm just tired of loading these 45acp in my 3 hole press and then having to run them all again thru another press to crimp them.

My budget is $125.00 and these are the choices I'm looking at. The new 2010 model Lee Value turret press, the new one w/o the Red base, $86.00.. The New Lee Breech Lock Pro with a 45acp shellplate, $125.00.. Or I've been seeing a few used old Dillon 450 presses on ebay recently.

Which ever press it is it will most likely be set up and dedicated to just the 45acp to allow using the FCD. The volume for this is only about 1500/2000 round per year depending on how much the wife shoots.

I understand a bare Dillon 450 may be a bit more than the $125.50 I'm looking to spend so I'm trying to understand why I should spend more for a press that really will not do any more than the other two.

Have you looked into crimping and seating in the same die?

For an inexpensive press the lee classic are pretty good. I run mostly dillon presses now but have a 3 hole turret that I use periodically.

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

[Aguila Blanca]

I've been using an original-style 4-hole Lee Turret Press (not the newer one, the one that has the "red base," as you call it) ever since I started reloading. It does everything I need and I have been very happy with it. I use it with a Lee Autodisk powder measure. So far, I only load for handgun (mostly .45 ACP, 9mm, and a bit of .44 Colt).

The new Breechlock Pro is so new that IMHO it doesn't have a track record. There's a discussion forum devoted to Lee products ( http://forums.loadmastervideos.com/f...0b9c32fef9cb70 ). This press is so new that there has been virtually no discussion on it. Opinions seem to be mixed. I looked at it and I wasn't impressed.

How much and how often do you load? I've seen people claiming 100 rounds per hour with the Turret Press. Personally, I think that's optimistic, but maybe I'm a slow-poke.

[mikld]

If I were in your situation, I would get the Lee turret and toss the FCD...

[kmw1954]

Normally I do use just 3 dies and do just fine. Have one pistol that if I do not finish with the FCD it will not reliably chamber. Hench the need for the 4th die position.

90% of what I load is done on a Lee Pro 1000 the rest is done on a Lee 3 hole Value press. The Lee FCD has been installed into an old RCBS JR. press and doing this in two steps has gotten old fast.

[hounddawg]

by the time you add a shellplate on the Dillon you would be over budget so that leaves the Lees. I like the classic

[kmw1954]

Either one of the Lee's or the 450 Dillon I figure I can use all the dies and powder measures that I already have. Adding the Dillon shellplate is the only real other expense besides the press.

Just seen one of the Dillon's I was watching just closed at $150.00 plus shipping. Also had the wrong shell plate.

Best I can tell the biggest difference between the 2 Lee's is that the Pro should be about 4X faster than the turret. Otherwise I see no real difference. Again I'm trying to decide if the extra speed is worth the extra $40.00 for the amount that I will be using it. Again I will most likely only be loading 100/200 per month.

[RC20]

Have you looked into crimping and seating in the same die?

I started out that way, a lot of futzing to get it right and mangled shells.

4 die makes it so much better I would not do 3 again unless someone held a press to my head.

[T. O'Heir]

The FCD doesn't really do anything a regular crimp die won't. However, "I want one." is a reason. Which press doesn't make much difference either though.
Which press you have now matters a bit. Lee sells a 4-Hole Turret for their 4-Hole Turret Press and Classic Turret Press. Doesn't work with their old 3 Hole Turret though. Their Value Turret is probably your best bet. E-Bay, of course, gives money to the people who want to take your firearms away from you.
"...a lot of futzing to get it right and mangled shells..." You were doing something terribly wrong.

[lordmorgul]

I’m a fan of the FCD in all pistol reloads but I BARELY touch it, using it more for a case mouth chamfer than anything.

The Lee 4-hole turret is your answer. Will allow you to then use other press for dedicated rifle work or whatever else.

Unless you really want a single press like the breechlock to use for a little better seating accuracy and consistency for rifles, then get that for dual purpose. But for only pistol, the turret runs great and does good enough consistency.


Andrew - Lancaster, CA
NRA Life Member, Calguns.net contributor, CGF / SAF / CRPA / FPC / USCCA member

[lordmorgul]

Originally Posted by RC20

I started out that way, a lot of futzing to get it right and mangled shells.

4 die makes it so much better I would not do 3 again unless someone held a press to my head.

I found the same thing true, maybe we both suck at die adjustment, don’t know, but it’s so much easier to just use slight FCD and no crimp in the combo seating for.


Andrew - Lancaster, CA
NRA Life Member, Calguns.net contributor, CGF / SAF / CRPA / FPC / USCCA member

[kmw1954]

T. O'Heir I have to disagree because I'm at that spot. Normally I would agree as I load 380, 9mm and was loading 45acp with just 3 dies and not having a bit of trouble until I added in a Tanfoglio Witness in 45acp.

I fought that gun for a month trying everything I could think of and everything everyone on these forums suggested. Would still have problems with the rounds not fully chambering, not fully going into battery, light primer strikes with failure to fire, and even ejection problems. Though I would experience none of this when these same loads were fired in another pistol.

A couple different people that also reload for a Witness tried to tell me to use the FCD but I resisted and fought with this. Finally a Friend who is also a Mod on the CZ forum also told me to try the FCD and I listened to him. Ran the remainder of what I had already loaded and some new loads thru the FCD and surprise, surprise, not a single malfunction.

So you can say what ever you want but to me this proved differently. The FCD does in fact work and makes a difference. At least it did in this gun!

BTW everything other than the 45acp still gets loaded with only 3 dies.

[Unclenick]

I'm a little confused. If you go from a progressive to the turret, you'll have twice as many handle-pulls as you do now to knock out the same amount of ammo, including your crimping as a separate step. You save having to move the case in and out of the shell holder, but that's all. Are you sure that's getting you ahead? The Dillon 450 is progressive, but the powder throw on that version is manual on my Dad's copy, so you have to add that stroke plus manual indexing to the work, but at least it is progressive and will give you a round at the end of each handle stroke.

Other thoughts:

Do you know someone with a Dillon press that runs 45 Auto? If so, can you get them to let you load a few on it and see if they still need the Lee CFCD die to feed? The reason I'm asking is that Dillon's dies, being designed for progressive loading, are on the tight side to be to be able to make any cases work, including the springy, thin-mouthed R-P 45 Auto brass that my other dies don't like. So the question is if you resized more tightly to begin with, would your feed issue clear up? I did spot a Dillon 45 Auto die currently on eBay. If the CFCD is narrowing the brass below the bullet, this might solve the problem.

Or is the CFCD sizing the brass down over the bullet? If that's the case, a bullet 0.001" smaller might work out. Also, using the aforementioned skinny mouthed R-P cases might solve it, too. Just throwing out ideas here.

[kmw1954]

Unclenick let's see if I can unconfused you.

Currently am using a Lee Pro 1000 which I do most of my loading on and also use a Lee 3 hole Value Turret press. Yes the Pro is much faster than the turret. Both use only 3 dies. As a matter of fact I switch the turrets back and forth between the two presses.

As stated I need a fourth position to install the FCD or use another press with the FCD. The latter ads motions and steps.

The three presses I list all have four positions for four dies. The 450 is a progressive with manual advance as you know. The Lee Breech Lock Pro is also a progressive with auto advance though it uses a manual priming system. So like the Dillon it will turn out 1 round with each pull of the handle. The Value Turret is just what it says. A 4 hole auto advance turret press that requires 4 pulls to finish 1 round. So in theory as I mentioned the Breech Lock should be 4X faster than the turret press.

As to your question about the dies. No I do not know anyone with a Dillon press to compare against. I do believe the FCD is sizing the case somewhat but not sizing it down the best I can measure. I do believe it is making the case more true but I do not have a dial gauge to check run out.

I have been using 45 that are .451" and Berry's 45 at .452" and see no difference at all in chambering. Also all factory loads that I've tried in this gun have run flawlessly.

[Don P]

Used Dillon is my choice

[kmw1954]

A friend just sent me a link to these videos on the Lee Value Press and the New Breech Lock Pro. I found them interesting and well done. Hope this helps someone besides me!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OKNDpzzoE0s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f2oTBdkoNJk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bS_4D48yQeo

[J.G. Terry]

Lee Classic and Dillon 450. This is about rebuilding and using presses. I had converted and old style Classic turret to the new four die press. Parts came from Lee. I didn't want to toss the dilapidated Classic so it was the rebuild. The short fall of this arrangement was loading long cast bullets into 308 would not work with the auto-index. Rounds were too long for what I was doing. Removed indexing gear and it all worked fine. Suggestion: Buy the most recent models. It's a dis-economy to rebuild a Lee. Check rebuild cost against cost for new.

Many years ago I rebuilt a Dillon 450 to 550 specs. Go after a used 550. The 450 primer feed was also hand operated. The 450 does not have the changeable tool head plus bunch of other stuff. I have used successfully the rebuilt Dillon press. These things are hard to beat. Suggestion: take a good look at the 550 new or used. A change over to a 550 spec is a dis-economy.

[Aguila Blanca]

Originally Posted by kmw1954

Best I can tell the biggest difference between the 2 Lee's is that the Pro should be about 4X faster than the turret. Otherwise I see no real difference. Again I'm trying to decide if the extra speed is worth the extra $40.00 for the amount that I will be using it. Again I will most likely only be loading 100/200 per month.

The early reviews I have seen ALL complain that the new Lee whatchamacallit is not a true progressive, only a sort of "semi-progressive," and that it uses a LOT of plastic parts. On the basis of what I have read so far, I have completely eliminated it from consideration.

You might be able to pick up a used Loadmaster for your budget. The Loadmaster gives you up to five stations (5-hole turrets), is a true progressive, and is all metal construction.

It's a shame that Lee hasn't updated the Pro 1000 to use the 4-hole turrets from the Turret Press.

[Aguila Blanca]

Originally Posted by J.G. Terry

I had converted and old style Classic turret to the new four die press.

I think what you converted was an old style, original Turret Press. The Classic Turret Press was only introduced as a 4-hole machine, and it has a low, cast iron base that doesn't look anything like the Pro 1000. The Pro 1000 and the style 3- and 4-hole Turret Presses share the same cast aluminum base.

[jmorris]

You said no D then mentioned them anyway.

If you just don’t want one don’t buy one but a used Dillon 450 would be my pick as well, over your other choices.

[kmw1954]

jmorris please explain just where it is that I added a "D" into this mix?

I see someone else added a Loadmaster or a 550 and now I would accept either if those people can supply one for my budget range of $125.00 I would be more than happy to switch. Also do not have any idea where this rebuilding came from.

[Don Fischer]

Don't know what dies your using but I believe most seating dies have a crimp in them. Just need to adjust the dies right. I have old Lyman 32 long, same in 32ACP, RCBS 38 Spec and lee 9mm dies. Set right they all crimp!

[kmw1954]

Don you see or I guess you don't see, the problem was not with the crimp but with the finish sizing that made the difference. The problem was with just one gun in particular.

[Real Gun]

I have the same issues with 45 ACP but need 5 holes to do it. I am still using a 4 hole press and using an FCD on a single stage. Works great on the turret, but yes, I should bother to change the setup on my Hornady LnL AP with 5 stations. The main problem I had was bullets larger than they were supposed to be, so I have yet another step of resizing purchased bullets. The finished cartridges might work in the gun okay, certainly the revolver, but I require all of my ammo to pass a cartridge gauge, checking every round. Any gun that needs tailored ammo gets sold.


p.s. all of my fired brass is run through a Bulge Buster, so ballooned cases are never the issue with failing a gauge check.

[Aguila Blanca]

Originally Posted by kmw1954

I see someone else added a Loadmaster or a 550 and now I would accept either if those people can supply one for my budget range of $125.00 I would be more than happy to switch. Also do not have any idea where this rebuilding came from.

Mea culpa. I sort of forgot that you specified A, B, or C but no D. I mentioned Loadmaster because I've seen used one for sale in the $150 range from time to time. I just don't view this new Lee so-called progressive press as being worth taking a chance on yet. It may tirn out to be a great machine, but so far I haven't seen a single positive review of it. (And, to be honest, I haven't seen many negative reviews, either. It's like nobody even wants to try it out and do a write-up.)